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I'm fed up with everyone tiptoeing around Brexit having been rubbish

236 replies

paddleboardingmum · 18/05/2026 19:23

We can all see how it hasn't stopped immigration, we don't have the more money for the NHS that was promised, and everyone is worse off. I'm sure even many who voted for it - who were conned at the time- also can see it was rubbish. Isn't it time for people to stop pretending it was a good idea. That doesn't mean we need to rejoin right now or blame anybody, but I think it's time to just face facts and stop trying to pretend it was a good idea.

OP posts:
2dogsandabudgie · 19/05/2026 17:44

SapphOhNo · 19/05/2026 17:40

Are you saying you think Brexit delivered what was promised?

No but I agree with post I quoted above.

hedgeknight · 19/05/2026 17:42

Covid masked the direct impact from Brexit

And all countries suffer from the effects of Covid, climate change, Ukraine war and Iran war

SapphOhNo · 19/05/2026 17:40

2dogsandabudgie · 19/05/2026 17:39

Also people forget the financial impact of covid plus the Ukraine war and now Iran, plus other factors like poor weather for certain crops which lead to shortages of some fruit and veg.

Are you saying you think Brexit delivered what was promised?

SapphOhNo · 19/05/2026 17:39

Swiftie1878 · 19/05/2026 17:37

Of course there were. We’ve stopped paying billions in members’ fees. Billions.

And lost even more in trade and growth...

2dogsandabudgie · 19/05/2026 17:39

Also people forget the financial impact of covid plus the Ukraine war and now Iran, plus other factors like poor weather for certain crops which lead to shortages of some fruit and veg.

Notonthestairs · 19/05/2026 17:39

Swiftie1878 · 19/05/2026 17:37

Of course there were. We’ve stopped paying billions in members’ fees. Billions.

And slashed GDP by 6-8%, lost inward investment and as a result damaged productivity!

2dogsandabudgie · 19/05/2026 17:37

Credittocress · 18/05/2026 19:31

I think most people who voted for it weren’t conned, and to say so is just patronising. The reason many who voted for it think it hasn’t worked is because the implementation has been left to people who wanted it to fail and therefore hasn’t been done competently or in the UK’s best interest.

This, the saying cutting off your nose to spite your face comes to mind.

Swiftie1878 · 19/05/2026 17:37

Notonthestairs · 19/05/2026 17:31

Money for the NHS came from additional taxation and cuts to other departments.
No Brexit windfall. There were no financial upsides.

Of course there were. We’ve stopped paying billions in members’ fees. Billions.

Swiftie1878 · 19/05/2026 17:36

Arlanymor · 19/05/2026 17:24

Yes Wales doesn't matter at all does it? Please don't come on holiday here.

PS. Laugh all you want, but you were wrong weren't you? Almost as stupid as Judge Rinder saying Plaid would never get into power...

Edited

Wrong about what, sorry? I asked a question. You posted the answer. It’s nonsense.

The UK leaving the EU is not the opposite of Welsh independence at all. Wales would leave the UK, in the same way the UK left the EU. Only it would be much harder for Wales since it has no currency of its own, no central bank, and the EU won’t touch it with a barge pole because of Catalonia.

Wales voted Leave. Plaid didn’t campaign on an independence platform. Let’s see how they get on - personally, I’m really happy that Plaid did so well. I think they’ll be great for Wales, certainly better than Labour has been for the last decades.

Thanks for the holiday invite though! 😁

Notonthestairs · 19/05/2026 17:31

Money for the NHS came from additional taxation and cuts to other departments.
No Brexit windfall. There were no financial upsides.

GasPanic · 19/05/2026 17:25

Borrowerdale · 19/05/2026 17:12

we don't have the more money for the NHS that was promised

The NHS has received more than double the money that was ‘promised’.

Steady on there.

Now you're talking actual data.

I checked this out and in real terms it could actually be claimed that the NHS has had a real term increase of about double 0.35 billion/week in 2026 over what it had in 2016.

Arlanymor · 19/05/2026 17:24

Swiftie1878 · 19/05/2026 17:22

Ah, a load of nonsense then! 😂😂😂

Yes Wales doesn't matter at all does it? Please don't come on holiday here.

PS. Laugh all you want, but you were wrong weren't you? Almost as stupid as Judge Rinder saying Plaid would never get into power...

Swiftie1878 · 19/05/2026 17:22

Arlanymor · 19/05/2026 17:11

Here you go - not hard to google it:

Brexit is a failure... by the leader of Plaid.

Ah, a load of nonsense then! 😂😂😂

user281262 · 19/05/2026 17:19

it was our own money being rebated, funded et al. It wasn’t free money!!

