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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask how many times you have seen anyone wearing a niqab (full face veil revealing eyes) or burqa (full face veil with mesh cover for eyes)?

317 replies

Jane379 · 20/05/2026 17:18

I've seen recent talk on UK Reddit about banning them, and I think we should, for several reasons, but I also think in some ways banning is easy but actually integrating people leading a very conservative Muslim lifestyle is much harder, and should be the main discussion.
European countries that have banned found not many women wore them. What about here? Some estimates say 1%-2% of Muslim women, but we don't really know.

I live in S London in an area with quite a few Muslims and have only seen about 10 niqab wearers in my life. Most in more central areas. I've never seen anyone wearing a burqa.

How typical is this?

OP posts:
Original poster
Jane379 · 20/05/2026 23:29

NoGarlic · 20/05/2026 23:24

I was just thinking about the pandemic! (I still mask up in crowded places, btw.) A lot of people got really upset about not being able to see faces, even though it was partial coverage. Lip-readers were screwed. Some little studies showed that many of us increased our upper face mobility and vocal intonations to compensate.

To me, this supports the view that reading faces is central to effective socialisation - it's hard-wired, not just in humans but most other mammals. It's normal and natural to mistrust those who deliberately hide their faces.

Covering or hiding the face in shame is a universal human behaviour across all known cultures. I do not support any system that imposes a mark of shame on all women.

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This exactly!

OP posts:
Original poster
Jane379 · 20/05/2026 23:28

fabstraction · 20/05/2026 23:10

I think it's hard to say it's a choice when someone has been raised to believe that they don't actually have a choice and that it would be wrong and sinful to not make this particular 'choice'. This type of extreme face covering doesn't have a place in a civilised, modern society, in my opinion. I'd love to see them banned, but I doubt it will happen. Too many people are too scared to take a stand.

Edited

I see what you mean...this point though:

' I think it's hard to say it's a choice when someone has been raised to believe that they don't actually have a choice and that it would be wrong and sinful to not make this particular 'choice''

  • by this logic a lot of things various religions teach deprive people of choices since not believing is a sin, various other things will be sins.

Imo I'd argue even if it is a choice, that doesn't mean there aren't good reasons to ban it. Need to see facial expressions, for one. There's Haredi Jewish (the strictest group, a small minority) women who shave all their hair and wear wigs to ensure no man apart from their husband can see their hair. I don't think that's a positive practice either but I wouldn't ban it because it isn't impeding facial expressions. I could think of other examples : hijabs, for one.

OP posts:
NoGarlic · 20/05/2026 23:24

mumofoneAloneandwell · 20/05/2026 22:53

I found it goady 🤷‍♀️ - each to their own, i can imagine you had a terrible time during the pandemic

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I was just thinking about the pandemic! (I still mask up in crowded places, btw.) A lot of people got really upset about not being able to see faces, even though it was partial coverage. Lip-readers were screwed. Some little studies showed that many of us increased our upper face mobility and vocal intonations to compensate.

To me, this supports the view that reading faces is central to effective socialisation - it's hard-wired, not just in humans but most other mammals. It's normal and natural to mistrust those who deliberately hide their faces.

Covering or hiding the face in shame is a universal human behaviour across all known cultures. I do not support any system that imposes a mark of shame on all women.

Beachforever · 20/05/2026 23:21

Jane379 · 20/05/2026 22:46

Why should it be deleted?

There's good reasons to ban. For one thing, facial expressions are how we communicate : a lot of people, me included, find it innately disturbing for someone to have their face covered, no matter how friendly/harmless they may be.

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Facial expressions are not how we communicate. We communicate primarily through words. Spoken or written.

OP, are you Muslim? If not, why do you think you are best placed to have an opinion on the matter? Why does it enter your head to even have a stance on this?

This is not Afghanistan, we do not have laws in this country forcing women to cover up. We do, however, have laws protecting freedom of religion.

If a woman wants to practice her religion and part of that is wearing certain clothes then she is free to do that. What gives you the right to suggest otherwise?

