AIBU to believe the over ‘concern’ about Mounjaro/Wegovy side effects are disingenuous ?

I tell everyone who comments on my weight loss too. I don’t believe for one second the fake.. I’m just being judgmental because I’m worried about the side effects comments I’ve had of a few people.. They just don’t want to admit they are jealous. I was also jealous by the few people I knew that had lost weight on Mounjaro, because I couldn’t afford it and didn’t qualify for it on the NHS (I had a small compensation payout that meant I could afford to give it a go)
The difference is I can admit that my jealousy is my problem. I would bet money that the majority that hold these strong anti weight loss jab opinions would be on them themselves in a heartbeat if the price dropped to £20 instead of £200.

Don't you? I've seen quite a bit of it.

It's the same about ADHD medication and to some extent antidepressants, although I think antidepressants are slowly losing stigma.

I think there is probably a sort of instinctive suspicion about medications which seem to affect the brain rather than, for example, blood pressure medication, although to me the way both things work is equally mysterious. And I don't think there are many people who would protest or worry about the use of e.g. antipsychotics in the case of schizophrenia, or medication for severe OCD. It's only really for conditions (depression, anxiety, ADHD, difficulty managing appetite) which seem relatively "normal" or related to feelings a majority of people have to some extent, where the questioning seems to come in.

It's also tied up in faux moral concern where the moral seems to be that having difficulty regulating appetite is a personal failure.

TBH though the more I learn about ADHD and to a lesser extent (only because it's not my experience whereas ADHD is) the kinds of difficulty people benefiting from WLI have, it makes me think that our general narratives and understanding about effort, willpower and behaviour in general are completely skewed and based on a false premise. I wouldn't go so far as to say I don't believe in free will, because I do believe we have control and choice over our actions. But I don't think that control and choice play as big a part as we generally believe. I think there are a lot of layers which underlie human behaviour and we cannot ascribe all of it to moral choice. Maybe 20%? I think 80% is under the surface and we are not really aware of this. We are animals to some extent acting on instinct. Our brains rationalise a lot of our actions after the fact (this is something proven by research). I actually think the most control we have over our behaviour is when we anticipate in advance and plan for what we will do. What we choose in the moment is mainly based on rehearsed data (what we've done in the past and what the immediate outcome was from that) or instinct, which points us towards behaviour which promotes survival, such as taking on calories, conserving energy by resting when it is safe to do so, following sexual urges, escaping/avoiding things our autonomic nervous system perceives as dangerous, and seeking social approval (or perhaps avoiding social disapproval) by noticing and following the behaviour of others - and much of this is unconscious.

It's a weird one for sure. And definitely hyped up by media, most likely because it is divisive. I won't say it's totally algorithm-driven, because "concern" about antidepressants has been a staple of newspapers for several decades now, but there is definitely something in the way that news media and social media are using algorithms which select for engagement and attention, but what actually happens is that humans engage with and pay attention to content which promotes strong feelings (anger/upset of being persecuted/not heard, anger about perceived unfairness or someone getting an unfair advantage, fear relating to unknown dangers, anxiety in general) and the topics which promote the strongest feelings tend to be the ones where we feel tribal or protective, where there is a clear "us vs them" feeling. So for WLIs it will be people who use them/see a benefit from them vs people who are angry/jealous/being misled to be worried about them and want to ban them, or from the other perspective, people who have concerns and want them to be looked at vs the drug companies benefiting financially from the "naive" users who need to be saved. Because algorithms work so well to divide what content you see, the two groups both believe they are morally right and the opposing group are either evil, stupid, selfish, or vulnerable. And it's not just computer algorithms blindly dividing this stuff up either, there are bot farms and content farms with humans specifically looking out for topics which create this divide and feeding more content into the world which will exacerbate the debate on both sides, like they see a crack and drive a wedge into it. (I know this sounds like a conspiracy but these places genuinely exist.) And we know that people who see a lot of the same content will then go and perpetuate the same ideas in the genuine belief that they are true, so there are multiple layers to all of it. The amount of algorithmically-sorted content we tend to consume has acted as a catalyst for all of it, so if you can reduce the amount of this you use then it helps a lot, and understanding how the divides are created can help you look for more nuanced areas of grey and real experiences in the middle which don't lend to extremes on either side.