SapphOhNo · 19/05/2026 17:16

user281262 · 19/05/2026 17:10

It is a socialist project about the redistribution of wealth. Ours to poorer members and the funding of unelected Brussels bureaucrats. We only ever paid in. £billions a month.

We should go nowhere near it ever again.

“Socialist project” is always a funny description of an organisation built around free markets, free movement of capital and tight limits on state intervention. Also “we only ever paid in” is Facebook meme economics. We got rebates, funding, investment and frictionless access to our largest market. But sure, wrecking trade and growth to save a fraction of GDP from “Brussels bureaucrats” was definitely the masterstroke some people still pretend it was.

Thank you "user281262" for your insight.

GasPanic · 19/05/2026 17:14

SapphOhNo · 19/05/2026 15:37

But the issue is that “nothing remarkable happened” is itself a long way from what Brexit was sold as. We were told it would boost growth, unleash trade, cut red tape, reduce immigration and give us major new economic opportunities. Instead, even defenders are now arguing the effects are basically negligible and too complex to measure clearly. That’s quite a retreat from the original promises. And there’s also a difference between economists warning there would likely be economic costs from creating trade barriers with our biggest market, versus politicians actively promising obvious upsides with very little downside. Those are not really equivalent claims.

Leave said things that have turned out to be untrue.

Remain said things that have turned out to be untrue.

I don't see that Remain should get a free pass just because they lost, any more than Leave should get one because they won.

I don't see any difference really between politicians and economists. Two sides of the same coin. Both of them have their political axe to grind, and I don't believe everything that comes out of the mouths of economists is politically neutral - in fact far from it from the time I spend studying their analysis.

So to repeat. Again. I don't see as Leave or Remain being any better behaved or more accurate than the other in terms of things they suggested would happen during the campaign and the actual outcomes . And I don't see any significant macro/gross data to show that Brexit has been "the worst thing ever/rubbish" in economic terms.

My view obviously doesn't fit with the narrative that a lot of people want to put forward that Leave somehow behaved a lot worse than Remain. That we have indeed suffered catastrophic economic decline since undergoing Brexit.

Sorry about that. If at any point I see something to make me change my mind on the matter I will be sure to let everyone know, not that anyone will really care.

Borrowerdale · 19/05/2026 17:12

we don't have the more money for the NHS that was promised

The NHS has received more than double the money that was ‘promised’.

Arlanymor · 19/05/2026 17:11

Swiftie1878 · 19/05/2026 17:09

How is independence the opposite of Brexit?!

Here you go - not hard to google it:

Brexit is a failure... by the leader of Plaid.

user281262 · 19/05/2026 17:10

It is a socialist project about the redistribution of wealth. Ours to poorer members and the funding of unelected Brussels bureaucrats. We only ever paid in. £billions a month.

We should go nowhere near it ever again.

Arlanymor · 19/05/2026 17:09

paddleboardingmum · 19/05/2026 17:06

The OP was about ordinary people not acknowledging it, not politicians.

I was saying about MPs and the media not acknowledging it (explained that in the thread but its quite a long thread now.

Yes to be fair I was just responding to someone who directly quoted me and incorrectly asserted that no politicians have made the point. I've been having a new boiler fitted today so not much time to scroll back. Either way, our first minister has said in the past very clearly that it was a bad idea. But I guess it's not 'enough' of a politician for some people perhaps?!

Swiftie1878 · 19/05/2026 17:09

Arlanymor · 19/05/2026 17:01

The OP was about ordinary people not acknowledging it, not politicians.

And my first minister did: https://www.itv.com/news/wales/2024-03-21/i-see-independence-for-wales-as-opposite-to-brexit-says-plaid-cymru-leader

How is independence the opposite of Brexit?!

paddleboardingmum · 19/05/2026 17:06

The OP was about ordinary people not acknowledging it, not politicians.

I was saying about MPs and the media not acknowledging it (explained that in the thread but its quite a long thread now.

OP posts:
Arlanymor · 19/05/2026 17:01

YourGiddyGreyHelper · 19/05/2026 16:16

Because no party leader will come out and say it

The OP was about ordinary people not acknowledging it, not politicians.

And my first minister did: https://www.itv.com/news/wales/2024-03-21/i-see-independence-for-wales-as-opposite-to-brexit-says-plaid-cymru-leader

YourGiddyGreyHelper · 19/05/2026 16:16

Arlanymor · 18/05/2026 19:25

Why do you think we don't all know this?

Because no party leader will come out and say it

MaggiesShadow · 19/05/2026 15:59

I think if you were the type of person to vote for it, you're unlikely to be the type of person to admit this. Probably unlikely to admit to the real reason for wanting it, honestly.

And were probably too busy in London at the weekend to do much reflecting on it.