To think Jeremy Bamber might be innocent

Im guilty over the years of rabbit holing this case, reading and watching too much about it. Im not like this with anything else!

I’m doing exactly this now! Helping me displace some difficult stuff I have in my own life tbh.

I’m listening again to the last couple of episodes of the TNY podcast. Two things strike me: Sheila’s handwritten notes which don’t amount to a suicide note but potentially reveal declining mental state, despite medication. Also the foster care that was discussed - and verified by the housekeeper - was that the children would stay with June and Nevill, not go into foster care outside the family.

Thanks for that. Yes early on here i said id never be helpful on a jury due to being so on the fence when listening to each side.

Im guilty over the years of rabbit holing this case, reading and watching too much about it. Im not like this with anything else!

They keep throwing out any new 'evidence' which is odd, if there was indeed a call at 6am this should be looked at. And im very childish as I think hes in the right place either way, which is NOT what the legal system is about 😁

Sure, but as mentioned many times on this thread, some of the circumstances in this case likely mean the perpetrator was a psychopath. But JB has been assessed as not being one.

I think Bamber did it but the paucity of evidence demonstrates to me I’m not even 50% sure he did. Nobody should be convicted because of a hunch like the one I have or because there’s a lack of other credible suspects or because there isn’t much evidence. I’m looking forward to seeing what happens with the CCRC about the phone call he may have made.

He was probably eaten up with jealousy and
injustice and thought they deserved it
..

I mean how can you be jealous of someone who is living with schizophrenia, yet he was like a petulant child that she got more attention!

Gosh yeah I hadn’t thought of that - you’d be lamenting you left the gun there

was that the gun she was supposed to use then?

Plenty of cases out there of men killing their wives and vice versa for the insurance money.

What do you think could have happened that night?

Absolutely.
If he had genuinely done that it would have been inexcusably careless in a house with children, never mind Sheila.
I think one of the things I read commented that it was suspicious that he wasn’t blaming himself more for that. I think most people would!

I believe he was assessed and deemed to be non-psychopathic.

Well this is it, yes folk were lax. But it's a bit of a coincidence that evening he took the loaded gun outside to shoot rabbits. Yet no rabbits were harmed in the staging process. He didn't shoot any.

He then left it in a very convenient place to tell the police a few times that it was there and she was mentally ill.

Yes I suppose I just find it completely perplexing that someone could plan to carry something like this out- lay the groundwork, frame a family member, and then not to mention being able to execute two sleeping children, keep up an act in the aftermath (and have the family dog put down as well!) and NOT be diagnosed as a psychopath.

Ah ok

im still suspicious J left it leaning against the wall loaded - it would go with his staging the scene “she grabbed the gun in a frenzy”

Many people were unbelievably lax about firearms in the 80s, particularly in the countryside, and Neville Bamber was at the laxer end apparently (despite having small children around the house, a mentally ill daughter and according to some accounts a son he didn’t trust).
Secure storage only became a legal requirement in 1988 in the wake of the Hungerford Massacre.

Yes

and leaving the gun out is strange - I thought gun users had a safety process

be interesting to know if he usually put the gun away

Yes some people are just selfish and entitled

trying to sell the pictures of “Bambi”
days after begs belief

I don’t think the existence of a financial motive rules out him being partly motivated by stronger emotions too.
There’s evidence (which he disputes but then he would) that he was chafing at the control Neville had over him, resentful of Sheila’s illness. It could have been pent up rage as well as money.

Apparently the police car overtook him and he arrived 5 mins later

all his actions seem stalling to me - which would makes sense after the adrenaline and moving to the period when reality sets in

There is a cultural gap too - in perception

Yes, lots.

I do find it very interesting that no physiological assessment over the four decades he’s been incarcerated have found enough conclusive evidence of a personality disorder or psychopath tendencies. I wonder if there are any other convicted murderers of multiple people that have also not been shown to have these traits by multiple experts.

If the twins died before their mum then they aren't in the "inheritance line" I believe. As it was told by Jeremy that Sheila had gone berserk with a gun, then she must have killed them before killing herself, IYSWIM. I'm sure that the order of deaths was mentioned during the case as it was something I didn't know (survivorship clause/ simultaneous death) and I can remember reading about it and thinking oh that makes sense.

Great post. You've worded wonderfully what I wanted to say about the case but couldn't do it without sounding crass so didnt go there.

In some ways i wanted to believe it was Sheila, she was ill and it was still a huge tragedy, but I could find understanding for it.

Its why I had such doubts for such a long time too, the thought that a human being had it in them to do it for money,

Its hard for us with all our technology and knowledge of forensics and DNA which we have now to look at it thinking he was clever but he was stupid and made mistakes.

He thought hed done enough, and he nearly did.

Also if you are used to a particular sound you continue sleeping. My mum lived near a railway line as a child, the trains passing didn't wake her, but if one didn't run she would wake up.

It's difficult to read a balanced view because so much is biased one way or another.

That would make an interesting documentary, having people from both sides investigating the other side.

Maybe I need to read the Carol Ann Lees book.

I'm glad it wasn't just me who picked up on the DeFeo parallel. I was hesitant to mention it, but I read the NY article with the mentions of previous sadness attached to the Farm and wondered if it was an oblique but intentional reference.

Anything like that is a dangerous path to go down in terms of credibility within a legal framework. The main difference here of course is that the offenders have taken completely different stances, JB has never admitted guilt, nor insinuated "the voices told me to do it" - that has been projected onto Sheila, and the absolute truth unfortunately died with her in terms of the true state of the family dynamics.

Human psychology is incredibly complex. As I mentioned before, cold blooded murder of one's entire family including children purely for money is beyond the scope of most people's comprehension. It is for me, because alongside the natural revulsion, it implies very bleak things about human nature. When psychopathy appears to be ruled out, that makes it even worse. And we're back to creating answers for every anomaly in terms of JBs actions. He thought he was so clever, yet made damning mistakes. If it was some sort of long con it defies logic. And round we go.

The mishandling of the scene and evidence really did screw this case up though. While investigation techniques / protocol may have changed / improved now, I don't think taking things so much at face value in the moment back then would / should ever have been the norm.