AIBU to be upset about changes to women-only swimming ponds?

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Absolutely it is. You can donate here

If there’s a crowdfunder I’d contribute. It’s the most blatant discrimination on the grounds of (female) sex.

There is no line. Any man, no matter what he looks like, can use the 'female' facilities, thus making them mixed sex.

Women cannot use the male facilities. They will be thrown out.

This is terrible of course - goes without saying. I'm reading about the Sal Grover latest developments and the whole of Australia is like Hampstead Ladies Pond. Beyond belief.

There is no hive mind.

16% of the people who filled this in have never swum in the ponds 25% of them don't live in London (how often are they travelling in to London to use the bathing ponds?).

I was a regular there 15 years ago with lots of other young women who all appreciated it gave us freedom from the male gaze. I haven't been for 6 or 7 years now. None of the women I know go any more because we don't want to have to deal with pervy old men.

I’m wondering where the line is. If a male identifying as trans or non binary wants to use the women’s pond, is there a yardstick by which to judge that person’s woman-ness? Is it sufficient to announce the identity, or does there have to be an element of costume? Surgical or medical intervention? Could men sneak into the pond by claiming a trans identity, or is there a safeguard against that?

Do females who identify as trans or nonbinary use the men’s pool?

I think we should be told.

Yep, the men get the men's, the mixed sex, and the new mixed sex.

Women get thrown out of the men's (and their possessions binned, including car keys, phones, clothes, bags); or they have the two mixed sex ponds.

I totally agree. This dynamic plays out on this board all the time. Mostly women complaining about men not pulling their weight but carrying on doing it for them anyway. Many women don't see themselves as equal to men.

Needs repeating often.

It’s due to the GRA. If you legislate on it, it will feed through.

On this issue, it's not so much about swimming alongside men. As you say, that's pretty standard.

Its the fact that out of 3 ponds ...

Men get access to 3 and have a single sex one to themselves.

Women only get access to 2 and must share both of them with men.

How can anyone argue that is fair?

I have pondered this a lot over the last few years.

I can only conclude that misogyny is very deeply ingrained in our society and any perceived gains in women's standing over the years have been superficial. A huge amount of people (including many women) believe that men's demands are much more important than women's needs, dignity, safety, rights.

Many are very influenced by the narratives being pushed and can't actually think for themselves.

I'd love to know other people's takes.

I personally wouldn't be happy with it but could cope with swimming alongside trans women the same as any pool. I wouldn't feel unsafe being out in the open. Changing rooms and loos are another matter though.

It’s come to this because society prioritises men’s wishes over women’s. It’s just basic common or garden misogyny.

Am I the only one who thinks, how did it come to this ? Why were businesses so keen.to cater for a tiny majority forgetting about women? I despair
I don't want to see a biolohical man in women's spaces. Simple

They either have to all be mixed sex or they have to have separate sex for males and females. They can't have one for men and not for women, that is discrimination against women. They can't have one for women & transwomen, that is discrimination against men. They can't label them single sex if they are used by both males and females.

Here is the information from Sex Matters if anyone is interested. You can also donate if you want to support the cause.

I mean, it’s a terrible decision, but it is legal not to have single-sex spaces. What you can’t do is claim they are single sex and then let the other sex use it, ao long as they pretend they are the right sex.

But, given that there already exists a mixed pond, it is really stupid not to have proper single-sex swimming ponds too.

A tale as old as time! , only the label and acceptability has changed due to mass campaigns!

This is such an important aspect of the thing: it’s not all about sexual predation by men.
Many women absolutely need to be in male-excluding spaces, for various cultural (and also trauma-based psychological) reasons. These needs are legitimate and serious, and essential for many women to participate fully in both leisure and, in extremis, in refuges and the like.
These damn trans activists pooh-pooh all this because certain men demand validation in their gender-swapping fantasy, and only annexing women’s segregated territory will satisfy this.
It proves, if any doubt remains, that these are indeed men, and manifesting the worst of their sex's bad habits, such as belligerent entitlement and a high -handed dismissal of women.

And as we now know, it's not access to the women's spaces these men want. It's access to the women.

And girls.

validation is a huge part of it though. No validation from being in the mixed pool. They need to be validated and need to be vocal victims when they’re misgendered, (correctly sexed)

This is a perfect example of how trans activists are not happy with third spaces or unisex loos or whatever - they want to be in women's spaces.

There's a mixed pond, they should all use that. I'm a woman and I'd happily use that if I was with a mixed group of friends or even with other women who wanted to use it. But me being happy with that is not the point.

The point is that women should have their own space - or essentially all three ponds should be mixed. Not the women and some men solution.

Go and swim in the much bigger men's pool. You may as well as men are in your pool 🤷🏻