To want stability in this country and to be fed up of all the witch hunts

Labour may as well not bother having a leader - they are totally ruled by the left wing back benchers so nothing economically sensible will ever get passed. Why bother with the middle man or (god forbid, woman, in their case)

Well the results speak for themselves. I hope Keir rides it out but would be happy if Andy was able to be the leader eventually.

Lots of landlords don't just "buy" houses and rent them out. Lots buy up the run down ones, the auction ones, unmortgageable ones, semi derelict business premises, churches, etc and do them up to rent out, i.e. a combi mix of property development and landlords. If they decide it's not worth their effort, those "homes" don't become homes in the first place as most buyers won't be able to take on a development/renovation project.

Again: landlord are not creating wealth, they extracting it from assets. If you are going to stand up for business, you should be angry at:

Brexit: we added a lot of friction to our import/exports and increased dependence on materials from even further afield than before. Then add -

The pandemic, which royally screwed supply chains and now the Ukraine/Gaza/Iran wars, which are further impacting energy, food and good prices, and -

The nonsensical IR35 decision 10 years ago that ended flexible labour for knowledge works and make businesses less agile and able to deal with market fluctuations

THEN you can talk about business taxes.

Honestly, you’re not being serious about the economy of your main concern is private landlords. They are not a priority compared to half a dozen other economic issues.

Nail on the head. I agree with all those points.

It's a very lazy argument that the UK is just being swept along by international factors and that there's nothing we can do about it.

As you allude, the UK has actually damaged itself by stupid governmental decisions/policies over the past couple of years, and made the factors caused by global effects worse than they otherwise could have been.

It's not the time to hammer businesses and landlords when we need economic growth and more homes.

Global markets haven’t resulted in the job losses and business / high street closures that have hit the U.K. - they are caused by a government policy of increasing the tax on employment.

The shortage of social housing, high rents and the increasing cost of housing benefit aren’t caused by global markets, they are caused by government policy.

The stagnation of the housing market, with the knock on effect on the retail and construction sectors aren’t the result of global markets. They are the result of a government policy of increasing the transaction costs to prohibitive levels.

The loss of jobs for the young is also not a result of global markets, but of government policy making employing young, inexperienced people too risky.

To the extent that mortgage and borrowing costs are high because of global markets, market sentiment is driven by government policy, belief in the governments plan and the control that the government has over its taxing and spending plans. So markets are just reacting to government policy.

To just blame markets is to misunderstand one of the key purposes of government IMO

Get the economy going - AAahh good idea why don't the politicians think of that - but how? We have a huge public service/ nhs that needs funded, then benefits to be paid, almost no manufacturing as it is all done in China, some financial and banking which does make money and some new AI / IT based stuff.

The Green energy deals which were going to bring jobs - hahah, put up a turbine then what - nothing, just money going to the land owner and the huge cost of buying in the turbines from China. Put up pv panels, bought from China - no jobs there once installed.
We are short of brickies, joiners etc but no training schemes.
Bricks imported from Pakistan apparently as it's cheaper than uk ones.
Rubbish infrastructure as no money to build stuff, everyone harder up so can't spend - yes, the economy is going to fly - I can't wait

Especially post-Brexit. We may not be being “held back by the EU” now, but we’re also now a much smaller fish whose big patron has decided to start taking chunks out of us and anyone else allied to them. A bit of EU-style protection in numbers is looking pretty appealing these days.

You don’t really regard private landlords as “business,” do you? They’re just asset holders collecting rent, and arguably part of the housing price problem.

The biggest barely-discussed hit to “business” happened quietly around 10 years ago, when the IR35 rules around “concealed employment” came in for knowledge workers and basically ripped the guts out of freelancing. There are many, many organisations who benefit from supplementing their perm staff with contractors on a project basis, and many experienced workers who would rather be their own Ltds than employees, but they’ve basically been quashed. It’s had a dreadful impact on organisational agility, but you hear more complaints about renters’ rights on private landlord than you do about the end of 1-person Ltds.

Never Voted Tory in my life but I did like Phil Hammond. He just seemed a really decent guy.

I agree with the OP.

Not just PM's either. The media want to cause trouble and division throughout Parliament.

Look at how they hounded Tim Farron for having Christian beliefs when he was leader of the Lib Dems.

Look at how they ridiculed Phil Hammond when he was Chancellor, calling him "Spreadsheet Phil" because he actually wanted to understand the detail - which is exactly the kind of Chancellor we need rather than grifters like Rachel.

Nail on the head. It's ALL about the economy and growth. Get the economy growing, thus increasing GDP, thus reducing unemployment, and you raise tax revenue AND reduce benefit spending. Yet Labour hate business and nearly everything they've done so far has been anti-business, anti-landlords. It's just simplistic sixth form standard politics of envy. We'll not grow the economy by increasing benefits and public spending. Such increasing have to come after growing the economy.

