To think free birthing should be entirely banned

I agree the discussion around the risks of childbirth should be pragmatic. Babies do die, and so do mothers, even in hospitals. But needlessly to court either of those outcomes is foolish. Childbirth is dangerous, probably the most dangerous thing any woman can ever do. And there are numerous ways in which childbirth can go wrong. Best to be in a place where help is quickly available and with people who know how to help.

Pay for a private midwife?

Why can’t I get what I want for my deviated septum then? Or a knee injury I’ve got?

Surely that will be because the vast majority of births are in hospital

So what are you supposed to do when you know you birth very quickly, the hospital tells you not to come in when you’re in labour and asking for an examination, and then they themselves actually advise that you should consider a home birth if you get pregnant again?

Should I opt for an accidental free birth instead because someone on the internet who isn’t clued up on everyone’s individual circumstances and risks thinks a planned homebirth is selfish. 🫠

I think that planned free birth is insane, but then I also believe in vaccinations and the like.
With DD3 I had a terrible time, shoulder dysocia, sudden spike in blood pressure and severe pph. None of that could have been predicted and I would have been approved for a home birth.
Being in a hospital meant we both lived and dd avoided a life long disability.

That is a ridiculous comment- we didn’t die out as a species because we manage to produce more babies that lived long enough to have their own babies before they died. I am sure you are well aware that child birth can be fatal for both mother and child. The lucky ones survived long enough to produce their own offspring who survived long enough to produce their own offspring . The rest died.

The majority of deaths in childbirth happen during hospital births.

@Thingsaretight cant let these women get any ideas about having opinions or wants for their own births

WTF?! Are you actually being serious? Modern medical interventions have meant many more babies and women make it through childbirth.

NHS care seems to be amount maximising the impact to resource ratio. It’s a hard thing to stomach when you’re in labour but there are lots of other women there too and you are not the most important

Walking upright hasn’t been great for the old pelvis true. What makes is worse is giving birth on your back. It prevents the pelvis from fully opening and makes the baby go uphill to get out.

Knowing about this and encouraging either side lying (when having an epidural or for someone with mobility issues) or squatted positions would make a huge difference.

No it’s not. I refer you back to the Handmaids tale

I think it’s disgusting of women to think their personal preference comes above the general wellbeing of their community and children.

That’s an absolutely disgusting view. The NHS are making a CHOICE to not train more midwives and not have hospitals properly staffed. Home births make up 5% of UK births at most (depends on area), there are NOT 100s of spare midwives kicking about, you are totally deluded! Further to this home birth midwives are regularly diverted into hospitals to cover staffing gaps anyway.

I think one of the biggest problems is the culture of silence about how awful even a ‘normal’ ‘easy’ birth is. And so women, who have previously had full bodily autonomy are shocked (and traumatised) by how animalistic a process it is. Even if you know intellectually there will be pain and a lot of bodily fluids it is a bit of a shock to the system. And what is a deeply memorable event to you is just another day at work for a midwife so they meet your heightened emotions with a shrug and a ‘yip totally normal’
And then there are the exceptions who have catastrophes and the ones who ‘didn’t even notice too they were 10cm dilated , one push and it was done’’

I don’t think it should be banned, mainly because once you start with that you end with not being able to make any medical choice that the doctor doesn’t agree with.

BUT I do think freebirthing is highly dangerous. I had one home water birth. I had to be transferred to hospital after the baby was born due to a serious medical complication with me. It was awful but I am alive because I had midwives there who made that call (I was barely conscious to make those choices and I’m glad I didn’t have to). My second child was born via planned c section. Having experienced a range of birthing experiences, I’m glad I had autonomy but I also highly value medical care too.

What we need is safe, informed, consent based midwifery and consultant care at hospital or at home so that the ‘push factor’ is reduced. We also need to educate women on the dangerous posed by these influencers (the ‘pull factor’). I am also not adverse to prosecuting anyone who crosses the line into giving medical advice which from the article it seems like these women did.

This was my thought when I saw it was the US.

It’s child neglect. Plain and simple.

Something like 4 per 1000 in 1900. And that cut across all classes. As did babies dying during birth or shortly after.

women’s “bodies do not grow babies that we cannot birth” - such pernicious bollocks.

Since humans stood up on 2 legs pelvic outlets have had to get smaller to keep our innards in. The result of that is that the space for birthing is much smaller and this mismatch leads to the sort of obstetric problems we now see that require interventions to save lives.

Sadly nature does not always know best! Blind worship of what is "natural" kills people.

Without medical intervention, I'd be dead in childbirth, both times and the pregnancy in between both births.

Pregnancy in humans is potentially dangerous.

We're not like cats: WTF has just fallen out of my rear end? I'b better lick it clean. Oh look, there's another one. Human brains are massive. The human birth canal is not. It's called labour for a reason. And it kills a lot of women. We'll not go extinct from maternal death rates, but I think its foolhardy to attempt to give birth without trained professionals, medicine and technology.

@StandFirmhow would you police it ?