parkrun defending their position

I think that also some people will take what parkrun says as being correct without ever thinking further about it. Just because parkrun makes false statements about it being 'not competitive', some people simply repeat that without thinking... well fuck... why then are there course records noted down and published.

The contradictory position is exactly why parkrun is now subject to legal action. It cannot make such false claims and expect that people will simply fucking believe them.

My DH stopped running the Park run because of this.

Indeed. It's as if outside of their own particular bubble, they just don't care one jot or see the wider picture. It's really upsetting because fundamentally these people are saying that males and their feelings are more important than my DD and her feelings. Why?! Just why?!

You do know it was originally called the Bushy Park Time Trial? Doesn’t sound like a fun run to me. Even when it moved into something more inclusive of different abilities the intent was the timings not just the run itself.

I find the attitude of some of the ‘mothers’ on this thread worrying. If you’re happy to see women’s rights being handed to men, what other rights do you think your daughters should give up to men. what sort of message do you think this is giving them?

Do better!

I’m a parkrun event Director and I think whilst Park events are wonderful the people at the top of HQ are a bunch of . I’m hoping that momentum will take over and sooner or later they’ll have to change.

This guidance is incomplete. Schedule 16 of the Equality Act provides exemptions for organisations. It allows you to restrict membership on the basis of protected characteristics. You can’t then discriminate once people are members.

The minute parkrun accepted £5m of public funding is the minute they have to obey the law and kick the blokes out of the women’s results. If they want to continue to act unlawfully they need to stop taking public money. It’s that simple!

Sorry I forgot to add the part about discrimination

”1. Know the law
It is unlawful for an association to discriminate against or victimise its members, associates and guests, also its prospective members, associates and guests, because of the following protected characteristics:
age
disability
gender reassignment
pregnancy and maternity
race
religion or belief
sex
sexual orientation”

There aren’t any justification requirements for associations

I’m not sure what you mean there, since you’d previously stated “Because you can have a group for women and a group for trans women” do you mean they don’t have to justify their discrimination against male people/male people who aren’t trans/trans people who aren’t male?
Unless they keep the membership numbers (presumably for the two groups as a whole, otherwise they’re basically just trying it on, for want of a better phrase) under 25, then yes, there are still requirements, they’re not free to discriminate at will.

”Part 7 of the Equality Act 2010 states that an association is any group that has at least 25 members and regulates admission using rules and a selection process.”

https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/equality/equality-act-2010/equality-act-2010-guiding-principles-associations

That last sentence goes to the crux of the issue. Trans identified males can race off at the front, pootle at the back, or meander in the middle; just like every other human running Parkrun.
What is not fair is if they categorise themselves as female.

You are really using the word “inclusive” to describe someone who is uber competitive in a fun run? 😆

I was responding to the general point someone made about freedom to form groups, it wasn’t related to park run.

There are specific provisions in the Equality Act for sports and single-sex provision. I am talking about associations

It’s so weird when people just keep baldly insisting that black is white or white is black just because they say so.

I guess it shows that they can’t justify their position and the unfairness at all and just have to resort to a blatant untruth. It is strange to see though.

Why not? There aren’t any justification requirements for associations (unlike for charities and single-sex provisions). It probably wasn’t intended to be used in this way when the legislation was drafted but I agree with previous posters that it is otherwise overly restrictive on people’s freedom to do what they want.

@IAmBeaIDrinkTea @MummyWillow1
You are right that Parkrun is a fun run / inclusive etc but it is also competitive for many of the front runners.
The issue is that because, at population level, males are faster than females, females don't have true equality if their times aren't ranked within a sex-based category.
So imagine a teen girl runs a Parkrun amd achieves '1st lady' and that her times are also good enough to get into the London mini marathon (won in the past by lots of now famous runners). If a boy were to run as a girl and beat her, she could lose that accolade/place.
You may not care about competition for you. But it is important for some people; and girls have just as much right as boys to the accolades and race entries that Parkrun can give them.
And the front runners (as long as they're not aggressive pushy shouty twats - sadly that does happen) have as much right to run Parkrun and get a good time and accolades (as my DD would), as I have to lug myself round at the back.
Things can't always be about males, even if they're trans-identified. Girls matter too.

To compete against yourself. To better your personal best.
So get rid of publishing them all together then.
That'd be ok. Just send us an email with our own times on.
Although I bet there'd still be people whinging and moaning.

That’s lovely for you.

My proposal is that all people who are not bothered about the competitive element and those who don’t want to compete fairly (ie registered as their correct sex, age, whatever) opt out of the published timings and rankings and just run.

Then the trans people can run happily with all you non competitive people and the competitive people get some nice accurate rankings for their sex and age.
are you up for that?

Would you opt out of rankings to support trans people? I’m sure they’d be very grateful.

And again.

It is competitive by nature if any course records are noted. Certainly it is competitive if the course records are published.

Just denying it is a competition while this activity is recorded and published doesn't change the fact that very activity makes it 'competitive.'

But-but-but 'It's NoT a ComPeTitiOn!' Bs it ain't. If it has entry categories and publicly listed timings and placings, it is a competition! People need to stop lying about it. It's a competition and we all know it!

They can claim it’s not a competition until they are blue in the face. Until they remove the elements that make it a competition, they will be wrong.

Do you generally believe that words have meanings?