To think this is utterly disgusting?!?

Nothing I have posted should appall or disgust you. I stand by every word I have posted on this thread.

I feel exactly the same way, to be honest. I am appalled and disgusted at your posts and would not be able to say what I thought as I am trying to stay polite.

@magneticclocks There is nothing inflammatory or rude to say 'make it make sense'. Your posts OTOH are certainly inflammatory. Stop repeating lies.

"make more sense" is incredibly rude and inflammatory.
As far as I know Hamas said in news interviews in the ME which were not aired in the west that the video had not been released by them and that all that you saw was false flag. The same for the decapitated babies.

I am telling you what was said. Your rudeness to me is completely unacceptable.

It doesn't make sense.

It's upsetting ... I'm sorry to anyone badly affected by the turn this thread has taken. I really hope @MNHQ do not tolerate this implication that these women would lie about rape when there is so much evidence even though this one poster continues to deny it.

Hamas don't represent Muslim values & I'm sure that Hamas broke those values many times on 7/10/23 with their murderous rampage.

They said they were celebrating the taking of hostages, which were to be used to get the large number of Palestinian hostages to be released, I think. That had been seen as a Hamas victory, as they had got through the fence. As far as I know rape is against Muslim beliefs, not fighting. I don't mean to be rude but I am shocked that you are asking these questions, as this is all quite well known.

Shani Louk - yes I did mean her. What happened was horrific, and the photos were awful.

And “the woman in the pick up” - Hamas apparently told the people in Gaza “it hadn’t been them” or “it was false flag” or “fake” (?), and yet at the same time they paraded her body around and passers by spat on her, but they couldn’t have possibly celebrated violence because “it’s against Muslim beliefs”. Make it make sense.

I responded to a poster about the likelihood of celebration and have since then had to deal with personal attacks from you and others. I am simply saying to you all over and over again that your posts to me are not acceptable and explaining why. So clearly not doubling down as you say. And the "quite a few people" are all people who you post alongside a lot, I have read your posts on many threads and I personally think you all tend to post in quite an extreme way and follow the same ideology. This is just my impression. You may disagree.

But since your accusations have widened, I will confirm again what I have said (several times and posted evidence). Abi W (the Green Party Woman as you call her) posted tweets which basically said the same thing as the professionals who were appointed to investigate rape after Oct 7. That the professionals had said that there had not been evidence provided, that they had asked Israel for evidence and nothing had been given, and that there was very little evidence at all and nothing which suggested that rape had been systemic. They said that the fact that there was little evidence does not mean there was not rape. The decapitated baby story was also said to be not evidenced. And in relation to rape there were examples given of where rape had initially been assumed but then found to not be the case according to family members - this is what Jewish family members had said publically.

The Dinah report has come since then. As has the UN report.

So you can see there is conflicting evidence.

The people who talk about evidence and are critical of the Israel state might be saying that they found the initial reports by professionals to be more convincing, or they might be saying that they think that the information has been provided by Israel and is false and intended to justify the tens of thousands who have died in Gaza since then.

I don't know.

But what they are not saying are the various things they are accused of saying in this thread such as "Jewish people don't matter" or "Jewish people were raped and that is ok" or "let's celebrate". Unless they have said that? I haven't seen that reported anywhere.

In the past governments have lied about rape in war, and the lies later confirmed (so not a theory) and I could give you examples which are both very recent and also going back to wwI. If no one had investigate these things, for fear of being told they are rape denying, we would never have known.

What do you think it was people in Gaza celebrated after the October 7th attack?
Some abstract “Hamas victory”, where no violence had taken place, because that would have been against Muslim beliefs?
”The woman in the pick up”, do you mean Shani Louk? People in the streets in Gaza were spitting at her mutilated body, and yet Hamas claimed she was killed by someone else? Is that what you’re saying?
Would you at least admit that the people doing the spitting were “celebrating”?

'and that the awful videos released if the woman with the BLOOD stained trousers HAD BEEN BRUTALLY RAPED' by Hamas who fucking well filmed themselves doing it.

I won't write what I really think of you @magneticclocks because it will get removed by MNHQ.