Of course no one should be taking medication they don’t need - I totally agree with that. Ultimately though, prescribing is between a patient and their doctor, who weigh up individual risks and benefits, including for weight loss medications, just like any other treatment.

There will always be cases of misuse or people obtaining things inappropriately but that’s true of many prescription drugs (painkillers being the most common example) & it doesn’t really say anything about appropriate medical use. It also doesn’t justify criticism of people who are legitimately prescribed them, which is often what happens in discussions like this.

Of course people think about the side effects before taking statins, blood pressures tablets, ibuprofen etc eg I don't take ibuprofen because the risk of it upserting my stomach is greater than the benefit I will get from it's pain killing effect and I don't take statins even though I was offered them because my risk of getting a stroke is still lower than the risk of possible side effects If my risk of having a stroke increases I will take the statins.
I don't see any problem with the side effects of weight loss medication being researched and made public. Especially as those drugs were not developed as weight loss medication originally. Then people can consider their own situation and their individual risk/benefits .
It would be immoral if researchers didn't publicise the possible side effects of taking weight loss medication. That doesn't mean that for some people the risk of not taking it isn't greater than the possible risk of taking it but for other people that won't be the case.

Fair enough. I hadn't noticed it so much and I definitely see less of it in mainstream media, but it may just be because it has been around for longer and is therefore less likely to generate clicks.

I don’t know, I sort of see threads on here in the opposite way.

Someone will post something about the possibility of side effects or long term impact or whatever, and they get 500 responses going ‘oooh jealous much, why do you hate fat people’?

It just shuts the conversation down in a very immature way.

There definitely is a lot of judgement on here about that!
Not threads started with a title of “AIBU to be ever so concerned about my friend’s health from her fillers”. But any threads around fillers, Botox etc get a lot of judgement.

(I could have included fillers and Botox in my earlier comment upthread about things used mainly by women getting more flack)

@MigGirl, you could say the same about cosmetic surgery and various cosmetic proceedures. They are "needed" even less than WLI and yet I don't see the judgement on here for the people who inject a potentially lethal toxin into their face just to prevent wrinkles!

Nearly a full house in one post 🤣

Agree with PPs, the anti-statin stuff is pretty relentless.

I think that WLIs are an absolutely brilliant cure for obesity, and losing 5 stone is a benefit that far outweighs any risks.

But what about if you just want to lose that last stone, or go from a size 12 to a size 8? Are the risks worth it just for that? Maybe not.
I think that that is the usage they are trying to discourage.

My biggest concern about this drug compared to say, HRT or antidepressants. Is people taking it who don't need to take it. That doesn't tend to happen with other drugs. This could then lead to heath issues for those who really shouldn't be taking it.

Most of the time doctors will weight up the benefits vrs the risks for taking a drug. But as individuals are we really qualified to do that? I don't think taking a medication just to lose 1 or 2 stone is worth it (and yes people are taking it just lose that little). It's totally different if you taking it to lose a lot of weight where you already have significant health risks due to your weight.

This hasn't been the first time diet drugs have been used/come on the market. The only difference this time is that they haven't been pulled because of serious side effects, which where previously unknown. There are also other drugs that have been used to help weight loss, which are still available. But again they have a higher side effect profile then WLI and aren't avaible to buy without a prescription from a GP or specialist.

I only know about this as one drugs I was taking for something non-related to weight loss was also prescribed for weight loss and talked about in the group I was on while taking it. This was before WLI became available, I know its still used as a weight loss drug in the US at lest.

I can understand why people also feel a little put out when there are many struggling at upper healthy BMI and not qualifying whereas people are allowed to maintain at far lower BMIs.

The excessive “concern” isn’t going to stop until wli are available to anyone who wants them (which I’ve no doubt, given the many non-weight related benefits which are emerging, they will be).

I'm with you OP.

It bugs me that - and maybe I'm wrong - but this is a revolutionary medication for people like you and me who have struggled to lose weight, but instead of giving us some positive stories, it's all "I nearly died from WLI!" type shit, where only the body text reveals that someone who was 8 stone with a BMI of 19 bought pens off some stranger in the pub.

Viagra was developed to help with heart (? I think) problems and other side effects were found. I don't remember any similar scare-mongering about that, I've only seen things like "Great news! If your dick doesn't get hard anymore, we can help with that!".

