To think the UK unfairly taxes families?

Your post does not relate to mine

My post and the mumsnetter I was tagging had nothing to do with aging, illness etc. and everything to do with living alone.

RTT

As a separate issue re your post perhaps look at countries that are really suffering through birth rate decline. Remember eventually we will run out of immigrants to do the jobs people here either don’t want or because of low or zero birth rate

Only 5% of today’s pensioners went to university, they were middle-aged by the time Blair introduced the 50% target.

My concern is being fair to everyone.
Abolish NI and tax free allowances Then tax everything that forms income at 25% for everybody. Include wages, rents, pensions, dividends, csa payments, interest on bank accounts, all state benefits and anything else I've missed.
If we all pay the same no ones being treated unfairly

Maybe they didn't need that help as much? Sorry my editing is so rubbish but I've tried to highlight the points on this graph where a current pensioner (age 70) and a current 35 year old were 25 looking at housing to salary ratio. IMO this is the crux of it.

ETA I'm neither 70 nor 35!

The government panders to older people because they vote in greater numbers than young people. Hence the backtrack on winter fuel and the sustaining of the ludicrous triple lock.
It is unfair on younger working people especially as not only do they pay NI, most also pay 9% extra tax for their student loan, which pensioners used to get for free.

This thread wasn't meant to be a free for all moan. It's about how the current tax system favours current pensioners.
I'm around 10 years younger than you and also didn't receive all those benefits. I don't consider that unfair though. It's not something I think about. We did pay an awful lot in childcare costs but we are still better off than our children's generation will be. Better to think about the positives! My concern is for people younger than me, especially the Gen Zs, not myself.

I agree. It should have been done ages ago. The problem is that wages have been stagnant since the GFC and salaries are already very low compared to the cost of housing, energy, etc so the amounts saved by most are unlikely to be enough to sustain them in later life, especially as we are now in a period of generally higher inflation than pre 2022.

Many pensioners raised their children without tax credits, UC and free childcare.
How do you plan to address that unfairness.
I'm over a decade away from pension age with a retirement age of 68 (for now)but I also had no option of working 24 hours a week and getting a taxpayer handout of hundreds a month to provide the rest of my income when my kids were growing up.
Beginning to feel shafted at both ends of the scale!

What utter nonsense.

There is no shortage of human beings on the planet, and countries can always fill their labour and consumption needs via sensible immigration policies.

Aging is involuntary. Producing kids one cannot properly afford to rear is a proactive choice. I say take care of people who are experiencing INvoluntary issues such as aging, illness and accident rather than propping up the lifestyle choices of people who reproduce beyond their means.

The system has to change and they have to start somewhere. Everyone paying the same taxes is a great start. I'm sorry you think this thread is ageist - the problem is the policy of not charging anyone over the state pension age NI contribution is a fundamentally ageist policy. Pensioners are collectively not poor, some are poor and some aren't, like every group in society. Those who are poor should be supported by the state and those who are not should be facing the same taxes as the rest of the population - that's fair and it's not ageist.

A thread like this is ageist. It challenges one sector of the population, and pits them against another. Whichever side of the barrier you are on.

Bottom line is that the whole system is broken, the whole system is an unaffordable catastrophe. The whole system needs changed. That includes tax, pension, benefits, childcare, immigration, assylum, social care... Honestly that is too big for any government to handle.

It is easier for governments and the very wealthy to let the little people fight it out amongst themselves. I really wish this would stop.

Similar here. My relationship broke down because of my infertility, and our inability to have a much wanted child. I'm in a 2 bed flat, so not enormous, but I do work from home about 40% of the time, so it's nice to have my 'office' set up in the spare room. I'm in a relatively expensive city for property too. I feel that I'm too old (and not quite poor enough!) to have a lodger/housemate. It doesn't seem unreasonable.

LodgeRs

Yeah I wasn't turning this into a "what about meeeee?" post. They always get in my nerves.

I was making the point that absolutely loads of people don't live in their own by choice.

And because of the massive cost of accommodation, the size of the places they can afford often don't lend themselves to tenants and lodges.

I’m talking about living alone generally. Not specific circumstances

A lot of people share or/ and have tenants for example to spread the costs and bring in additional income (if they own the property )Not doing so again is personal choice of course

Well it wasn't a choice with me! My husband of 16 years decided he'd rather trade me in for a younger model. And we were unable to have children, and the relationship I had after divorcing turned out to be a disaster. It has never been my choice to live in my own and I'm far from being the only one!

Self employment was a choice I suppose.

Totally agree - everyone who works should take responsibility for supporting themselves as much as possible.

This really isn't the point of the thread. Those who dismiss it simply as "ageist" are spectacularly failing to grasp the issue, and that is that we are facing an affordability catastrophe. We cannot afford this level of expenditure.

I do agree that the loud is all on one set of shoulders but it’s a choice not to share housing and bills

It’s also a choice to be self employed and is very stressful again if you’re on your own.

25% (not 50) council tax reduction. Electricity and gas standing charges. Only one TFA per household.

Obviously there is the rent/mortgage, though obviously that's not the same.

If you are a single self employed person, then no sick pay, no employers' pension contributions, no holiday pay, no maternity pay. It can feel terribly precarious.

I suppose it’s swings and roundabouts really
The family with kids have the huge expense of kids so less disposable income and basically bringing up the next generation of workers and tax payers. We’ll all rely on them one day.

Families sharing houses with higher occupancy are at least sharing so we don’t need to build more and more properties for single occupancy. I appreciate that comes across as insensitive but it’s a fact that affects housing

I agree on the council tax issue. One person doesnt use more than 4 in the same sized house. However it’s based on the house at the moment. Basing ctax on usage brings us back to the poll tax. Perhaps now more people might be happier with the poll tax than they were during Thatchers era as there are more single occupancy properties.

Overall though the burden of expense is always with families bringing up children

Estate agents jump on SINKYs and DINKYs for a very good reason

It should be absolute compulsory to pay into your workplace pension. No opting out for any reason. And self employed people should have to prove to HMRC they are contributing x amount.

Especially if they start means testing it.

Patronising! Thank you.

Because I'm a household of 1. The same could be paid by a household of 5, if there's a SAHP, and 3 kids. Also, council tax reduction of 25% isn't really cutting it, when you've households of 3 generations (for example) paying the full whack for 4 adults, and kids.

How do you pay proportionally much more than others ?