Voting for Reform.the north/south

It's strange how the Labour Party, the supposed worker's party has inadvertently, become one of the strongest advocates for increased competition for jobs...

Yes, that resonates with my experience of Reform voters too. Its 'stop the boats' and that's it. Very worrying really as many of the people saying this are those who will suffer most from a Reform government. People on benefits, people highly dependent on the NHS or more likely to be, who don't seem aware of the rest of the package that comes with Reform and how it will make their day to day lives worse.

For Most of them immigration is the big issue. They do not want our town to become like certain parts of London and places like Bradford etc.

Everything else is secondary.

These are their views as you asked. Not mine

Next time someone tells you, would you ask then why? And if they can reply in more than a sentence and they talk about any of the multitude of issues that matter in governing a country aside from immigration, would you mind posting a summary? Because everyone knows everyone is voting Reform, is of less interest than why. I feel there must be something 'everyone' may be aware of that I'm not.

Thanks for clarifying.

Sorry should of said “everyone I know who has told me who they are voting is voting reform”

And they have no reason to lie to me I’m not some skinhead thug who will beat them if they say they’re voting greens. I don’t even like telling people who in voting

@Tuiy

I’m only talking about people who have told me their voting intentions. Of course the majority of people I know haven’t actually told me who they’re voting

is slightly at odds with

Everyone I know is voting reform and I’m not talking about carefully selected friends

I’m only talking about people who have told me their voting intentions. Of course the majority of people I know haven’t actually told me who they’re voting and for all I know it could be the greens.
Im not a scary person nor am I voting reform so they have no reason to lie to me

People are very open about their voting intentions in you part of the world! I know my DH's intention and my neighbour's, because they have a board in their garden, and a couple of friends. But not colleagues or business/trades people who I am a customer of etc.

If 'None of the above' was a ballot option, it would win.

Re organisation isn't overhaul. It's just re arranging the same services, with different names and letterheads. Our services has been re named at least 4 times in the past 10 years as it was shifted from trust to trust. Nothing on the ground changed in reality, if anything theu sre getting worse.

I think the relevant phrase is something like 're arranging the deckchairs on the titanic'!

I’m also in the south, a small town in the far south actually. Everyone I know is voting reform and I’m not talking about carefully selected friends. I’m talking about family members, colleagues, customers at my work place and even parents at my children’s school.

And a few would vote restore if they could

Quite. I was working for a PCT when that happened. The place was full of contractors earning upwards of £300 a day - bear in mind this was 13 years ago - and the whole of the NHS was thrown into turmoil for a couple of years. It cost £3 billion. And saved nothing.

There won’t be a definition of what a proper Brexit means.

It has to remain an unknowable unquantifiable fiction - otherwise it would get pinned down to reality and that would make it more difficult for Farage to sell.

Well that’s why I asked the PP what they meant.

It means different things to different people
That's part of the problem and why people talk about proper Brexit as they had their own ideas about what it means the vote was in and out that simple, that's what we got

I meant that PP referred to a “proper Brexit” so I wondered what that meant.

Really? The Lansley reforms were a lot more than "tinkering around the edges", more like the biggest ever re-organistion of the NHS . Abolition of SHAs, creation of CCGs and NHSE.

Of course it doesn't have to be explained. But you'd think if someone was so committed in their beliefs they'd start a thread about supporting Reform or put up posters or speak socially about their voting intent, they'd be prepared to explain, wouldn't you?
Because if you're not capable or willing to have a conversation that goes a little deeper than "I'm a proud Northerner and I'm voting Reform, me! But dont ask me why because i dont owe you an explanation you smug leftie." Then you've rather wasted everyone's time.
And you're not going to be convincing anyone that the stereotype of Reform voters not being not the sharpest tools in the shed is unfair any time soon.

I don't remember any total overhaul in past 20 years, just a bit of tinkering around the edges, which as you say cost lots but didn't acheive anything

Just on this - I believe that the conviction rate for murder was significantly lower, as juries are much less likely to convict when doing so would lead to death (I’ll have a look for a source!); we’d end up with more murderers at large

Many people who did vote Labour in 2024 will switch to Reform, you can see this in the local by elections mapping. The red to turquoise is high, as is red to green but that’s not as relevant to the posts here.

There are always going to be people in society without degrees, that’s necessary, they might vote Labour or Reform and even switch between the two. They also don’t have to pass some explain it test on why, broadly one shows more what they’re after or it’s a get someone else out vote. It doesn’t have to be explained.

I've not read all the pages, but has the following theory developed: Metropolitan 'elites' (ie graduates living in cities) voting Green or Labour, inhabitants of run down old industrial towns voting Reform, rest of the country, a mix of everything?

It all comes down to one question: Who gives you hope?

So @EasternStandard what are your views on Rachel Reeves? If you still can't articulate them, perhaps you'd like to apologise for repeatedly insinuating that I'm racist, apparently for the purposes of negating my viewpoint and attempting to get your like-minded cronies to bully me off the thread.
Ready when you are.

I don’t think they’ll let up as it’s really deliberate and not nuanced.
Reminds me very much of my school days (yes I a WC and pretty rough comp) where girls would deliberately bump into you in order to accuse you of pushing them to start a fight.