If you have conducted widespread research by talking to the Niqab/Burqa wearing community who have said that they feel oppressed, would welcome government support and would be grateful if you could be their spokesperson, then I do apologise!

IsawwhatIsaw · 20/05/2026 23:14

East Anglia here. Niqab wearing seems to be more prevalent recently. I see them now several days a week.

fabstraction · 20/05/2026 23:10

I think it's hard to say it's a choice when someone has been raised to believe that they don't actually have a choice and that it would be wrong and sinful to not make this particular 'choice'. This type of extreme face covering doesn't have a place in a civilised, modern society, in my opinion. I'd love to see them banned, but I doubt it will happen. Too many people are too scared to take a stand.

NoGarlic · 20/05/2026 23:10

None yet in my tiny market town, but loads when I lived in London - mainly in the West End, Knightsbridge and parts of East London. Also got used to them in Birmingham, and I haven't been there for 20 years so imagine it's more widespread now.

I would support a ban on face coverings. You'd need exceptions for things like motorcyclists while using their bikes, medical needs, etc. But facial expression's a huge part of communication and integration. There are reasons why criminals hide their faces and police/military are told to remove sunglasses when interacting with the public.

Original poster
Jane379 · 20/05/2026 23:08

Toddlerteaplease · 20/05/2026 17:41

Same here. I have no doubt that I’m at fault but I find them incredibly intimidating. As a PP. said, in the same way that people on full balaclavas can be.

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You're not at fault! Humans are wired to look for facial clues as to mood etc, so it's natural to be worried if those are not visible..people in societies where it's really common get used to it, I suppose.

It doesn't help that niqabs are usually black. It's fine to wear black of course but traditionally Western culture has given veiled black figures scary associations.

OP posts:
Original poster
Jane379 · 20/05/2026 23:05

BillieWiper · 20/05/2026 17:39

I couldn't count the number of times I've seen it any more than I could someone wearing a baseball cap or turban or Jewish identifying hats. Sorry idk the name of them.

But yeah, loads. I live near areas that have a high Muslim population.

I've worked with one woman who wore the niqab and she was lovely.

That makes sense if you live in heavily Muslim areas.
BTW, the skullcaps observant Jewish men wear are kippahs : though fewer are wearing them right now due to anti Semitism rising..

OP posts:
Original poster
Jane379 · 20/05/2026 23:03

DoreenDoors · 20/05/2026 17:37

Many when I lived in an Arab state. Several when I lived in Manchester.

I absolutely hate the niqab but I don't know how I feel about banning it. It would set a precedent. The only thing I worry about is men using it to control women by forcing them to not be seen by other men.

I see what you mean re precedent but it doesn't seem to have had ill effects in the European countries which have passed bans.

OP posts:
TipsyLaird · 20/05/2026 22:55

Very few in Scotland. In fact I can't remember the last time I saw anyone. I saw a couple of women in T5 at Heathrow but they could well have been foreigners returning home.

Original poster
Jane379 · 20/05/2026 22:54

SpanThatWorld · 20/05/2026 17:33

Lots in south London. I don't personally like it any more than I like youths wearing balaclavas but it isn't always at the behest of a man. It is quite often a choice by the woman. I've known some women who dress more conservatively than their family as part of their rebellion against them or as part of their own personal religious journey.

I think we have more than enough men telling women what they're allowed to wear.

Yes, I've also read a few testimonies from young women in more liberal Muslim countries like Tunisia that wearing a veil means hiding looks they're insecure about and preventing bullying or comparison on that basis. A sad reason but may be the case for some. Alternatively, it may be to try to avoid harassment.

Agree re it being a rebellion in some cases , too, if parents are more liberal.

OP posts:
mumofoneAloneandwell · 20/05/2026 22:53

Jane379 · 20/05/2026 22:46

Why should it be deleted?

There's good reasons to ban. For one thing, facial expressions are how we communicate : a lot of people, me included, find it innately disturbing for someone to have their face covered, no matter how friendly/harmless they may be.

