AIBU to think claiming two state pensions seems unethical?

There's a double taxation treaty that deals with this, but overseas citizens will still pay any due inheritance tax.

My great aunt was Italian and lived in the UK for about 30 years when she drew an Italian and UK pension - works in other senses too. This was a few decades ago.

I was self-employed in the UK and paid class 2 (still self-employed) when I moved overseas, quite a number of years ago now. My state pension overseas will be a pittance, which is why I've continued to pay contributions (the triple lock still applies where I live in the EU). HMRC will be contacting those in my situation next month about the move to class 3 - that is the closing of the supposed "loophole". I will absolutely need my UK pension, as I would never have enough on any pension I get in the country I reside.

Do these overseas citizens pay inheritance tax to the U.K.?

If you had already registered interest.

I gather you don’t like your parents much then op?

It is unethical to take public money that you don’t need. I agree with you. My STBXH’S father does this two. It all goes in a bank account that he never touches because he just doesn’t need it. My ex and his siblings will benefit from it but it seems wrong.

That said, I’d rather the government focused on properly taxing wealth rather than this issue. That’s where the real inequality and unethical practice lies.

I do think our benefit system needs a massive overhaul as so many people are taking the piss.

However, in the mean time I have researched into what I am entitled to (zero) and our parent(s). Believe me, I have gone after everything on offer; attendants allowances, help updating their houses to live in.

As far as I am concerned we have paid so much into the system and taken very little out (paid our own schooling and healthcare) and if I can claw back anything for my own family then I will. I am sick of paying for everyone else who have no interest in contributing to society, and now I am only looking after my own.

So, good on your parents.

Relax.

Undoubtedly there will be some savings and/or contributions that you currently benefit from that will be withdrawn for others in later years. They'll be pissing and moaning on MN about people of your generation.

Imagine when the UK pension goes means-tested, and I think it will; the howls.

I don't know why you think the now more restrictive rules for topping-up from abroad is a "Boomers" perk.

I know someone who was born and lived overseas for the first 40 years of their life. They paid taxes etc and also into company pensions. They married a UK citizen and worked for a number of years in the UK.

They claim a state pension from their native country and the UK. They discovered that due to corporate corruption they do not get any private pension from the companies they worked for in their native country.

Their spouse, a UK citizen who has never worked in the overseas country is entitled to a pension from their spouses native country due to being married to said spouse.

But it’s still more than people who don’t pay anything in at all and either get credits because they claim child benefit or certain other benefits. You could have someone claiming certain benefits for years and never contributing but still qualifies for full state pension due to NI credits. And then you have people that don’t even get NI credits so instead they just get pension credit which gives them the same amount anyway! I don’t really see what the difference is. All of these people are still claiming more than they paid in.

It does sound like a loop hole which should be closed but tbf the contribution for self employment is about the same. I used to be self employed and I only had to pay about £140 a year national insurance. Pretty sure it was just a flat rate and unrelated to the amount of money I made.

Not paying £170, it’s not - that’s the now ended class 2 rate that overseas residents can’t access anymore

It’s a loophole and they’re doing nothing wrong. It does feel unfair though, I’ve been working and paying NI contributions for over 40 years, it’ll be over 50 when I reach state pension age, yet I’ll get the same as those who haven’t worked here and paid tax and only paid a token amount towards their pension. Many others are in the same boat. It’s unbelievable but it’s the way the system works.

They’re unlikely to be paying tax if they don’t live here and haven’t done for 30ish years.

She’s probably concerned about it because it’s unethical and indicative of other people doing the same.

Why should she be pleased for them that they’re living at UK residents’ expense, especially when it’s money they don’t need?

Oh don't get me wrong, some people here do still refer to pensions, but the term used by the government is superannuation for the over 65s, although the word pension is still used for veteran's - there is no specific widow's benefit, they would come under another title such as jobseeker, or sole parent and those are referred to as benefits .

Ours isn't means tested, someone who hasn't worked a day in their life gets the same standard rate as a millionaire, although of course they would get extras such as an accommodation supplement.

Private super isn't compulsory here, although many people do have it, and one, Kiwisaver, does have minor contributions from the government, although less than previously. How much a person has saved via this has no bearing on their state paid super.

Even 35 years at a few hundred pounds minimum contribution is far less than just one year of full pension. So the point remains the same.

Only private pensions should be able to be drawn outside the UK, not state imo.

Not from me: it makes me livid. Basically another massive perk for the boomers with the ladder pulled up for everyone else. Why have they kept getting money thrown at them? I don’t understand it.

Thanks for taking the time to clarify, good to know.
Interesting as we seem to have the same terms for completely different things. The term pension is still with us here, agree it’s outdated but alas, and we have different ‘types’. Essentially the term covers anything the government hands out from government money, except unemployment, which is termed ‘benefits’. So, in this scenario it’s the ‘old age pension’ (to make it sound even more old fashioned 😆) as opposed to say veterans pension, widow’s pension. Interestingly, there also used to be a ‘single mothers pension’ but there has been progress and this was disbanded and it’s now rebadged, and open to singles and families, as a ‘benefit’, called family benefit, and is based on income/assets as opposed to purely being a ‘single mother’.

Super here though, while compulsory if working and earning over a certain amount, is not collected by the government nor handed back by the government, it’s completely separate, the only intersection is that it is treated as an ‘asset’ for the purpose of eligibility for pensions. Seems we are a real outlier with terminology, I wonder if this will be globally aligned with everyone else at some point!

They will receive state pension but no triple lock. Which I believe is fair.

It's happening currently.

This is all accurate. I know a number of people who haven't lived in the UK in 20+ years paying a pittance in to get full UK pension when the time comes.

Okay. So, why not lobby MP’s with this, what do you think writing in Mumsnet will achieve instead?

Well in a way it’s countered by my parents who both worked from age 15 and paid in continuously (except my mums short maternity leave) but both died within a couple of years of qualifying for the state pension.