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If a patient requests same sex care and a doctor lies to them and performs intimate care, that should be a sex crime

326 replies

SernieBanders · 14/02/2025 08:00

as a general principle everyone should be offered same sex doctors and nurses and carers for intimate care and anyone who lies or omits the truth about their real sex should be prosecuted.

do you agree?

OP posts:
Marylou2 · 14/02/2025 08:34

Definitely standing with Sandie Peggie. Patients who request a female clinician should get exactly that. Not a man pretending to be female. If the Dr doesn't wish to disclose their status I respect their right not to do so but they must not treat a patient who has requested care from a female HCP.

maddening · 14/02/2025 08:34

There should be an action against the hospital to force them to confirm whether this has happened and to inform those women impacted.

ChampagneLassie · 14/02/2025 08:35

Is there a petition for this? There should be

HermioneWeasley · 14/02/2025 08:39

SmudgeHughes · 14/02/2025 08:28

Similar to the police services still allowing trans-identifying men to search female prisoners.

Edited

I’d forgotten that abuse

its never fucking ending

Allthegoodnamesarechosen · 14/02/2025 08:41

‘Upton also told the court that he would not proactively disclose his transgender status to a patient. He considers it a ‘private matter’

Hes about six foot tall and has male pattern baldness and a very masculine jaw, judging from his wedding ( to a woman) photos, so I don’t suppose he has to do much disclosing. The problem is that if a patient ‘identified ‘ him and rejected his attentions, they would probably be vilified and denied treatment.

SernieBanders · 14/02/2025 08:42

Upstartled · 14/02/2025 08:34

Are you suggesting that women don't have a right to object to deception in accessing their right to same sex medical care?

Around 20% of voters think so

OP posts:
Chillibeds · 14/02/2025 08:44

I have been pro gay, pro trans my whole life.
Live and let live, never interested, never caring at all, 100% supportive of alternative lifestyles.

It is this type of behaviour that has hugely confused me.
The woke behaviour that says woman have to share loos at work.

My husbands office had their arses handed to them when the attempted to change the loos.
Absolute murder.
The females in the office were so furious and upset.
Grovelling apologies all round.

Trans women thinking gay women have to go out with them because they are now women.

It has changed everything for me.
I feel very confused by how repulsed I am by this militancy.

Of course it is sexual assault.

Upstartled · 14/02/2025 08:45

Allthegoodnamesarechosen · 14/02/2025 08:41

‘Upton also told the court that he would not proactively disclose his transgender status to a patient. He considers it a ‘private matter’

Hes about six foot tall and has male pattern baldness and a very masculine jaw, judging from his wedding ( to a woman) photos, so I don’t suppose he has to do much disclosing. The problem is that if a patient ‘identified ‘ him and rejected his attentions, they would probably be vilified and denied treatment.

Wasn't there a woman who was refused NHS treatment because she declined care from another male HCP who was trans?

heroinechic · 14/02/2025 08:46

I'm probably going to be up against it here but I don't see what sexual offence this would fall under. Assault by penetration, sexual assault etc require an element of sexual touching/sexual penetration.

Medical procedures are not ordinarily considered to involve sexual touching/penetration (although of course they can and have been!)

You would have to establish that this was a sexual experience for the trans woman/man, simply on the basis that they are trans, and regardless of their sexual orientation. I.e trans people are unable to perform intimate medical procedures on either sex. This also plays into the 'all trans people are acting out a fetish' umbrella of transphobia.

I appreciate the informed consent argument, but it's not sufficient to fulfil just one element of an offence to have been said to have committed it.

It would be much better IMO if the NHS insisted on a sex based assessment (rather than gender) when it came to patient requests to protect their dignity.

SernieBanders · 14/02/2025 08:48

heroinechic · 14/02/2025 08:46

I'm probably going to be up against it here but I don't see what sexual offence this would fall under. Assault by penetration, sexual assault etc require an element of sexual touching/sexual penetration.

Medical procedures are not ordinarily considered to involve sexual touching/penetration (although of course they can and have been!)

You would have to establish that this was a sexual experience for the trans woman/man, simply on the basis that they are trans, and regardless of their sexual orientation. I.e trans people are unable to perform intimate medical procedures on either sex. This also plays into the 'all trans people are acting out a fetish' umbrella of transphobia.

I appreciate the informed consent argument, but it's not sufficient to fulfil just one element of an offence to have been said to have committed it.

It would be much better IMO if the NHS insisted on a sex based assessment (rather than gender) when it came to patient requests to protect their dignity.