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I found it goady 🤷‍♀️ - each to their own, i can imagine you had a terrible time during the pandemic

Original poster
Jane379 · 20/05/2026 22:50

AgnesX · 20/05/2026 17:29

I've seen both perhaps a handful of times. I live near an area in Glasgow where there are a lot of new immigrants.

I can't say I'm keen on the full face covering but I'll defend their right to wear it, in the same way that Sikhs wear turbans etc.

I don't think turbans are the same though (nor are hijabs for that matter).
A niqab or burqa hides facial expressions which many find worrying at best.

OP posts:
Original poster
Jane379 · 20/05/2026 22:48

Tigerbalmshark · 20/05/2026 17:31

Also live in S London and work in healthcare (so see women who wouldn’t be out and about). Also used to work in Whitechapel and obviously you see huge numbers of Muslim women there.

I have seen a fair few Somali women in niqabs. Maybe one or two full purple Afghan burkas in my life, and it was years ago.

Really not common, though of course that might well be because these women do not leave the house (you would be really surprised how many women don’t, even for shopping, especially older women who don’t speak English).

This is what I worry. Maybe in some areas where people don't see many, women aren't going out at all if they wear them.

A thought : do bans means that such women stay at home and don't go out?

OP posts:
Original poster
Jane379 · 20/05/2026 22:46

mumofoneAloneandwell · 20/05/2026 17:27

This is going to be deleted, and rightly so.

I dont care what someone looks like under their face coverings - nor under their face mask, under their helmet, under their wigs, under their make up

Live and let live - people can cover themselves however they choose 🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️

Edited

Why should it be deleted?

There's good reasons to ban. For one thing, facial expressions are how we communicate : a lot of people, me included, find it innately disturbing for someone to have their face covered, no matter how friendly/harmless they may be.

OP posts:
Original poster
Jane379 · 20/05/2026 22:44

phoenixrosehere · 20/05/2026 17:27

I’ve only seen them worn in Central London when on Oxford Street but even saying that, it has been less than a handful
of times in a decade. I’m in Oxfordshire and see many women with a hijab but not a burqa or a niqab.

Yes, Oxford Street is also one of the main places I've seen them.

OP posts:
SapphireSteel28 · 20/05/2026 21:17

I see it daily. When my children were in primary school there were a group of about 25 niqab wearing Mums. They didn’t speak to anyone not wearing the niqab, including other Muslim women wearing modest clothing which didn’t cover their face.

WaryCrow · 20/05/2026 21:14

Small northern town. Loads of niqabs in the right part of town. Burka, only seen once here. They are quite rare.

Londonrach1 · 20/05/2026 21:02

Midlands....several times a week..

Tedsnan1 · 20/05/2026 21:02

HobnobsChoice · 20/05/2026 17:27

A fair number. I work in Manchester and live in a neighbouring town with a high Muslim population. It's changed in the last 30 years as I never saw women in the town I live in wearing them. I also see teenage girls with them on too. I dislike it a lot but I also don't feel comfortable with banning it.

How do you know they are teenage girls, if they are fully covered?

JHound · 20/05/2026 21:01

igelkott2026 · 20/05/2026 20:58

It's not exactly a choice.

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Oh yes I forgot. Not a single muslim
woman on the planet has ever decided for herself how she will dress.

Not one.

JHound · 20/05/2026 21:00

I have never been served or attended to by anybody in a niqab though and don’t think I would be comfortable with it (especially medical staff). I see hijabs every single say though and could not care less about those.

igelkott2026 · 20/05/2026 20:58

JHound · 20/05/2026 20:55

Burkha - never
Niqab - frequently.

But I was raised in areas with lots of muslims and live in diverse areas. I don’t care what a woman chooses to wear though.

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It's not exactly a choice.

igelkott2026 · 20/05/2026 20:57

I have never seen anyone in a burqa in the UK but I do see people in niqabs from time to time, but only in London, not where I live.

I really dislike it when I see girls wearing them (and even headscarves). Especially on a hot day when their menfolk are wearing shorts and t-shirts. Tossers.