To tell son it’s too much and affecting his dad’s self esteem.

I haven't read the whole thing, but I'd be telling my son that he can live his life his way, and he can do his Dad the courtesy of respecting his EQUAL right to live his life his way.

And being an obnoxious self righteous bore never convinced anyone to change their lifestyle.

Not sure what you mean by that? 😵‍💫

How basic.

Your DS is probably an Andrew Tate's fan.

I'd start being very blunt in your responses tbh. Doesn't sound like tiptoeing around him is working and he sounds insufferable.

If someone came into my house lecturing me about having a glass of wine they'd get one warning to drop it and change the subject and if not they'd be kicked out. Start just ending the conversation and not listening to the lecture.

Tell him to go away if he appears early in the morning uninvited as well. No excuse for that outside emergencies!

YADNBU at all. Just tell him kindness matters too and his Dad is hurt by his behaviour. Also agree that you should decide when he's allowed to visit, e.g. 11am at the earliest!

Sounds like he's gone down some kind of rabbit hole, influenced by these motivational speakers and self help books. And god knows what on the internet. I know young people are more into the gym and don't drink much but this sounds worryingly obsessive. Talking to his dad like that will have the opposite effect. Nobody ever gave up fags, chips or alcohol because they were nagged to death about it. And lecturing his 80 year old grandmother on lifestyle choices is beyond a bloody joke. I'd keep an eye on him if I was you. But in the meantime you need to politely tell him to put a sock in it.

OP I genuinely can’t believe you can’t just talk to him and make him see what he’s doing and how it makes everyone feel. He’s a grown man, you’re a grown woman. 🤷‍♀️

Take the key and tell him he needs to message next time

then next time let him find you in the garden dressed like the 118 men (I think - do you know what I mean?) doing star jumps. Or throwing a ball to each other saying ‘to me, to you’. And then bore him to tears about the mr motivator routine you’re both following twice a day and offer him a bowl of celery

Christ, he sounds like an insufferable prick.

Tell him to shut the fuck up or leave your home.

What he chooses to do with his life is up to him, but he doesn’t get to dictate to others or try and force his beliefs on other people.

And put a latch on your side gate and a latch on your inner front door, so that he can’t just let himself in anymore.

I would keep reminding him about people who have written all these self help books have sometimes died young as well like Michael Moseley and Jim Fixx.
and I am sure some have died of boredom " or I certainly will if I listen to another one of your silly lectures.
Don't let him get away with it , I wouldn't worry about upsetting him by the sound of it, he has a very thick skin. If you don't want him coming around when you are in bed leave the key in the back of the door, or make some " suspicious noises " when you hear him downstairs. Lots of "more more that is so good" while banging the headboard.

Is he neurodiverse? My autistic granddaughter is a bit given to this sort of thing.

This ^
If you hear him come in whilst you're still in bed make sex noises and jump.up and down on the bed for extra affect. He'll soon get the message lol.
"Sorry son we're making the most of our freedom, you're lucky as yesterday dad had me over the kitchen table so at least you didn't walk in on that lol.. David, you did clean the table before coming to bed didnt you? No, sorry luke I'd make sure you don't put your sandwich on the table if I were you. Dad needs the extra food hes eating to keep his energy up for me, any questions?" hee hee.

You could actually have a lot of fun with this OP

I would take the key off of him and tell him he needs to text to see if it's convenient for him to visit first and never before 11am on the weekend. My adult kids have keys but they would never be so rude as to turn up without checking first.
With his constant lecturing I would always reply the same "You chose to visit if what you see offends then please feel free to leave. If you don't feel able to visit without lecturing then I suggest that you cut down on the number of visits until you have something more interesting to say as it is ruining the relationships between us and that is the last thing either I or your Dad would want"

No, she isn’t. Her husband doesn’t need OP to make excuses for him, as he doesn’t need any excuse at all. He isn’t answerable to his son.

He’s a grown man that has every right to make his own choices, good or bad. His son doesn’t have to like them, but unless he wants to further alienate his parents, he should respect his father’s right to make those choices for himself.

A lovely lad? I don't think so.

The problem, though, with people who are “Just trying to help” is that they’re often tone deaf; they don’t pick up on clear hints that their advice is unwanted, or are so convinced they are right that they become frustrated and push harder. This is what the son is doing here, and he’s inadvertently pushing his parents away.