A new crime of a sexual nature. Not an existing one. Similar to sex by deception.

OP posts:
ExtraOnions · 14/02/2025 08:49

If I was in an emergency situation I would want whoever was qualified to attend to me .. and I wouldn’t care what genitalia they were sporting.

Upstartled · 14/02/2025 08:50

Upstartled · 14/02/2025 08:45

Wasn't there a woman who was refused NHS treatment because she declined care from another male HCP who was trans?

Found it. Teresa Steele, had her surgery cancelled and was left to potentially die because she declined care from a transwoman.

Upstartled · 14/02/2025 08:50

ExtraOnions · 14/02/2025 08:49

If I was in an emergency situation I would want whoever was qualified to attend to me .. and I wouldn’t care what genitalia they were sporting.

You not caring is fine. It's not a poll on what you care about. That's not how rights work.

Mumsgirls · 14/02/2025 08:56

I have had Botox bladder injections under a local and this procedure could not be more intimate. I have a lovely female surgeon and she is assisted by a female nurse. I could not bear to have this done by a male, even one with a piece of paper calling him a woman. I have no ill feelings to anyone of any sex or gender ID. These injections will need to be repeated when the effect wears off
they have a very positive effect on my health and well being. I would go without if females are not available. Is this what we want in a health service?

Rosscameasdoody · 14/02/2025 08:59

Arseynal · 14/02/2025 08:21

There is a world of difference between “I’m sorry, there isn’t a female doctor on duty right now, would you like to see the male doctor with a female chaperone?” or “I can make you an appointment with a female doctor but the next available one isn’t until July” and telling a patient they can see a female doctor and sending in a man. Especially when the man is challenged and says “I am a biological female” when they aren’t. Consent still matters, even when the service is stretched and consent obtained by deception is not consent at all.

This. In a nutshell.

sashh · 14/02/2025 09:00

I've been admitted to hospital a number of times as an emergency with GI symptoms.

As part of the exam there is always a point where a Dr put's their finger in my anus. I know this and I do not mind a male Dr doing it, they are professionals.

BUT when it has been a male Dr there has always been a chaperone. The first time I was about 10 and the chaperone was my mother.

More recently a nurse has stepped in to the room.

I think it is as much to protect the Dr as me.

Upton should routinely be using a chaperone, the only reason I can see for not doing that is because he gets a kick out of it.

lifeturnsonadime · 14/02/2025 09:00

People saying they’re happy to be treated by males are massively missing the point 🙄

spinningbirds · 14/02/2025 09:02

HermioneWeasley · 14/02/2025 08:27

Absolutely. Women’s bodies are not validation tools for males with gender dysphoria.

This is such an astute statement, thank you

ManyATrueWord · 14/02/2025 09:03

Anyone who can't see that trying to do something without consent is the problem is - probably a TrA actually. Or a man.

Rosscameasdoody · 14/02/2025 09:04

Upstartled · 14/02/2025 08:50

You not caring is fine. It's not a poll on what you care about. That's not how rights work.

The poster does have a point though. What if, in an emergency situation the on call was trans and the only person available ?

BlondiePortz · 14/02/2025 09:04

Upstartled · 14/02/2025 08:34

Are you suggesting that women don't have a right to object to deception in accessing their right to same sex medical care?

Women can demand what they want doesn't mean a magic wand can be waved and it happens

SernieBanders · 14/02/2025 09:05

BlondiePortz · 14/02/2025 09:04

Women can demand what they want doesn't mean a magic wand can be waved and it happens

No but they can rightly expect not to be LIED TO perhaps?

They can be allowed to make an INFORMED CHOICE perhaps?

And it's not just about women, men do have feelings as well you know

OP posts:
Upstartled · 14/02/2025 09:06

BlondiePortz · 14/02/2025 09:04

Women can demand what they want doesn't mean a magic wand can be waved and it happens

No, but being truthful about the availability of an actual female doctor is completely free and achievable and their right to make an informed decision on that truthful knowledge is again, completely free and achievable.

SernieBanders · 14/02/2025 09:07

lifeturnsonadime · 14/02/2025 09:00

People saying they’re happy to be treated by males are massively missing the point 🙄

I should have put informed consent in the question, thats my fault. Possibly explains the 20%. I can't think of any other excuse for those votes.

OP posts:
pootleondown · 14/02/2025 09:07

Women can demand what they want doesn't mean a magic wand can be waved and it happens

You're totally missing the point of the post.