AIBU to assume an almost 12-year-old no longer believes in Santa?

You'd expect that to be what happened but I always remember a lovely post from a Y7 Form teacher who absolutely loved her class because one girl, who did have mild learning difficulties told the class what she had asked Santa to bring her, the teacher was then on edge just waiting for some smarty pants kid to make a mocking remark, and no body did.. all 29 other kids let the comment go. Kids CAN be kind but you don't hear of it much on mumsnet.

This is an excellent and easily-overlooked point, actually. If a 12yo believes that Santa has brought presents - even if she's only told that certain ones from her parents were from Santa - why on earth will she think to thank the people who actually bought and gave them?

Learning basic gratitude and remembering to always thank people who have been kind to you is an important lesson, which she absolutely should have learned by now.

My ND kids would say they believe as it's tradition and routine but really they know it's pretend and know not to go into my locked present cupboard etc. Youngest is 11 now and didn't want to see Santa at Christmas as she said she was too grown up so I think the magic only survives in the house. I wouldn't like someone to say it outright to her though.

Yes, I agree. It's one thing to have a little magical fairy tale for little ones; but far from getting angry at somebody telling your (NT, no SEN) 12yo the truth, you should feel contrite that you have been remiss in this one area in bringing them up normally to the extent that another adult has had to do it for you.

In a way, it's almost like being angry at schools for teaching your child how to brush their teeth and making sure that they do - when they never would have had to if you'd taught them at an appropriate age yourself.

Did you confirm it? Mine asked me to confirm aged 10 and said he wanted the truth so I gave it. He also got a bit upset but I didn’t backtrack. I didn’t want to lie (further) when he had explicitly asked for the truth

When do you stop, though? If a 17yo (still technically a child) still believes in Santa, how could you guarantee that an 18yo wouldn't; or a 30yo, or a 60yo?

Is the girl home educated?
Does she not mix with other children her age?

Same!
Or just very naive. You’ve probably done her a favour amongst her peers.

I was a child in the 60's and all my peer group knew by the age of around 7. It would've been unthinkable (and actually questionable) if someone of 12 still believed in Santa and/or the tooth fairy. A lot of parents these days seem determined to infantalise their kids, mostly I believe for their own benefit. It's actually a form of control.

I agree. It would be a sign to me that the child has some kind of neurodiversity or learning disabilities. With what I know of my children's peers growing up, almost all children have stopped believing by eight at the latest, even if they 'play along' with their parents for another year or two.

YANBU, OP.

If a child in secondary school doesn’t know then it’s time for a helpful adult to tell them the truth imo before their friends realise and absolutely rip the piss out of them forever after.

Out of interest at what age would you say you can talk freely about things like this. So if not 12 - 14? 17? 21?

I'm not surprised she's angry
I would be too

(And yes I know this is a very unpopular opinion on here!)

I don’t think (m)any NT children really, truly believe beyond about the age of 8 or 9. A lot go along with it though because they enjoy the magic, think its what their parents want to hear or have some misguided idea that they won’t get a stocking or will get less presents if they let on (if they see that there’s a disparity between what the adults in the family get vs. the kids). I know for a fact DD9 hasn’t believed since she was about 5 but every year she carries on like she does because she enjoys getting involved with her younger sibling and being part of all the associated traditions. She also has a friend the same age who was making comments that suggested he was questioning it when he was about 7, he’s a very bright boy and I’d be shocked if he hadn’t figured it by now, but if you asked his mum she’d say he still properly believes…

My youngest is this age. She does not believe. But I would not be happy if someone took it upon themselves to directly say "santa is not real", because in our family, it's never been admitted. We just don't verbalise it. I know she knows he's not real, I know she knows I know she knows he's not real, but we (and her older sibling) have this unspoken thing that it's just not directly admitted. That's OUR way, our magic, and not yours to shit upon.

DO NOT DISCUSS SANTA with other people's kids UNTIL AND UNLESS the parent has directly talked about Santa not being real themselves in front of the child. I am in my 50s and my mother has still not ever said "Santa is not real" to me. I like that!

To be honest, if a kid still believed in Father Christmas at the age of 12, I'd be a bit concerned about their intellect.

My son is 12 next week and I don’t think he’s fully out of believing. He asks me sometimes to confirm Santa isn’t real but then if I do he gets a bit upset. He’s very young for his age and is ND so I think it’s all a bit confusing to him. I just never assume a child doesn’t believe tbh. I don’t think you’ve really done anything wrong though, the mum needs to chill.

My mum got very upset when I stopped believing so I pretended for her sake. We still do each other stockings and we’re 45 and 77!

So she may be pretending for her mum.

Mine all “know” but they play the game and it’s an unsaid thing. My 17 year old wrote a note last Christmas. My twins’ English teacher was talking about Father Christmas not being real last December and the whole class told her she was clearly on the naughty list and they said she was wrong - they’re 14 so had fun with that.

No you can't assume. My step daughter had to be explicitly told aged 11. She also realised aged 11 - because we assumed she knew and made no effort to hide it - that the Easter bunny isn't real, and she cried. So don't take anything for granted.

How can a 12 year old believe in the tooth fairy just doesn’t make sense. Surely she knows that people buy her presents or maybe she has never been told to thank people for presents they have given her.

I’d say she definitely knows, and SIL is delusional.

If she had younger siblings, I’d say maybe not, if the parents made a big effort with the younger children.

Both my DS (10 and 12) know that Santa isn't real. But by not saying it out loud they can still pretend that it is real and enjoy the fun. I asked older DS if he still wanted to hang up his stocking and he most definitely did.