The UK’s default “property over everything” investment culture feels unhealthy

There are millions of people who have never invested in anything dodgy and have the tax relief afforded to pension investment. Not doing it and being scared is poor advice. None of the failures affected us and everyone should have a mixed portfolio. In some areas property has barely made any money. Most pensions have.

True. I am at the end of the boomer generation, Early Gen Z. Yes we bought young, but at 98% mortgages at 10% interest. Our first teeny tiny flat, we made no profit, our terrace we went into negative equity. Our first house we did make a small profit, and we had paid down a lot of the mortgage. This house, our endowments didn't pay out as promised, so we had to find tens of thousands extra to pay down the mortgage. The profit we have made has therefore been eaten away by non performing endowments, and of course the improvements you make to your houses over the years. I often think the supposed value added to your house over time is overstated. If we could offset expense and inflation, it would be way less. But...... We never rented, and that had so many benefits, your own home, a roof, and when we lost jobs, we felt so much more secure, which also happened a lot!

We also never had any extra money for pensions or investments until fairly recently. All the value is in the house, because that's all we could afford.

@Rookie93 That period was notorious for lack of protections against mis-selling and fraudulent investment schemes. My DH had family members were taken to the cleaners for thousands by McDonald-Wheeler and Barlow Clowes, which some older people may recall. No compensation.

Equitable Life was another scheme often recommended to professional people that went bang, taking the pensions and life insurance savings of hundreds of thousands of people. You've mentioned the Mirror Group and British Steel, and don't forget BHS. I'm sure there were others. Even now, DH absolutely refuses point blank to have anything to do with stockbrokers or equity based investments.

One element I often think posters miss when discussing the reliance on property to generate a passive income is the series of pension miss selling scandals during late 80's & 90's plus the horrendous issue of the Mirror pensions fund and British Steel pensions among others. Many people have had trust in financial advice and institutions eroded and been badly treated. Where were ordinary people meant to go to ensure security for their future and their families future. Property seemed and still does seem an easily understandable asset.

No rental property - ludicrously high rents as demand isn’t met. Choose what you prefer. No rental property isn’t a great investment everywhere and we’ve made more from other investments. Plus we get tax savings on pension contributions, you don’t on mortgage contributions.

DC has just bought a small house to live in from a landlord who's leaving the game. Average price for the area: not cheap but better than paying £1000 per month for a shared rented house.

For someone to get 10% interest on their cash savings, someone else has to pay a mortgage rate of 12 -14%.

You mean the tenants that could afford to buy if landlords having bidding wars over properties weren’t driving up housing prices?

Spain gave me the idea.

As a country we have always been very conservative (small c) about investing.
We just don't have the American attitude to investing, which is why RR's reduction in cash ISA limits has caused such fury.
People in the UK won't suddenly rush to invest in fintech or start ups, they will just bung it in high interest savings accounts instead.

Ageing population though with not enough workers to support them

Only through immigration Yes, and that creates more need for housing.

And people wonder why we have low productivity 😆

House building is expensive and the profit takes longer to realise, the time from land purchase to build is long. Large housebuilders typically make 15-20% profit, given the risk and time not huge. Most people don’t seem to understand this with their ‘just build more houses’.

Getting 20% return on investments is outstanding and not within the normal return. An adviser will typically quote 6% is you are medium risk and it’s all about risk. I think housing growth has slowed and will stall, I think at the bottom end people are maxed out. Following renters right bill, renting is now very risky and tax laws have taken away advantages.

Having your own property is security. At the end of day I have somewhere safe that I can’t be kicked out of. A property will always have value, stocks and shares can crash and depending on your age, leave you in a difficult position.

Definitely not! And because we insist on keeping them that way, we price out people from living in the areas where statistically they'd be the most economically productive.

High housing costs are not productive

I don't have the current figures to hand, but last time I checked there was something like £23 'invested' in property for every £1 invested in the productive economy.

If you're wondering why your salary has flatlined for twenty years, a large part the answer is in there somewhere.

I wish I’d started investing in a stocks and shares ISA years ago but was totally ignorant about how much it could bring in over a long time period. Although I also saw a relative really badly burned in the 2008 economic crash.

But are you factoring in that the tenant who would be renting there is now going to eithercbe homeless or else also bidding to buy? So either you have an increase in homeless people or you have the same number of people competing to buy?

Many people do expect it to increase in value though & for a long time it did, outpacing earnings.

Love this idea. Is anyone suggesting this or have you just come up with it?

Only through immigration, and we have no idea where that is going. Pretty much every other European state, populations are shrinking.

They have built thousands of houses near me, and can't sell them. Affordable or otherwise. And still they keep putting in planning, and still the labour government wants more.

How about 20% increases year on year in a managed fund, including over Covid? I wish I had never bought a flat in the 2000s and just stuck to sticking it in funds.

Surely the majority of people buy property not as an investment but because they want to own their own home and the security that brings?

I think it's levelling off a bit. There seems to be increasing awareness that a lot of gains from the 2010s weren't that in real terms, even for those who are able to sell their properties.

Where did you get that from? The population is growing.