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Original poster

Advice please - coercive control?

806 replies

rosesarentred3 · 06/07/2023 14:54

I'll start by saying if anyone recognises me from other threads I've created under a different name, please do not put those links on this post as all the info added together would make me easily identifiable to friends and family.

After being in my marriage for 10 years, I can see now that I believe my partner is controlling. I see a therapist who feel strongly that this is happening.

There are too many examples to list but I'll list a few:

Starting random arguments about my family out of nowhere, it literally could be anything. Then DP says to me 'see, look, we're arguing because of them, look at what they're doing to us! We shouldn't have contact with them'. This is about various family members and friends. DP has fallen out with many members of my family so it's awkward to see them.

If I leave a wrapper on the side, DP will be annoyed at me, tell me off, go on and on at me about it. But then does the same herself. If I said something she'd go mad.
The other week I said one night that I was going for a shower abr her response was 'does this kitchen look clean to you? Can you honestly say this is clean? Clean the kitchen before you have a shower'.

Saying what clothes to wear and not wear. I put on some summer pants and DP says 'you really look big in them. Honestly, if you're conscious about your weight I wouldn't wear those, they make you look massive'. I'm a size 10. Not that that matters.

My work is extremely confidential. DP will ask me for confidential information about my work saying 'if you don't tell me then you don't trust me' and will badger me about it and eventually not speak to me for long periods of time because I haven't divulged information.

Tells me regularly I wouldn't survive without her. What would I do without her? How did I manage before? etc.

My confidence is so low. I rarely see my friends. I've lost loads of friends since is being together.
DP told me when we first got together that some of my friends who I saw all the time had been speaking about me behind my back saying awful things and made sure we broke ties with them so I don't see any of them anymore.

Will get really mad at my family and say it's just because she's trying to protect me. Even though there's nothing to protect me from.

We have a child. When I was pregnant she insisted that she take the shared parental leave because I'd had enough time to bond with the baby while I was pregnant so it was now her turn. So I returned to work after having the baby. I cried to dp and said I really wanted to be with the baby and couldn't bear the thought of leaving her. But this just turned into an arguments where DP would cry saying she wanted time off with the baby.
A part of me felt like it was the right thing to do because DP continuously told me I wouldn't manage on my own, that I'd probably forget to do what I needed to do with the baby etc. and I really started to worry that would be true and agreed for her to take the leave instead.

Anyway - what I wonder is, what do I do now? I feel like I can't be in this relationship. I don't feel loved. I haven't ever felt loved in this relationship. Do I just leave? In which case this means selling the house and sorting shared custody etc.

Do I try to spend some time building my confidence first? Making friends? Going out more? Meeting people?
I'm always at home. I work at home. Then when I'm not working, I'm always with DP to the point where I now feel extreme anxiety whenever I go somewhere without DP.

Today I was planning a day with DC. DP then started a big argument with me, slagging of my family again etc.
however, I came out.
Is it completely pathetic that I feel chuffed with myself for coming out? I wasn't as anxious as I usually am. Years ago, I wouldn't have batted an eye at coming out on my own.

It all feels such a mess.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
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billy1966 · 13/07/2023 13:26

OP, you cannot control her actions or words to others.

All you can do is take action yourself.

The facts are she prevented you from taking mat leave.
You are bullied and abused.
What you have written is beyond shocking.

You desperately need to contact Women's aid, but I also believe her coercive control of you IS a police matter.

You are afraid of her. Asking to speaking to a Domestic Abuse specialist officer could be very helpful.

Original poster
rosesarentred3 · 13/07/2023 11:53

@Bitterballen
I will contact WA.
She thinks I'm going for general life stuff etc. which I am. but she will ask if I've said anything bad about her sometimes.

I think she can sense some change because I've noticed she is actively speaking more to friends who are mutual but being really friendly and chatty & nice. It's like she's planning herself, how to make her look better when this ends, and that sets the scene for making me look bad, if that makes sense?

I'm feeling really paranoid. I'm also wondering if she has read this thread.

