to think it is acceptable to smack someone if they touch your body, even if they have dementia? Part 2

It's ridiculous how much we infantalise people too.
I've have plenty of experience with dementia and also learning disabilities and difficulties both personally and in my work.
Noone would just expect someone to not react to being groped or assaulted by a client.
Obviously you can't treat it in the same way as you would with someone with capacity, but you don't just ignore it either. You'd report it and it would need to be taken seriously and something needs to be in their care plan to mitigate the risks of it happening.
If someone slapped someone's hand for it or removed their hand or pushed away then I think that would have to be noted too. I'm assuming we are not talking about someone hitting them as punishment or revenge, and we are just talking about reflex actions??

I don't think it's OK to go round hitting disabled vulnerable people.
I don't think people should be assaulted or groped by service users either, and staff and the public as well as other service users need to be safe too

Lots of people with learning disabilities and dementia are quite capable of knowing that they mustn't do this and if they aren't, then they need supervision at all times to stop it happening

This. It is absolutely no use hoping the culprits will change their behaviour. They can’t.

It's a discussion.

Or are you the thread police?

In answer to the OP: swatting/slapping a hand away is fine. Anything more, unless they are assaulting you, is too much.

I can understand it happening once, with the OP having no understanding of nursing home residents and their behaviour.

However it has happened 4 times, and it seems involving 4 different residents. As the OP does not have dementia she could have learned from the first experience and modified her behaviour/ liaised with staff/met her grandfather in a private room to avoid it happening again.

But the OP is repeatedly scornful of the idea that she should in any way change her behaviour while in the company of people with dementia.

You’re still not getting it.

You are in a closed environment.

The people who live there are ill.

Most of them, statistically, have some form of dementia or are so physically frail that they need to be in residential care.

The residents are not free to come and go as they please.

They are looked after by nursing staff and carers.

Due to their illness they may behave in unpredictable and socially inappropriate ways.

Visiting a nursing home is not like visiting a coffee shop or any other place where the general population are.

In a nursing home it is sensible to be aware that you are among people whose illness means that they may hit, spit, shout abuse, touch inappropriately, etc.

Given all of the above it would be wise to accept that and change your behaviour while in that very particular environment.

It’s really not difficult. Be aware of your surroundings, keep an eye on the other residents - what they’re doing and where they are, move away if they approach you, ask staff for help.

Even without PTSD I think that this swatting a hand away reaction is so commonplace that any care plan involving someone with loss of inhibitions should be taking it into account.

Maybe and maybe not.

Because that’s how I know I would deal with it. If that’s how I relive someone’s unwanted hand from MY body then that’s good enough for me.

Edited - no relive, remove.

OP won’t.

Why do you have to swat, as opposed to simply moving out of their reach or moving their hand away? You're doing something that may distress them, and it's not as if they'll learn from it.

So we could be talking about totally different things. You’re going by your experience and possible reactions only and not what the OP is saying in her own words.

What if, say, a two year old non-disabled child touched your breast or something similar?

The second thread was suggested by other posters who felt it had been an interesting, albeit difficult discussion.

My hope is that at least some people who engage fully with the thread will learn more about dementia.

Where has anyone said you enjoy hitting disabled people?

She has said herself that she intends to do it again.

I’m using the word swat as I know that’s the description for what I would do. I suspect it also describes what the OP did.

If someone inappropriately touches me you can bet I’m swatting their hand away.

Duplicate post

You are missing the point.

It’s an analogy.

The OP is refusing to accept that she would be prudent and sensible to modify her behaviour when she’s visiting the nursing home. She seems to expect that people who are cognitively impaired, often severely, will behave as if they are not.

This seems to be the case in the care home OP visits.

No there isn’t. Someone grabbed her breasts, she removed their hand instinctively by swatting it away. Absolutely not an intent to cause harm or cause a person to fear violence.

”Common assault is when a person inflicts violence on someone else or makes them think they are going to be attacked. It does not have to involve physical violence. Threatening words or a raised fist is enough for the crime to have been committed provided the victim thinks that they are about to be attacked. Spitting at someone is another example.”

She made no threat to the person who grabbed her - she was, in fact, defending herself against a perceived threat.

If she goes into the home now and goes up to that person and hits their hand - that’s assault. She did not and has not suggested that’s what she would do.