It isn’t that simple though is it as we are at the mercy of global markets. So basically we need a PM who is good at damage limitation.

The noise about Government cronyism, corruption, incompetence, along with dissatisfaction around immigration and the cost of living would all be just that - noise - if the Government would focus on one thing: Growing the economy and making people better off. If the average voter has more money and feels better off then, generally, they feel happier. And, surprise surprise, if the economy is growing there's higher tax revenue and more money for the government to spend without increasing taxes. Compound that by people being more willing to swallow higher taxes if they still feel better off and there's even more money to spend on public services. It really is that simple :)

It's the football-isation (made up word) of politics. If the manager hasn't won the league in five matches, get rid of him. And everyone's picked their team for better or worse.
I'm not sure who Farage is in this analogy...Harry Redknap perhaps..

Yep me too. The media bay for news stories. Not everything is a bloody news story. Sometimes it’s just about getting a job done. Imagine if Churchill had had to deal with this during the war? Bloody ridiculous!

I agree with a lot of this, but I also think that being reviled by both pro-Palestinians and pro-Bibi Jewish Britons is a bit of a good sign. That particular conflict is very binary, and its proponents absolutely believe if you’re not 100% with them you’re against them and are therefore trying to kill them/promiting genocide. You can’t really win without picking one “team” and dismissing the other.

Pissing them both off is actually quite positive in my view: the British government should not be fighting Isreal/Palastine by proxy on UK streets, and it needs to get on with stopping people from trying to do just that.

That's a really good piece from someone able to look back and reflect. The loss of public service as a mindset is so obvious across society not just in politics. I do blame the Tories for starting the rot but he's right about the dangers of the career politician. Full of slogans and ambition but have never worked a hard day at anything.

Half the back bench are like sixth formers scared their friends won't like them. They're not adult enough to hold their noses and do what needs done. They still don't get that they will never be invited to the weed and rainbow glitter parties because being an MP is a job for grown ups, not self-serving children. Maybe the worst offenders will fuck off to the Greens and 'Your Party' - snurk - and leave the sane people to govern the country.

This is exactly what John Major said here, reported on the BBC news.

Britain must not keep changing prime ministers, Sir John Major has warned in a broadside at those who treat politics as a "game show" while leaving big problems to the next generation.

It is like a continuous revolving door ever since Cameron and his giant fuck up. Due to the need for continuous sensational news headlines reported in a social media/reality tv manner 🤬

And the MP on this morning was talking about the next election. It’s like they think their only job is to be elected and play party politics

Totally agree. I’m not Starmer’s biggest fan, but I think he’s doing a decent enough job overall, and I’ve actually been quite happy with how he’s handled foreign affairs, especially standing up to Trump when needed.

What worries me is that if he goes, Labour doesn’t really seem to have anyone particularly strong ready to step in. They could easily end up cycling through leader after leader the way the Tories did, each one weaker than the last. At some point you just have to let the man get on with the job he was elected to do.

Agree with most of you . The media is up to their usual tricks of brainwashing people. People need to wake the f up. It is a shame that the Labour MP’s are so powerful crazed and asleep too. Decent plodders with depth and integrity will never be considered good leaders. Instead we will get the Farage and Johnson’s. Gordon Brown was someone who would have been an excellent prime minister for longer than he was but of course the media destroyed any hope of that . Same with Ed Milliband.

The problem is that Labour politicians are undisciplined. Even if Starmer wants to do something that might improve things, the left wing come howling out and block things. 🤷‍♀️

Now, there’s more of a financial mess.

They need a strong leader, and I’m not sure there is anyone better though.

I agree. A commentator put it well yesterday. ‘No one feels the Labour government is on their side’

This is exactly their problem. They have implemented policies that have made things worse for so many people, as outlined above. They have a knack for pissing off both sides - for example stating they will cut welfare and then not doing it both pisses off those who don’t want changes to welfare budgets and those who do. They have managed to be equally reviled by Jews and their allies and pro-Palestinians. That’s quite a feat.

Their dalliance in identity politics claiming women have penises, men have cervixes and babies are born without a sex made them look dishonest, desperate and foolish. No one thought that even they actually believed this. That didn’t help. Then rolling back on this meant they have pissed off both women’s rights campaigners and trans activists. Again, quite the feat.

the Labour party's lack of courage to have a clear strategic vision and principles, and to be prepared to anger some to do what they think is in the country’s interests, has just lost them the respect of everyone.

No one feels Labour is on their side. And I don’t think the Labour’s party knows whose side they are on either.

That’s their problem.

Those on this thread claiming the Labour Party is just a victim of hard times and the media have got it wrong. The Labour Party have created a giant mess for themselves in addition to ruling in hard times with 24 hour media.