Is a more left Labour government what people want?

It wasn't even a "swing" towards Labour. Starmer got barely higher proportion of the vote than Corbyn did the previous time. What happened was that Sunak caused a massive loss of Tory votes. That's how Labour got their massive majority - it wasn't because they attracted more voters, it was because huge numbers of historic Tory voters didn't vote Tory.

Are all these threads just posted by Reform trying to back up their "success"? They're all remarkably similar and filled with disinformation and wild generalisations. It says something interesting about the future of politics and government if people are being manipulated in this way - and by interesting, I mean along the lines of "may you be cursed to live in interesting times".

I refer to last week’s results.

Remember, many of the anti-Farage posters, previously suggested that the older demographic (or gammons as some were called) were dying off etc.

So, how do you explain his popularity now?

I think Alexandra answered that one in a nutshell when she wrote Farage was given a massive platform for his repugnant views in the 2010s.

I’m not a Reform voter, I think Farage is a fascist. But I see why people want to vote for him. We’ve had successive governments who haven’t championed Britain or British workers and it’s been a disaster. France and Germany laugh at us. They have both got protectionist loopholes they use when it’s in their interests.

Theres a good 2 part documentary shown on BBC2, probably still on iplayer. It’s worth watching. It shows resistance to immigration was gaining ground from the early 2000s. I still think Farage has been pushing on an open door.

Proliferation of quangos, spads and onerous recording and reporting requirements.

Tories started off with the intention of rectifying some of the bloat through civil service reform but the coalition, Brexit and later Covid slowed all of that down. And the Tories were pretty much carrying on from New Labour as Cameron moved them more to the centre.

How do you explain the rise of Reform?

No i'm not ignoring it... we just lost a re fitting of the David Attenborough ship to a Danish boatyard, done under rules introduced by Sunak in 2023... that the lowest bid should carry more weight.

Labour are changing these rules but too late for Falmouth.

An interesting use of statistics... but the bottom line is, that migration or the EU in 2010 was not, for most people in the UK, an over riding concern... it became more of one as Farage was given a massive platform for his repugnant views in the 2010s....

He now promises to deport people given asylum, given right to remain... EU citizens too, deporting people legally here, he promises levels of deportations not seen in Europe since the 1930s.

Labour are reducing the payments for disabilities & tighter criteria, increases are due in no small part to changes from legacy to UC and a rise in MH conditions in younger people.

Suicide rates in the 20 to 35 male age group is up by 30% (since 2010) so presumably these MH issues are genuine.

How would you address these people?

@Alexandra2001 Notice you ignored Brown’s ‘British jobs for British workers’ comment. It would have been a bizarre comment to make, apropos of nothing. He made it in 2007.

UKIP vote share increased from .4% in 2007 to 3.1% in 2010, a 675% increase. That is significant.

Angela Rayner and those calling for more Left Wing politics should remember that the last GE there was a swing to Labour that was really a protest against the awfulness of Boris and Truss. So Labour is benefitting from a blip. Many of those voters will not be voting Labour next time.
Major, Blair, Cameron, (Clegg?) won the centre. That is what usually wins here in UK.
Will the centre vote to re-join the EU? I doubt it.
The ideas that Starmer has about re-joining are now so dramatic that we would have to have a referendum. One line in the next Labour Manifesto would not be sufficient to answer the Democratic accountability questions. Especially at the prices we would have to pay. France and Germany have already given us warnings on this.

Is the use of the shorthand “left” and “right” truly useful shorthand? Because Labour started out acting for workers, but now it has drifted into paying as many people as possible not to work and to allocate very high demand work to relatively few people.

It’s a terrible way to run a society because we need to work, it’s wired in. We just need to do a reasonable amount of work and have a reasonable amount of time to look after children and family relationships.

The “left” doesn’t promote that. 🤷🏻‍♀️

Well, respected polling companies say this is what the polling shows..... but of course, in some areas, immigration IS a deep and valid concern, which makes it even more weird that Cameron took away financial help for areas most affected.

