We don't want the government to lurch to the left

I want Starmer to stay and I want stability for a few years and frankly better to now do nothing and let healing take place. They have done enough about migration to stem that and no more action is needed ( eg restricted family repatriation rights and 10 years for citizenship). The economy is showing green shoots of growth and we just need stable government. If people see a more prosperous country we won’t get reform because reform will completely mess up the country.

You can’t blame one demographic because you think another is being ignored !

Rental Housing costs are a fallout by attempts to stop private landlords buying up properties. Picking holes in landlords was bound to rebound

House prices increased due to demand from an increased population post war. ( it’s no one’s fault for being born )

There is now free childcare which hasn’t been around for that long ( I didn’t get any ) so a new introduction for the young

National minimum wage was introduced in 1999, before that we had no protection at all

Employer contributions to pensions only became mandatory in 2018 - another obvious one for the young

Support in paying a mortgage ( be it limited ) is a very recent thing , in the past people’s homes were repocessed. Helping all those with a mortgage
etc
etc
etc

Whilst some things have improved others have got worse but your list is not correct in that and worthy of weighing up the pros and cons historically.

The cost of borrowing went up yesterday just with the thought of a change of Labour leader being more left wing. That way leads to higher borrowing costs and the IMF coming in

The government cant afford to bail you out or subsidise you though, so what's the alternative? People need to live, they need to earn to live, we all share infrastructure that needs to be funded, and that requires tax.

"Anti-business attitude" 😃

Is this what you are calling any sort of regulation intended to protect employees and workers these days?

I used to have an investment in a business that made medium fancy cakes. It would take 1 person about 3 person hours to a make a batch and we could sell the batch for about £33. At the time minimum was about £6.5. It was low skilled work that pretty much anyone could do with 2 hours training. So roughly £19.5 of labour and then £8 of ingredients/other costs. Therefore we made a profit of £5 about 15% which was ok. Minimum wage increased about £8.5. But weren't willing to pay any more the batch. So now we made a loss of 0.5p. At that point our viable business because unviable and we closed it down. This is a bit simplified and I can't remember the exact numbers but for those staff it meant their job was gone. It was heart breaking at the time to close a business due to government policy but there was no point making cakes for a loss.

Again, what are your credentials in Economics?

These global companies do report country based earnings. All of them. But then they have costs incurred abroad. Cafe Nero? price of imported coffee beans, bought through their internal supply chain, can make them "notoriously unprofitable". Then franchise costs, etc. You technically can't close this loophole but if you do, the leave the market. Good riddance of course, but 1000' of jobs will go with them as well. And you price of cap of coffee when out and about will rise as well.

@DiySteve It’s not really anything of substance.

I favour a European model but can’t see the electorate voting for it, red or blue.

Things were famously so much better before NMW, when we had casual contracts, and pretty much the employer-driven free-for-all you are advocating.

Except, no they weren't. We still had rampant unemployment, wage slavery, and enormous proportions of our workforce living in poverty.

Guess what? Commercial business is driven by one thing only, profit.

There are lots of roles that just don't exist because the economic value is less than the minimum wage

Yes, because employers can't pay minimum wage and still turn a profit from these "roles", so why is your expectation that someone should fill them and live in penury regardless?

Anyone with an ounce of common sense is not going to go and work for a mercenary employer who cares not a jot about them, for a pittance wage that sees them living in poverty anyway, when that job comes with no prospect of advancement and carries no benefit or perks, and especially not against the backdrop of gutted employment law which also means no leave entitlement, legal protection against vindictive employers, no SSP, no pension, etc etc

You would genuinely be better off sat on the sofa, because you wouldn't have the expense of work, and you wouldn't have the headache of trying to find childcare, or be at risk of missing out on xmas etc because your employer invariably expects you to work holidays and so on.

We've been in your situation before, and it was utterly fucking miserable.

Our country doesn’t have enough money being generated from private sector jobs because there are not enough good quality jobs in the first place due to lack of innovation, class system, offshoring and the UK living the past… These good quality jobs create a cascading effect across the economy providing money for downstream private and public sector jobs. Coupled with an aging population, supported by an ever decreasing working population the government are having to find new ways to raise money and are borrowing more and more which is making UK PLC very vulnerable. I try not to think about where we are headed but am very fearful about the future.

The NHS is a leviathan, and is protected, chiefly because the majority of those who work for it, vote Labour, I suspect.

Slash and burn waste, punitive contracts, overpaid consultants, time wasting patients presenting with self-inflicted dependencies on alcohol/recreational drugs.

How’s that for a start.

That business could've afforded market rate wages before NI and business rates hikes

Not all businesses should survive though. The 08 crash which we never recovered from was different to previous recessions in that unemployment was lower but wages were impacted. This is impacting productivity now.

I think this is a ridiculously alarmist thread and I question the motivation. Maybe more regular MN’ers will be reassured that this is genuine but it sounds more like a deliberate attempt to stir up outrage on MM for poor journalism.

You're banging your head against a brick wall. I'm stunned by the anti-business attitude on here.

New legislation would have to be introduced to ensure companies operating in the UK can only report earnings per country they operate in. By having to submit earnings within the UK and not being diverted to low tax jurisdictions would be a good start!

@DiySteve im asking what the alternative is?

It is not. It's called Keynesian economics and it's what rebuilt the country after the Second World War. Incidentally, Keynesian economics was also the model behind Roosevelt's plans after the Great Depression and this led to America becoming one of the richest countries in the world.

Labour pretty much has the Blairite lot, or did, and those further to the left. Now McSweeney’s gone I can see the left could push for more policy changes.

Come now, Starmer is trying to placate the back benches, and head off a later leadership challenge from Rayner - it’s the price he must pay to remain PM.

It wont save him, of course.

@DrPrunesqualer I’m not sure what is getting lost in translation. Pretty much all my posts have mentioned how we have screwed over the young 😆

You miss my point I’m afraid.

I wanted the PP to know that circa 25% doesn’t reach NHS operations/patients, as it pays for pension liabilities.

The Labour Party is left wing. There’s no lurch. A return to fundamental values perhaps. But no lurch.

Do you have any credentials in Economics?

I can't afford to pay a decent wage!!!" is as straightforward an indicator as there is that your business isn't viable.

That business could've afforded market rate wages before NI and business rates hikes. What do you believe a decent wage is? the rate is define by eternal laws of supply and demand. One of the reasons for our inflation, esp in services, is rising wages. But for SME to pay higher wages on the top of higher costs and taxes the only way is to increase prices. But their customers are hit by increased taxes as well, so can't pay more, despite rising wages.

increasing numbers of educated people are leaving partly down to taxes
so They won’t be there for you when you are old if people don’t appreciate we need to support them now.