Did you know about this other attempted beheading?

Several things can be true at once:

• Despicable far right thugs and agitators spoiling for a fight and driven by racism start fighting and setting fire to things. Far right political parties like to exploit and encourage division and racism and spread misinformation and hate. True and awful.

• Asylum seekers especially men who are here without families are men, so more of a threat than women, quite possibly traumatised, and without the family support networks that mean a UK citizen having a psychotic break, say, has slightly more chance of being stopped before behaving violently. Easy to see how statistically this could genuinely make asylum seekers more of a risk to other people even while the majority are harmless and ordinary like most of us.

• People are naturally more frightened when relative strangers to their community commit violent acts than when people who have been in the community a long time do. It's about being afraid of what you can't predict or control, it's a fear that can come not just from what you think about a person but also from what you fear they may think about you. A feeling of safety comes partly from feeling that you're living among people who see you as part of their community, not just the other way round, and that feeling can be very threatened by events like this when the perpetrator may be different in multiple ways of which race is only one. Even if ultimately the cause is a mental health breakdown, the fear produced is still going to be greater for people who are relative strangers.

Basically not everything depends on people being wound up by far right thugs, not all feelings of fear and anger about events like this depend on racism, and so the solutions can't just be about calling out racism.

He was injured.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crmpejxlm7do?app-referrer=webview

Boohoo. I'm sick to the tits of hearing about criminals' poor mental health and fucking autism.

I seriously don't care. Whatever the original cause of your MH issues and despite how you struggled for x years with undiagnosed whatever...try and kill someone and a line is crossed. Prison is the best place and society is safer for it.

I think in this case he wasnt overtly harmed or injured, I cant remember where I read it but he took the axe from her I think.

Very frightening though and if she had managed to swing it in the wrong way (or right way) he would be toast

And the man in the Belfast attack has already lost his eye. I dont think its a given that he will survive.

I thought I read her dad said she was no trouble - wtte - and this behaviour came out of the blue, so this isnt a young person the family struggled with in terms of their own safety. I suspect her ASD caused her to be very quickly transfixed, obsessed and hyperfocused and she was driven to take this unusual behaviour to cause harm.

Given she started to make the odd comment about Reform, she had right wing beliefs to start with, but either read or heard about things that pushed those to the extreme right and to cause her to want to harm people.

(except for prison). I think so long as someone is mentally culpable then autism etc can't be used to escape prison for very violent crimes. That will lead to a backlash down the line. They still deserve help though.

You may be right. I don’t a strong view on prison v hospital.

I was just reading the Belfast victim is in a coma, this article doesn’t say much about physical outcome for victim.

Agree 100% with this!

That is most definitely not my experience in over twenty years of disability support.

It was a fairly recent case though? It is relevant if people are complaining another attack isnt being reported enough when that attack was front page news. The fact that you imagine the OP had to drag this case up suggests that there isn't an underreporting if violent crimes by immigrants compared to white British people. It was news jpust not front page for days and the talk of twitter.

It being an unusual thing to happen makes it more noticeable I would say and more newsworthy. Because these crimes are rare

It's also relevant because though I don't think the autism and anorexia exonerate her of personal responsibility it is clear she was badly failed by the mental health services etc. that seems to be a pattern in many of the news stories around violent attacks/radicalisation. It was for Rudabangya as well. That can get lost when people are just arguing about skin colour. Maybe improving MH support would reduce attacks and violence in the future...

Tbph I don't give two shits how autistic or anorexic she is. She tried to murder a random person on the street. Prison is the right place for her..

Do you not understand that this is part of the problem ? People with MH conditions, and that includes those with Autism because there is very often an associated MH problem or learning disability, disproportionately end up in the justice system because these conditions go unsupported until they end up committing a crime and go to prison instead of accessing the help they need.

There are also people with severe mental health conditions who are in prison because the state of MH services is so inadequate that there is simply nowhere else for them to go. Better and more accessible MH services would mean earlier intervention and proper support, and many of these people would get the help they need instead of ending up behind bars.

Oh that’s all right then. 🙄

Yes as I say she probably was too ill for school. That doesnt mean if she commits a crime she should be hospitalised rather than imprisoned!!! Why would it?

And although this is theoretical, I cannot tell you how many families say they are failed by services but dont engage in what is required or the young person/child doesnt engage with sessions or medication and so services close to them as there isnt anything they can do.

Correction: another male immigrant ...

So can we be absolutely clear? A male immigrant attacks another man with a kitchen knife and all manner of outrage is unleashed, up to and including riots in which attempts are made to burn people alive in their homes. A radicalised 19 year old white woman takes an axe to an immigrant and MN makes excuses for her which are applauded as common sense and she apparently shouldn’t be imprisoned. Make it make sense.

Im not sure where Ive implied Im not calm. Im setting out information for people that dont seem to understand these conditions or what the threshold for hospitalisation is

Are you aware that there is a huge amount of work by MH services, social care and the NHS to prevent and avoid people with ND going into hospital, either psychiatric hospitals or general hospitals because it is hugely counterproductive for them, its destablising, distressing, likely to make them ill. Only in the most acute and dangerous circumstances should they be hospitalised, treatment at home or outpatients is the pathway for most ND patients.

She doesnt look 'unwell', she's a young pale person, who is underweight (by the looks of her, obviously I dont know), that doesnt warrant hospitalisation. If the services working with her think she should access medical care on a ward then clearly they will assess that and make that decision.

She committed a horrific crime, seemingly not caused by her being ill at the time or thereafter and therefore why wouldnt prison be the right resopnse?

If this was a small young 19 year old male, ASD and an eating disorder, neo nazi, no one would have an question about him being imprisoned. A plea from the parent that he wasnt supported and had MH issues would be scoffed at.

Yet the OP, who's been very quiet, managed to drag one case up. I'd love to know what she typed in her Google search.

Well apart from Russians but not in the UK.
I would argue within the UK no groups are well known for trying to behead people in public. It's an unusual crime here regardless of the sex and race of the perpetrator.

What is the ethnicity of the girl in this attack? Your link doesn't say. Three of the four parents quoted are not white.

Absolutely this.

Absolutely.

Tbph I don't give two shits how autistic or anorexic she is. She tried to murder a random person on the street. Prison is the right place for her.

Hallelujah for common sense.

Based on professional experience l don’t think Autism is used as an ‘excuse’. But my judgement may be coloured by the fact that most of the families l supported were dealing with adult children with Autism and severe associated mental health problems, which is not uncommon. Some families had to have safe rooms to barricade themselves in when they became violent - many had grown significantly bigger and stronger than their parents and inflicted significant injury.

While l don’t know anything about this girl, l believe her father was dealing with her and said they were both let down by services, and l can well believe this to be the case given the appalling provision of MH services in the UK.

She probably was too ill to go to school, many ASD kids have EBSA and/or she might not have been eating enough and perhaps had deficiences etc

Much of what is termed MH conditions and disorders for people with ASD is seen as 'behavioural' by CAMHS and MHT because its not a condition that can be treated as such, its an expression and habitual display of behaviour which simply needs to be managed by the client. Sometimes ADs or AP are given and can help, also to support sleep as well if needed.

These discussions always contain reflections about 'if onlly she was supported with her MH this wouldnt have happened' but often that is pie in the sky.

Op said "non-white" (although admittedly I havent read all ops posts yet where they may have corrected it to Sudanese)