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AIBU?

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AIBU to point out that the most important duty of the UK government is to maintain the defence of the country?

133 replies

KateSixer · 11/06/2026 12:52

The shameful, cowardly and extremely short sighted decision of Starmer and Reeves not to properly fund the defence budget has led to the resignation of the Secretary of State for Defence.

Honestly it's traitorous.

OP posts:
MissConductUS · 11/06/2026 16:18

anniegun · 11/06/2026 12:57

Nobody disagrees its important. But when we waste defence money on Ajax fighting vehicles that dont work, aircraft carriers that cannot be deployed. you might argue its not the funding but the spending thats the problem.

There is certainly room to improve the procurement process, but that's just one part of the problem. The BA is less than half its size in 1990. During the Cold War, the RN had over 100 capital ships. It now has 62. Decades of stagnant or reduced funding have left it a shell of what it needs to be.

KatiePricesKnickers · 11/06/2026 16:10

Another step closer to a reform government.

rellylivesthere · 11/06/2026 16:06

StandingDeskDisco · 11/06/2026 15:03

Fundamentally disagree.
The most important job of any national government is to make sure the population is fed, housed, and has healthcare.

Exactly how this is done is a matter for debate, but it is far more important than defence.

Wow. That level of naivety reminds me of Corbyn's statement that if PM he would never use nuclear weapons.

Papyrophile · 11/06/2026 16:03

Healey's resignation could hurt Starmer's authority even more than Streeting's resignation a fortnight ago, and the local government elections. It's very damaging.

EasternStandard · 11/06/2026 16:03

Genevieva · 11/06/2026 15:52

That’s good to hear. I don’t actually know much about his political opinions because he keeps his powder dry, but I generally admire politicians who get on with their job quietly and don’t have an egotistical desire for the limelight. It certainly suggests a man who doesn’t jump on bandwagons and has an innate understanding of diplomacy.

Yep. He’s not a stirrer which makes his excoriating letter even more important.

rellylivesthere · 11/06/2026 16:00

Anotherdayanotherexcuse · 11/06/2026 13:14

Oh behave. The Tories underfunded it for 13 years. Labour can't wave a magic wand and fix things in only 2.

Maybe but Putins behaviour and the USA threatening to walk away from NATO means we have to make it a greater priority right now.

rellylivesthere · 11/06/2026 15:57

InveterateWineDrinker · 11/06/2026 13:13

The problem is that the only two ways of seriously increasing the tax take in the UK is to raise income tax or VAT (or both.)

Sir Keir ruled out the former because it would have been political suicide in an election that was Labour's for the taking. There are enough people claiming VAT is a tax on 'ordinary working people' that he cannot possibly raise that now either.

Everyone who voted Labour because they promised not to increase income tax is complicit in this, although if Sir Keir sees the writing on the wall it might be interesting to see what he does with VAT.

Yes Thatcher's Government lowered income tax and raised VAT.

BIossomtoes · 11/06/2026 15:55

He’s well liked now. He was reviled by the opposition parties yesterday and will be again if he ever rejoins the cabinet.

Genevieva · 11/06/2026 15:52

EasternStandard · 11/06/2026 15:40

Healey is well liked apparently. It’s going to hit both Starmer and Reeves.

That’s good to hear. I don’t actually know much about his political opinions because he keeps his powder dry, but I generally admire politicians who get on with their job quietly and don’t have an egotistical desire for the limelight. It certainly suggests a man who doesn’t jump on bandwagons and has an innate understanding of diplomacy.

EasternStandard · 11/06/2026 15:40

Genevieva · 11/06/2026 15:18

John Healey is the only member of the Cabinet I had any respect for. A man of intellect and integrity surrounded by imbeciles. I’d sooner have him as PM than Burnham.

Healey is well liked apparently. It’s going to hit both Starmer and Reeves.

Genevieva · 11/06/2026 15:37

BIossomtoes · 11/06/2026 15:30

All the Tories are saying that today. So is Jenrick. I bet they weren’t yesterday.

I haven’t seen that. I’ve only just sat dorm after running around all morning. I usually listen to the radio in the car, but with the horrid news of late, I’ve been listening to music.

LuckyHazelFox · 11/06/2026 15:36

DeftGoldHedgehog · 11/06/2026 15:31

This.

Plus the main duty of a government is to have a country worth defending, something the Conservatives singularly failed at.

Good job we don't all think the same when our children and grandchildren live here.

MrsFaustus · 11/06/2026 15:33

Well we do need to increase our defence budget but where is the money coming from? Increased taxation will not help Labour’s re-election chances, especially as the increases will predominantly hit the ‘stretched middle’ who are starting to struggle and are sick of being seen as the go to when money is needed. If they attempt to reduce the ever increasing welfare budget there’ll be another backbench revolt.

