Page 12 | To be fed up of hearing 'just get on with it'?

glitterpaperchain · 2026-06-24T15:48:23+00:00

This kind of 'just get on with it' RE the heat is all over Facebook. People talking about the heat in 1976 and saying 'we just got on with it' or 'we muddled through' (as if people didn't die as a result of that heatwave) My issue is - shouldn't we as a society be aiming higher than just getting on with things and muddling through? We should be campaigning for better infrastructure, better working practices. I just think we have all this technology, we're supposed to be a rich country, let's fight to make things better rather than just managing. What happened to the spirit of the first union workers who demanded better conditions and rights? I want to see that spirit back.

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 10:23

MasterBeth · 25/06/2026 10:23

Do you honestly think that the economic legacy left to the government - the state of our finances, infrastructure, tax base, productivity - is something that can be turned round in a couple of years?

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Of course not. It’s op asking why these things aren’t happening, not me!

MasterBeth · 25/06/2026 10:23

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 10:05

They’ve been out for a couple of years now and things go from bad to worse 🤷‍♀️ can’t blame them forever. The fact is we are skint.

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Do you honestly think that the economic legacy left to the government - the state of our finances, infrastructure, tax base, productivity - is something that can be turned round in a couple of years?

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 10:15

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 10:13

Oh dear...no my position is not that the UK is a tax haven

The sad thing is I don't think you're trolling I think you're trying really hard.

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Stop playing dim to avoid heavy questioning.

You said the UK needs to tax corporations more. A country with very light corporation tax is a tax haven. I showed you our corporation tax is high, higher than Ireland, higher than Scandinavia. So we are clearly taxing the ‘big corporations’ (that you couldn’t even name) enough.

But of course yelling about big corporations is better than actually examining the real problem, even if it sounds stupid and can’t stand up to gentle questioning.

Original poster

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 10:13

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 10:07

Because your position is basically that the UK is a tax haven. Then you sent me a link showing we are very much not a tax haven, and in the case of corporation tax (as you zoomed in on ‘the big corporations’) is actually higher than Scandinavia, Ireland and many other countries you probably think are better than us.

You’re all kinds of muddled.

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Oh dear...no my position is not that the UK is a tax haven

The sad thing is I don't think you're trolling I think you're trying really hard.

OP posts:

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 10:12

MasterBeth · 25/06/2026 10:10

AIBU to think that in a conversation you should remember the context of what you're talking about rather than thinking every exchange is a fresh, new start?

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I didn’t say ‘he’ll resign over benefits, like the rest of them did’. I was clearly alluding to the high number of resignations in general by saying ‘he’ll resign like the rest of them did’.

MasterBeth · 25/06/2026 10:10

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 10:05

I said: I think he’ll resign, like the rest.
You: Which ‘rest’?
me: gives names
you: I MEANT RESIGNATIONS OVER BENEFITS

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AIBU to think that in a conversation you should remember the context of what you're talking about rather than thinking every exchange is a fresh, new start?

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 10:07

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 09:59

'This suggests we are already taxing fairly to support the public.'

How on earth did you come to that conclusion?

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Because your position is basically that the UK is a tax haven. Then you sent me a link showing we are very much not a tax haven, and in the case of corporation tax (as you zoomed in on ‘the big corporations’) is actually higher than Scandinavia, Ireland and many other countries you probably think are better than us.

You’re all kinds of muddled.

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 10:05

MasterBeth · 25/06/2026 10:01

Because the Conservative right has been in power in the UK for most of the last fifty years. Google "Norway sovereign wealth fund."

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They’ve been out for a couple of years now and things go from bad to worse 🤷‍♀️ can’t blame them forever. The fact is we are skint.

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 10:05

MasterBeth · 25/06/2026 09:57

Honestly, I can't tell if you're trolling or just a bit dim. This is just a list of ministers you've googled who have resigned from the Starmer government, not a list of ministers who have concerns about spending on benefits.

Streeting resigned to put pressure on Starmer to resign so he could challenge for his job.

Phillips resigned because of a lack of action concerning violence against women and girls.

(I have never heard of Miatta Fahnbulleh. Had you?)

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I said: I think he’ll resign, like the rest.
You: Which ‘rest’?
me: gives names
you: I MEANT RESIGNATIONS OVER BENEFITS

MasterBeth · 25/06/2026 10:01

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:57

See that’s interesting as it doesn’t class the UK as being a tax haven in the way it classes Ireland as being a tax haven. The vast majority of their tax haven lists are poorer countries. This suggests we are already taxing fairly to support the public. In terms of corporation tax, we have higher rates than Scandinavia - would you see it increased even more? And why don’t we have the amazing socialist state they do given we actually tax corporations more than they do?

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Because the Conservative right has been in power in the UK for most of the last fifty years. Google "Norway sovereign wealth fund."

Original poster

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 09:59

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:57

See that’s interesting as it doesn’t class the UK as being a tax haven in the way it classes Ireland as being a tax haven. The vast majority of their tax haven lists are poorer countries. This suggests we are already taxing fairly to support the public. In terms of corporation tax, we have higher rates than Scandinavia - would you see it increased even more? And why don’t we have the amazing socialist state they do given we actually tax corporations more than they do?

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'This suggests we are already taxing fairly to support the public.'

How on earth did you come to that conclusion?

