Can we stop acting like everyone has an equal capability to become well off?

I read a book recently called "Hired". A journalist went undercover in 4 different low paid jobs. One of them was in an Amazon warehouse (the others was a call centre, being a carer, and an Uber driver). Was an eye opener and worth a read.

People at the bottom wouldn't turn the cogs without someone at the top giving them those cogs and ensuring they are turning at the right frequency.

How many years have you been on benefits? they aren't paid by cogs turners, but by people who chose to become successful = net contributors.

No one disputes that "cogs turners" should be able to live good enough lives and have sufficient income to house, feed and cloths themselves. But to say that low achievers are only there because of bad luck is simply stupid. Unless disability involved of course.

He pays them?

Yes, but he is only successful because of the hard and unrecognised work of the people at the bottom.
And that is a point many if us have been making in this thread. We need the people at the bottom for the cogs to turn. Yet those very same people are called failures, lazy, should try and do better etc.

And you talk like Jeff Bezos is a charity and pulling people out of hardship and helping them. Bullshit.

Yes, but he is only successful because of the hard and unrecognised work of the people at the bottom.
And that is a point many if us have been making in this thread. We need the people at the bottom for the cogs to turn. Yet those very same people are called failures, lazy, should try and do better etc.

And you talk like Jeff Bezos is a charity and pulling people out of hardship and helping them. Bullshit.

Jeff bezos created the infrastructure and system for their labour to actual have meaning, value and have productive outcomes. They don't just work in a complete vacuum.

And it is sad that people should go though life thiknking their only value is what £££ they make.
A poor artist could make a wonderful piece of art that brings someone joy for years.
An abused child could have been helped by a low paid social worker, and managed to get their life on track.

In contrast, I am thanking Jeff Bezos for nothing. I am thanking the poorly paid driver from bringing stuff from his warehouses, that have been picked by a poorly paid picker.

Because that's what society wants to pay and how society values it. Pay isn't magically determined by a fairy that decides fairness. Pay is decided by what people are willing to pay for it. By what the employer wants to pay someone.

@adlitembut you’re not pretending that we all would be able to succeed in any subject. I can’t draw or paint. I can’t easily complete maths equations. Other people can’t write poetry like me or sing like my friend, or play multiple instruments. Wouldn’t it be great if all skills were celebrated equally? Why should social work pay so much less than being a solicitor?

I thought there had been studies done about this claim that there are multi-generations of people who have never worked... and it was a myth?

Social mobility is so, so rare, and it always has been. We may not have the caste system but it’s true that for the vast majority of people, their job will reflect the social standing of the job of their great, great grandparents. Yes there are outliers but that’s exactly what they are.

Add to that since the welfare state there are multi-generations of those who have never worked, which is a recent-ish development. To be born into that kind of scenario and then become a doctor or lawyer would be virtually impossible, for all kinds of reasons.

Do you want a solicitor with the same level of training as a social worker?

Because they want to be social workers and not solictors?

If social workers want higher pay why didn't they train to be a solicitor

@BlueJuniper94but we need both!! Who would solicitors work for if everyone was solicitors? Plus what do all these high flying people do in there spare time? Watch plays, listen to music, go to art galleries, read books, listen to podcasts, laugh at comedy… all created by people who have different sorts of brains. How boring would the world be if we were all logical, STEM graduates or if there was no creative people? Is that really what you want?

@adlitembut you’re not pretending that we all would be able to succeed in any subject. I can’t draw or paint. I can’t easily complete maths equations. Other people can’t write poetry like me or sing like my friend, or play multiple instruments. Wouldn’t it be great if all skills were celebrated equally? Why should social work pay so much less than being a solicitor?

@adlitembut you’re not pretending that we all would be able to succeed in any subject. I can’t draw or paint. I can’t easily complete maths equations. Other people can’t write poetry like me or sing like my friend, or play multiple instruments. Wouldn’t it be great if all skills were celebrated equally? Why should social work pay so much less than being a solicitor?

Working hard in a cut throat industry isnt for everyone though. It might mean that they burn out faster, or the pressure is too much.

I agree with the PP who said that sometimes someone might choose a lesser paid job with fewer responsibilities, but they feel happy. Nothing wrong with that either if it means better mental health and life work balance.

Seem to me all the opportunities are going to people from Chinese, Indian, African or Bangladeshi backgrounds. They are naturally smarter than us and work harder, so need a quota system to level up unfair system.