UkiP got 3% of the vote in 2010, so tell me again the peoples of the UK were sooo concerned about migration?

On 2010 GE lose, it was a hung Parliament, with an electorate deeply unhappy about the state of the economy after the GFC....

Interesting you mention Bigotgate... a story hammered by the 'right wing media to drive Brown out, same as they have done on all issues negatively affecting Labour... its almost like they had a 5 year plan from July 2024 to destroy any chance of Labour being a success.

Cameron was the UK's weakest PM, terrified of his shadow, let alone ERG wing of the Tory party... called a referendum, then run away.

I think they should stop giving themselves wage increases and put money into things people want such as being able to get a doctor's appointment like you used to be able to Spend money fixing roads and pavements They should be making places accessible for disabled Much smaller classes in school I've no idea what's left or right Id just like to see changes that improve people's lives

@Alexandra2001 ”4 million people, primarily from Africa and SE Asia came to the UK in 3 years under Bojo and Sunak..... they will never return, yet you think Labour were/are the problem.
Funny how more right leaning posters don't mention this huge and permanent change in the UKs culture and population.”

You are not wrong, but also Blair could have throttled EU immigration. Both have had the effect of holding down wages, from carers, to bricklayers, to IT roles.
Labour need to drop immigration to near zero (100k? 50k?) and publish exact figures of how the 100k managed to qualify for immigration, and how they help the country.
Facts hopefully will speak louder than sound bites.
How have 204k got in last year? Where is the reasoning so people can see who is coming in?
The small boats illegal immigrants should also be interned, regardless of the cost, regardless of the outcry.
I have zero faith in Reform, Restore (fuck off!) or the next rendition of the Tories.
But they will govern if Labour don’t sort out immigration. They have the time to do it.

Labour have lost sight of the fact that the working class always used to believe that you took responsibility for yourself, you didn't get something for nothing because there was a thing called pride and you paid your dues. That's what it was like when I was growing up in the Red Wall in the 70s and 80s.

Labour have presided over a benefits culture, redistribution to that benefits bottom from the middle instead of real wealth at the top*, and now champion a vast number of luxury beliefs centred on diversity that leave most people cold.

*real wealth to me is someone with assets of £10m+, not someone who is earning £100k+ a year.

Blair got it catastrophically wrong with allowing the A8 countries immediate rights to work and claim benefits back in 2004 rather than applying the 7 year brake like the other developed nations of the EU did and we have been on a downward spiral ever since. How can you have the levels of inward migration we've 'enjoyed' for more than 2 decades now with a non contributory welfare system? Our politicians have sold this country very cheaply, without asking us our opinion first.

But surely if you want more right wing policies, without the outright racism of Reform, you are served by the Tories?

Lots of politically homeless Labour voters are left wing and have no choice but the Greens, a party beset with problems. Ultimately centrists are the people not being well served, and the Labour Party were, could and should be a left of centre party. At the moment they have moved into right of centre politics so no wonder many of their voters have abandoned them. And their position is madness given they will never be right wing enough to capture the votes they are chasing.

Such as? And if you’re right why didn’t the Tories rectify it during their 14 years in power?

Maybe a lot of people did vote Green who want a more left wing Labour.

But equally, a lot of people want a more right wing Labour.

People who want a more right wing Labour may move to a more right wing party or not bother voting at all because no party seems to represent them anymore.

I've seen a lot of people on MN saying they feel politically homeless, including me. If people who used to vote Labour stop voting that will benefit right wing parties like the Conservatives or Reform.

The media is always hardest on whichever party is currently in power.

I think a lot of the people who voted Green were trying to send a message to Labour that they want a more left wing Labour. All eyes seem to be on Reform, but the vast majority of people didn’t vote for them. Labour have to stop trying to out Reform, Reform. It can’t be done, nor should it. They won’t capture those votes anyway. Bonkers to me that they aren’t seeing that. Labour need to remember who they are and what they used to stand for.

How much did your chosen party (I'm guessing Green based on your stance on Gaza) attract of the electorate?

What kind of thing?