It is about the fact that Palestinians celebrating what they saw as a Hamas victory would not be celebrating something Hamas had said they hadn't done.

But how do you know what Hamas (and others who stormed across the border on October 7th) told other Palestinians about what they had or hadn’t done?
They might have officially tried to deny the rapes committed, and at the same time bragged to their mates about it.

Dead women can't 'come forward'.

There was evidence of rapes. The evidence in reports has been shared on this thread several times. Victims who were raped and then murdered cannot 'come forward' as is the case in any British court when someone is raped and murdered, the victim cannot present themselves.

The 'Green Party woman' as you refer to her, was wrong. There were rapes. She has deleted her tweets. However, they were screenshot prior to deletion.

I'm not misunderstanding. I'm not misrepresented.

Numerous people have pushed back at you and what you have said, on quite a number of your posts, now. Those people also disagree with you. However, it is clear you intend to double down on your stance.

There was evidence of rapes. People were raped. Men and women. A testimony of a live victim was shared up thread from.a man who was raped. Some people don't believe him.

Err no... the Green Party woman said that there was no evidence and no victims had come forward and that even if that had not been the case, it would not have justified what happened in Gaza.

So everything I have said is relevant to the thread and to what has been said on the thread. And I have pushed back at the accusations of rape denial as that is not what was tweeted and that has not been said here.

You are either misunderstanding or misrepresenting.

No, I don't agree.

I have not asked for evidence.

I have explained to you that people who say "there is no evidence" are not denying rape. They are talking about information coming from the Israel state and how it was used to justify flattening Gaza. It is not "utterly disgusting" to do that.

This is a site for mothers and mothers care about the world their children are growing up in.

Have you watched the report I linked? Why do you think there is a conflict in information?

Indeed.

Goodness, what a stretch. Are you often prone to suggest people say things they didn't. You've gone off at a tangent from the thread discussion and comments about whether there were or were not rapes. A massive tangent bringing in things not discussed.

I think I'll leave it at my comments:

There were rapes.

Some people deny it. They are disgusting.

The Green Party spokesperson make some tweets. She was challenged on them, over whether there was proof of rapes. (The thread topic). She was robustly challenged on those views. She deleted her tweets, but didn't apologise. If she is happy with her accuracy (in what she originally stated) why delete. She was wrong, hence her deleting the tweets. However, no apology issued.

Enjoy your day.

(Rape is never resistance, it's an evil crime, whoever does it).

Seems like certain posters don't get it @Crunt

I think you might be misunderstanding the discussion generaly, but I have responded more fully to twiglets and inamarina about this, and it also applies to what you have written here.

@Twiglets1 @inamarina I am finding this exchange really distasteful, but I do think this needs to be pushed back on. The other poster said "I can assure you there are people who don't give a monkeys that Jewish men and women were raped and some even celebrated it happening even on 8 October 2023 immediately after they had taken place". On 8 October Hamas said that the accusations of rape and decapitating babie and other things were fake news or false flag. This is not about "did they rape" or "do you believe them". It is about the fact that Palestinians celebrating what they saw as a Hamas victory would not be celebrating something Hamas had said they hadn't done.

I have also pointed out that people who are talking about evidence are not denying rape, they are saying that Israel used information like this to justify flattening Palestine. I am not giving personal views here. Yet you (plural) keep ignoring that, refuse to discuss it and keep insisting that it is rape denial and disgusting. Meaning that anyone who says that they think Israel gave fake information/could have been culpable etc and that this is relevant to what happened next are silenced by you (plural) instead of being able to raise concerns about what is happening in a geopolitical sense and the risk it poses to everyone.

And I have said upthread that it is a well researched issue and in some cases admitted that incorrect information has been given by governments in the past in order to justify wars - here I am thinking about ww1 and Britain, or the Iraq weapons of mass destruction, just as examples. The fact that it is Israel which is involved this time shouldn't stop any of us from questioning every aspect of what has happened.

They might have SAID "there were no rapes" however, they were clearly incorrect, since there WERE RAPES.

'THEY' got it wrong.

Obviously.

If they said there were no rapes, how could they be celebrating rapes?

They could have committed rapes, celebrated them and later tried to claim to the rest of the world they didn’t happen.