OP posts:

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:57

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 09:49

https://www.ethicalconsumer.org/ethicalcampaigns/tax-justice/tax-avoidance-rankings

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See that’s interesting as it doesn’t class the UK as being a tax haven in the way it classes Ireland as being a tax haven. The vast majority of their tax haven lists are poorer countries. This suggests we are already taxing fairly to support the public. In terms of corporation tax, we have higher rates than Scandinavia - would you see it increased even more? And why don’t we have the amazing socialist state they do given we actually tax corporations more than they do?

MasterBeth · 25/06/2026 09:57

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:42

John Healey
Wes Streeting
Jess Phillips
Miatta Fahnbulleh

Ring any bells?

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Honestly, I can't tell if you're trolling or just a bit dim. This is just a list of ministers you've googled who have resigned from the Starmer government, not a list of ministers who have concerns about spending on benefits.

Streeting resigned to put pressure on Starmer to resign so he could challenge for his job.

Phillips resigned because of a lack of action concerning violence against women and girls.

(I have never heard of Miatta Fahnbulleh. Had you?)

Original poster

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 09:49

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:49

Because you said big corporations, and I’m asking which ones specifically. Can you name the worst offenders? I’m sure it’ll be easy as you’ve read so many books.

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https://www.ethicalconsumer.org/ethicalcampaigns/tax-justice/tax-avoidance-rankings

Tax Avoidance Rankings | Ethical Consumer

We gave these companies 'zero' in our ratings system for their likely use of tax avoidance strategies.

https://www.ethicalconsumer.org/ethicalcampaigns/tax-justice/tax-avoidance-rankings

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Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:49

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 09:47

Why?

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Because you said big corporations, and I’m asking which ones specifically. Can you name the worst offenders? I’m sure it’ll be easy as you’ve read so many books.

Original poster

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 09:47

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:47

Can you name just one or two?

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Why?

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Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:47

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 09:46

All of them?

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Can you name just one or two?

Original poster

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 09:46

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:45

Which tax dodging corporations should pay in your opinion?

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All of them?

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Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:45

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 09:44

What do I think of “Every meeting I have is: ‘Who can we tax in order to pay benefits to others?’ They’re asking the wrong questions.”?

I'd like to know what he thinks are the right questions.

I think the fact is, with a top heavy population and half the welfare bill going on pensions, we HAVE to find the money to pay for that. I think it should come from corporations that dodge tax, I don't think it's ethical to find that money by taking from other poor and vulnerable groups.

So I think it is a right question but there are many others. Such as, what investments can we make to decrease the reliance on benefits in the first place?

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Which tax dodging corporations should pay in your opinion?

Original poster

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 09:44

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:40

Can you for once address the point made directly and not flail around looking for semantics to argue over to evade answering questions? What do you think of what he said?

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What do I think of “Every meeting I have is: ‘Who can we tax in order to pay benefits to others?’ They’re asking the wrong questions.”?

I'd like to know what he thinks are the right questions.

I think the fact is, with a top heavy population and half the welfare bill going on pensions, we HAVE to find the money to pay for that. I think it should come from corporations that dodge tax, I don't think it's ethical to find that money by taking from other poor and vulnerable groups.

So I think it is a right question but there are many others. Such as, what investments can we make to decrease the reliance on benefits in the first place?

OP posts:

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:42

MasterBeth · 25/06/2026 09:27

Sorry, "like the rest"? Which rest?

The Defence Secretary resigned. Who else are you thinking of?

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John Healey
Wes Streeting
Jess Phillips
Miatta Fahnbulleh

Ring any bells?

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:40

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 09:29

Insisting on this thread he's resigned when that's literally not even true, how embarrassing

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Can you for once address the point made directly and not flail around looking for semantics to argue over to evade answering questions? What do you think of what he said?

Original poster

glitterpaperchain · 25/06/2026 09:29

MasterBeth · 25/06/2026 09:27

Sorry, "like the rest"? Which rest?

The Defence Secretary resigned. Who else are you thinking of?

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Insisting on this thread he's resigned when that's literally not even true, how embarrassing

OP posts:

MasterBeth · 25/06/2026 09:27

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:26

Apologies he’s not resigned yet but he had WhatsApp messages leaked:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2026/jun/02/labour-not-looking-to-raise-taxes-to-fund-benefits-minister-says-after-whatsapp-messages-revealed

In messages between the work and pensions secretary, Pat McFadden, and Peter Mandelson released on Monday, McFadden wrote: “Every meeting I have is: ‘Who can we tax in order to pay benefits to others?’ They’re asking the wrong questions.”

I think like the rest he’ll hand his notice in within the year. Let me guess he’s a GB News stooge?

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Sorry, "like the rest"? Which rest?

The Defence Secretary resigned. Who else are you thinking of?

Sheismycherrypie · 25/06/2026 09:26

MasterBeth · 25/06/2026 09:23

Sorry, which Work and Pensions Secretary do you think has resigned?

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Apologies he’s not resigned yet but he had WhatsApp messages leaked:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2026/jun/02/labour-not-looking-to-raise-taxes-to-fund-benefits-minister-says-after-whatsapp-messages-revealed

In messages between the work and pensions secretary, Pat McFadden, and Peter Mandelson released on Monday, McFadden wrote: “Every meeting I have is: ‘Who can we tax in order to pay benefits to others?’ They’re asking the wrong questions.”

I think like the rest he’ll hand his notice in within the year. Let me guess he’s a GB News stooge?

Labour ‘not looking to raise taxes to fund benefits’ as Mandelson messages suggest

Nick Thomas-Symonds defends ‘embarrassing’ Whatsapp messages between Pat McFadden and Mandelson

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2026/jun/02/labour-not-looking-to-raise-taxes-to-fund-benefits-minister-says-after-whatsapp-messages-revealed