It's infuriating. It's especially hurtful when people that have never struggled with their weight - and like I always say on these posts, I don't mean gained a stone and then gradually lost a bit bit would like to lose more, I mean sustained weight gain and stagnation and not being able to lose more than a few pounds before gaining it back - feigning concern that you're losing weight with the aid of WLI. It's like, I get judged when I'm fat, judged when I'm trying to lose weight, judged when I wear a sack, judged when I don't....and now judged when I use medication to help me lose weight. Us fatties cannot EVER get approval.

Ok, off my soapbox now.

'To lose weight is simple you need to eat less. For some people it is literally that simple so they find it very difficult to understand why others cannot just eat less. Why there might be a whole host of physical and mental health factors that make this very very difficult.'

I think this is definitely a factor in the issue people seem to have with weight loss injections. People go by their lived experience so if you've never experienced the struggles or had to contend with 'food noise' etc, then it would seem odd that people who want to lose weight won't just choose to 'eat less, move more'. That's probably where the concern about side effects comes in, why take medication with potentially horrible side effects when you could just follow the simple rules and lose weight? (Obviously ignorant of how much harder it is for some people to actually do this). With all the publicity around wlis now people are being exposed to the factors more and hopefully will begin to understand the causes of obesity more and how it is not a level playing field!

I'm fat. I'm not going to take mounjaro because we don't know the risks. There haven't been long-term studies of the effects. I don't want to be a Guinea pig for this one.

Even if you're correct, then why is it people have chosen to be concerned about his drug and not the others. That's what we're all wondering.

As previously said, the people considering/taking any drug should ABSOLUTELY be informed about the consequences, people who have no requirement for them (either because they don't need or don't want them) have no need to be concerned about this particular drug over and above any other.

I don’t think the concern is fake. I think we are underconcerned about other meds. Birth control meds cause all sorts of stuff which is why I have never taken them. ADs can also cause all sorts and are strong drugs in many cases. My uncle ran out of them and literally couldn’t get out of bed. Statins cause leg pain to the extent that a relative of mine stopped taking them. WLI has worked for you, that’s great. But plenty of people have legitimate worries about them, as with lots of other drugs. The only drug I take on your list is ibuprofen and I try to mitigate the risk by not taking it on an empty stomach. I don’t think it’s fat hating/shaming. I am fat.

Weird take on things.

That’s very interesting. I haven’t seen that before.

I think that many threads on MN under this guise are definitely disingenuous. Just a goady dig at overweight people or those with less will power than themselves.

Dunno but am seriously considering taking them for arthritis. A friend who took them has very positive effects on her arthritis. I don't know if science has concluded whether they are anti-inflammatory as well. I also have autoimmune. Will ask my rheumatologist about them

But why dont people get upset when say cholesterol medications control someone lipids? Why don't they start Mumsnet posts all concerned about SIL who's on statin, working their way through AI generated 'evidence' to prove their point.

So much effort from the people NOT taking the drug. It really is a strange phenomenon.

Exactly - drugs like varenicline, methadone and naltrexone (for smoking, opiate & alcohol cessation) don't draw this level of worry from totally uninvolved people and all three are comparable to WLI in that they treat conditions that could (in theory) be treated with willpower/ alone.

And all of them are prescribed on the NHS. The vast majority of WLIs in this country are privately funded and so arguably even less of anyone else's business.

The absolute insistence that non medicated weight loss is always better for you than medicated kills me too - even if the poster has said they've done it by cutting out entire food groups, or by restricting their food intake to dangerously low levels. All of that is apparently fine, as long as you don't take a medication...

I don’t think it’s unique to WLI (ETA - I meant to quote the post about people being unwilling to say they’re using WLIs)

Lots of people are unwilling to say they’re on antidepressants, for example.

Id say antidepressants, HRT for menopause, and WLI (notably all medications taken more/exclusively by women) are judged as being things people should ”just jolly well get a grip of themselves over because we never had this nonsense back in the good old days”.
I think that is changing for antidepressants and HRT, but they’ve been around longer. I know the drugs for WLI have been around for a long time, I’m talking about for this purpose though, as that’s where the judgement is.

As an aside, I don’t take hormonal birth control because of the side effects, and I know plenty of women who are the same. So I’m not sure you’re correct to say that people take these things without a care for the side effects.