DeftGoldHedgehog · 11/06/2026 15:31

mandysocks · 11/06/2026 12:54

Well the Tories decimated the Armed Forces during their tenure, Labour haven’t quite reached that level of neglect yet. They’re at least getting above inflation pay rises now.

This.

Plus the main duty of a government is to have a country worth defending, something the Conservatives singularly failed at.

BIossomtoes · 11/06/2026 15:30

Genevieva · 11/06/2026 15:18

John Healey is the only member of the Cabinet I had any respect for. A man of intellect and integrity surrounded by imbeciles. I’d sooner have him as PM than Burnham.

All the Tories are saying that today. So is Jenrick. I bet they weren’t yesterday.

StandingDeskDisco · 11/06/2026 15:28

Papyrophile · 11/06/2026 15:15

No, the job of a national government is to keep the country safe so the people who live in it can go about their business and earn the money to feed and house their families.

As I said, I fundamentally disagree.

In a modern globalised economy, we cannot be peasant farmers who build our own houses out of wattle and daub and heal ourselves with herbs.
The government has to make sure the population has food, housing, and healthcare, whether that is by providing these things directly in a socialist economy, subsidising them in a mixed economy, or regulating for their provision in a controlled capitalist economy.

I read somewhere (sorry don't have a link) that during the First World War, when they needed more soldiers, they were shocked at how malnourished and sick most of the working class men were. The government then realised they had to improve social conditions if they wanted fit soldiers.
That is the practical aspect.
The moral aspect is that it is quite simply the primary duty of the government of the nation to ensure the health and wellbeing of the population.

LuckyHazelFox · 11/06/2026 15:19

StandingDeskDisco · 11/06/2026 15:03

Fundamentally disagree.
The most important job of any national government is to make sure the population is fed, housed, and has healthcare.

Exactly how this is done is a matter for debate, but it is far more important than defence.

They have to be alive for that to happen! Stamer disagrees with you in any case. I should hope he does as the PM. Wish he'd put his words into action.

Genevieva · 11/06/2026 15:18

John Healey is the only member of the Cabinet I had any respect for. A man of intellect and integrity surrounded by imbeciles. I’d sooner have him as PM than Burnham.

Anotherdayanotherexcuse · 11/06/2026 15:16

Idstillratherbepaddleboarding · 11/06/2026 14:52

My brother is in the RAF and was meant to be deployed to a critical country last week. The RAF, ie the service that’s primary function is aircraft, was unable to find a plane to take them out so they are all going on Wizz Air next week… 🙈🙈

The RAF has chartered private aircraft as well as military transport to evacuate/repatriate and move it's people and families as far back as the 1960s.

Papyrophile · 11/06/2026 15:15

StandingDeskDisco · 11/06/2026 15:03

Fundamentally disagree.
The most important job of any national government is to make sure the population is fed, housed, and has healthcare.

Exactly how this is done is a matter for debate, but it is far more important than defence.

No, the job of a national government is to keep the country safe so the people who live in it can go about their business and earn the money to feed and house their families.

Persephonia1966 · 11/06/2026 15:15

LuckyHazelFox · 11/06/2026 13:41

You don't really know how warfare works do you? No imminent danger 😆 🤣 we aren't going to get nuked overnight but there has to be a momentum of weaponry availability and adequate deployment, way in advance of a real threat.

It's not only weapons
It's people to fight
Mostly young people, historically mostly (not all) from lower incomes.

There is something uncomfortable about the expectation (just taken for granted) that young people will be available to lay their lives down on the line by the same people who regularly threaten to move to another country if the income tax/capital gains tax on higher earners is raised at all.

If the country needs defending then be willing to pay for it. If it isn't urgent enough for someone with a passive income of over 100,000 to pay more capital gains tax on everything over 100,000 then it isn't urgent enough to cut spending on youth clubs, social services, carers allowance.

I'm not against reducing spending where there is waste or bloat or even to pay for infrastructure etc. But doing it as a way to increase military spending without taxing the wealthy doesn't sit right.

EasternStandard · 11/06/2026 15:13

LostFuse · 11/06/2026 15:09

.

Really? It’s not going well for Labour is it. Surely you can see that.

LostFuse · 11/06/2026 15:09

LuckyHazelFox · 11/06/2026 14:48

For choose to negatively engage in, read refuse to conform to your beliefs. The only negativity I'm seeing is from you and your personal insults. Are you trying to deflect from Labour's shocking performance and internal squabbling?

.

Happy Cracking Up GIF by MOODMAN
StandingDeskDisco · 11/06/2026 15:03

Fundamentally disagree.
The most important job of any national government is to make sure the population is fed, housed, and has healthcare.

Exactly how this is done is a matter for debate, but it is far more important than defence.

LuckyHazelFox · 11/06/2026 14:59

EasternStandard · 11/06/2026 14:51

It’s a tough day for Labour, it’s looking existential.

A very tough day indeed. Best thing Starmer can do is call a GE. It's the only way he can save the final humiliation he's about to face.