What exactly is the strictness in English schools actually achieving?

It's difficult though, because the overall effect of this is that those kids who are in greatest need of a nurturing therapeutic education don't get it, and are instead treated badly and sometimes even retraumatized, while those kids who are already privileged have their privilege entrenched by being treated like rational human beings during their secondary education and being given a greater degree of leeway. So during a period of life in which children's nervous systems are developing, some children are being deliberately subjected to quite a high degree of stress and conflict which may have long-term consequences for not only their mental but their physical health. If schools are toxic environments for some children where their cortisol levels are constantly raised, this can have significant health consequences for them for the rest of their lives.

I don't know what should be done about it, because schools have very little in the cupboard to address behavioural issues as it is anyway. And the counter-argument is of course that children won't feel safe in schools where behaviour is out-of-control. But it makes me feel uncomfortable.

Sorry, I was just paraphrasing really. The report identifies ways that teaching could be better - that’s all I’ve got to go on. It also explicitly states that the behaviour approach is starting to show a positive impact and that targeted attendance interventions seem to be helping. Overall the issues facing the school appear to be many and varied - I’d be interested to see the next report.

I think in general schools are as strict as they need to be. Some schools have an easier cohort due to selection, upbringing etc. They won't need to be that strict.

Schools that do need to be more rigid often have a much more challenging cohort. Eg due to unsupportive parents seeing teachers as the enemy and passing that on to kids. Or kids who've had a very difficult home life and it's come out in their behaviour

The report also says that attendance is still an issue. Possibly because the disruptive kids are stopping the ones that want to work and it makes a atmosphere in whcih the kids with a SEND cant work and stay home/refuse to come in.

From the article the "quality of teaching is poor in a minority of cases with a minority of pupils making limited progress".

So saying that the "quality of teaching is not where it should be" is a bit of an overstatement and just blaming the teachers.

It also says that ths SLT are not doing enough and their are still issues with attendance.

the school developed what it calls an “enhanced consequences” system — a restorative approach focused on identifying the root causes of behaviour rather than responding to incidents in isolation.

Enhanced consequences system doesn't mean no punishment or strictness. Identifying the root cause can help but if the root cause is "bob likes being a twat" there's not much school can do.

There's a lot of waffley words in that paper report and not much detail on concrete actions. I'd be interested to hear from someone on the inside.

If they’re in school but not actually learning much that’s not a great success, and ‘we’ve reduced the number of exclusions’ doesn’t mean ‘kids aren’t kicking off to the point of exclusion’, it can and often does mean ‘we’ve just stopped excluding kids for poor behaviour’. (See Scotland for example).

That's an interesting report. Yes, it definitely seems that the quality of teaching is not where it should be, but it does say that the behaviour policy is starting to show a positive impact, and it sounds as though more children are actually in school. It'd be interesting to see the next inspection report.

The article doesn't mention that the school was put into special measures in April 2025. https://www.southwalesguardian.co.uk/news/25133635.estyn-ysgol-maesydderwen-placed-special-measures/

They’re trying this in Scotland though and it’s having a tremendously detrimental affect so it doesn’t work everywhere. In fact this is the only case I have seen of it working.

In Scotland permanent exclusions have been zero each year for some time. There are no meaningful consequences for poor behaviour and constant disruption. So students behave violently and constantly disrupt lessons. Violence is soaring and academic achievement is plummeting. It’s appalling that the Scottish government are determined to ignore this serious issue.

https://nation.cymru/news/how-welsh-school-cut-exclusions-from-150-to-13-after-behaviour-overhaul/

Here's a real life example of changes leading to massive improvement in pupil behaviour

Btw, where's the complaint? I made a statement. Not a complaint. But then, even though I have clearly explained that I am not a teacher, you seem to think I am one.

"Do not argue with a fool. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience."

Illustrated here I think.

I do admire your experience.

Is it government pressure?
Yes
Ofsted?
Yes
League tables?
Yes
Funding linked to attendance?
Yes
Or is it actually genuinely believed that this level of strictness benefits children?
Hmmmm...not sure

I’m telling my muuuuum!

No darling, I will be telling your mum.

Do you have a link please?
I did google but can’t seem to find anything about outcomes in schools that tried his approach.

Don't forget the sly manipulative ones, the wind up merchants or those that spot a "weakness" and expliot it to get a reaction.

Or those children that report teachers for issuing sanctions against them or because the teacher might issue a sanction against them.

We’ve had children (yes, several), come in the next day and apologise for their parents’ behaviour.

👏👏

Another example. When DD was in primary school at pick up we waited by the gates. When I picked her up she said she hoped Mr x was okay. Why I asked? Oh because Bob’s mum is shouting and swearing at him in the playground. And yes as we walked round through the fence I could see the parent openly berating Mr x in full view of the kids leaving. A minority of parents do not model politeness and respect and this impacts their children.
Disrespectful behaviour has multiple causes - it isn’t just about petty rules.

This thread is like a hamster wheel.
Non-teachers suggest poor behaviour is largely due to petty rules and poor practice of individual teachers.
Others say this is not the case and highlight other issues that impact on behaviour (under-resourcing for SEND and other challenges, poor parental attitudes, high levels of supply & cover etc. etc.).
These are ignored and people continue to imply teachers on this thread aren’t doing enough/are being disrespectful/are not engaging in effective practice. This is seen as the problem - not wider systemic issues.
The teachers are understandably upset by this criticism particularly as people know nothing about their practice.

I think particular lowlights were suggesting people might be better off training dogs or shouldn’t be teaching.
Various straw men are also thrown around e. g. teachers see misbehaving students as ‘bad people’
There is also the ‘everything was better in the good old days argument’. This wasn’t a universal experience. I was there in the old days - believe me it wasn’t great for everyone.

There is a recruitment crisis in secondary teaching. It really isn’t hard to see why.
My DD has largely engaged and supportive teachers. She does not attend a MN approved type school - just a typical comprehensive. She appreciates it when teachers challenge disruptive behaviour & they do. Nobody is on a ‘power trip’ or marching people to detention because they forgot a pen. I see hardworking teachers continuing to give good teaching despite under resourcing and abuse from a minority of students and parents.

There are zero tolerance and more punitive school environments, but this is not a universal experience. I’m glad DD’s school doesn’t fuss about shoes, hair dye etc., but I can assure you this has not led to universal good behaviour. Disruptive behaviour is not largely the result of the enforcement of uniform rules etc. The causes are multifaceted.

What’s really funny is that some kids enjoy seeing other kids being told off, they’ll report any infringement but when it’s them doing the exact same thing and getting told off it’s suddenly the worst thing ever and you’re soooo unfair! Obviously rules only apply to other people. 🙄

Yet if you disrespect a police officer you get repremanded or arrested.
You do tha same with a manager and you get repremanded or fired
You do the same to a teacher and the attempt at a repremand is draconian and you get to go back in to the class and do the same the next day/lesson.

Many pupils and parents are very happy to let you know that they have rights but are very slow to take any responsibilty for their actions. And strangely enough those same parents and pupils care very little for the rights of others.

As you like

That's a weird and unevidenced interpretation of what I said.

Bad behaviour wasn't endemic. It happened, but rarely. It was neither persistent, nor extreme. The class as a whole was happy and successful. And no, for the last time, the bad behaviour was not mine. Hope that clarifies.

But I doubt it will be enough somehow, since you seem insistent on picking holes in every other experience that is different from your own.

The vast majority of secondary schools are academies.