An old school friend of mine did this on Facebook. He’d lost a lot of weight, which was a great achievement, and rightly got praise for it. But he became so proud of himself that he felt the need to constantly evangelise. Several posts a day about why on earth wouldn’t people follow macros, eat clean, go to the gym daily: didn’t they want to be healthy and see their kids grow up?! He understood, he’d been there, he could help people if they’d just listen…

Closer friends than me had obviously called him out on it, as his posts became more and more frustrated in tone. Why was nobody listening? Of course, this actually made people disengage with him even more. As one of my other friends put it, “When you’re posting on Facebook about macros and clean eating on Christmas Day instead of spending it with the kids you were desperate to see grow up, you have a problem”.

Your poor mum. Is she able to refuse to take his calls?

Someone like that is likely to be like that in all aspects of life. I have worked with that kind of person (funnily enough he didn’t last long at the job). But you don’t have to listen to his shit. Shut him down every time. The more you tell him about how his dad is affected the more power you are giving him.

And if he won’t shut up, tell him to leave. (You might want to change the locks before this of course)

I always had a key to my parents’ house because I could be trusted with it (and because I used to cat sit). Assuming he is letting himself in, take the key or change the lock.

You both need to stand up to him. Whatever his intentions, he is being controlling. You hopefully wouldn’t accept that from a partner (and actually it does open the question to whether he is like that with any partners he may have).

The next time he pipes up, tell him that you don’t want to know and that he has no right to speak to you like that. He sounds quite bullish so when he tries to turn it into an argument, tell him to shut up (I know that’s not a popular phrase but it’s effective). If needs be, just ignore him like you would a small child.

He should only come round when invited if he comments on things. I always call my mum before I turn up.

Yes. What has happened to honour thy parents? It was one of the Ten Commandments for a reason. My YAs are lovely people and I love the very bones of them but boy do they not hold back giving unsolicited advice and yet neither have worked full time, maintained a home on their own, married, given birth, or raised children yet, but they don’t seem to think there is anything wrong with proffering their opinions on those very subjects. They are both working pt while studying and still partially funded by us. I don’t like to remind them of that as it sounds so churlish but on the other hand, how do we remind them politely that we might just know a few things about the world having lived in it for much longer?

I reluctantly agree that there are aspects of this generation which have become rather entitled. They read so much on-line about toxic parenting, and while we are not perfect parents by any means, I reckon our generation of parents have probably invested the most in their emotional welfare and have invested much more time and energy in their upbringing compared to previous generations. At the same time, while it’s absolutely unacceptable for parents to offer any sort of constructive advice to their late teen, or young adult dc, it seems perfectly acceptable for them to offer it to all and sundry!

Not surprising really when Instagram and You Tube are full of influencers making money telling them to eat this way, schedule their time time that way, invest their earnings in these five financial products, clean their bathroom following this method, journal in their diary using this formula, work out following this example. Perhaps they think that is how the world operates?

🤣🤣🤣🤣 I was thinking this!!

I had this exact same thought. This happened to my friend at around the same age as OP’s son, he became obsessed with one of the famous American life coaches (TR) - restricted so much about his eating and health that it made normal social interaction awkward, spoke about little else, sharing all his learning with family and friends at every opportunity and spent an absolute fortune he really couldn’t afford attending flashy events in exotic locations that sounded very cult/MLM like. He got extremely thin and his mental health suffered.

Tell DS he has to message and wait for a reply before dropping in, this is no longer his house, he’s 25 with his own. If that doesn’t work add an extra bolt to your door for overnight or take back your key.

Be stronger in your push back to every comment. It may originally have been from a well meaning place of concern for his father’s health but it’s gone way past that and wouldn’t be acceptable for you/DH to keep saying stuff like this to DS as a grown adult let alone the other way around.

I think it sounds like you are making excuses for your 55 year old husband. You seem to think that age is a reason to just give in and not make any effort with diet or exercise. I think your son might just be trying to make his unhealthy dad a bit healthier!

I would tell him that now all your children have left home the lie in involves sex and that is quite healthy at your age! I doubt even he will have an answer to that!
I'm guessing he is still single because he sounds insufferable and none of my 3 sons would dare behave like that