OP posts:
Bitterballen · 13/07/2023 11:07

Ah an online therapist makes more sense. What is the reason she believes you're seeing the therapist?

I'm worried they'll think we cannot look after DC or that she isn't safe and then we're on some kind of 'watch list'. Or worse, they take her away. I know that is worse case scenario but it flashed through my mind when I saw the number for women's aid online.
They won't take her away. You are a victim of abuse and you need help.

Why don't you use the online chat function for WA if you're afraid of calling? Or get a second phone as suggested by PP?

You can keep posting giving more awful examples of what she's doing which may be very useful as a contemporaneous record in the future.

But you also need to start taking some action yourself in order to extract yourself and DC. And remember that you aren't committed to doing anything. Just take the first step and see how it feels. Do it for your baby, who deserves a proper relationship with her birth mother and isn't getting it.

Fedupwithitx · 13/07/2023 07:14

This is one of the most shocking posts I've ever read. Please please leave. No more excuses, no need to feel embarrassed or bad, just leave. Move your savings, speak to womens aid and gear yourself up to get away from this quite frankly evil person. Nobody can live like this. Sending love ❤️

Original poster
rosesarentred3 · 13/07/2023 02:26

@scoobysnaxx
She does that already where she plants seeds etc that she's the
'Main parent' and will even use those words that she's the main caregiver for DC.

I just can't help feel upset with myself that I've let this happen. And that I have lost precious time with DC by not having my maternity leave.

So many moments that I look back on that plague my mind and it feels physically painful to think about.
I would be on the settee and DC would fall asleep on me and my partner would say for me not to do that and put her down so she isn't on me all the time.

She said this because DC never fell asleep on DP and would always fall to sleep on me. It's like she tried to break any bond we could possibly have.

And I hate myself for letting it happen. I truly can't forgive myself. I feel weak and pathetic. How could I even do this?

OP posts:
Original poster
rosesarentred3 · 13/07/2023 02:22

@Bitterballen
I'm worried they'll think we cannot look after DC or that she isn't safe and then we're on some kind of 'watch list'. Or worse, they take her away. I know that is worse case scenario but it flashed through my mind when I saw the number for women's aid online.

She calls my therapist all sorts and says things like ' I don't know why you see her' then will say 'you need to speak to your therapist about such and such'.

Sometimes when I have my session which is online, I'll hear her outside the door. A couple of times I've gone out to see what she's doing and asked her to go away from the door. Then she'll ask 'don't you trust me? Do you think I was listening? Im sure you're saying bad things about me'. And then go on to slag off my therapist and tell me how useless she is etc.

She hasn't spoken to me all night and has gone to sleep in the spare room taking DC with her. DC does have her own room but I know this is part of her trying to 'take' DC away. I know that sounds like paranoid thinking but she's been doing that lately and then telling everyone that DC can't be without her and that she stays in the same bed as her. And that she can't put her down without her crying so she needs to get me to do it because she's always upset leaving DP etc. so I know she's planting seeds already for people.

OP posts:
scoobysnaxx · 12/07/2023 22:54

Contacting social services is exactly the kind of tactic an abuser might do. Which is exactly why YOU need to maintain control and have the upper hand. If you'd have laid it all on the table today, she would be plotting and scheming and manipulating. Telling lies about you to people, planting seeds. You can cope/ you did this the other day/you forgot this the other day for your kids.. they try to build a picture of "evidence" against you. Keep the upper hand.

There are many many teams within social services aside from child protection. There are many teams designed to support children and families to get through difficult times and navigate complex circumstances.

You have more than enough evidence of coercive control so I wouldn't worry about it honestly.

I appreciate it might not be on your radar right now but definitely consider reporting this coercive abuse to the police maybe in the future as it is a criminal offence.

Bitterballen · 12/07/2023 22:14

rosesarentred3 · 12/07/2023 20:06

I've just looked online at the women's aid number and I'm absolutely filled with dread. The thought has just occurred to me, what if they contact social services? Or they think DC is in danger? She isn't in danger. But it feels very risky.

Can you identify the sources of the dread?

What is they do contact social services? Can you specify what it is you're scared of?

You can of course remain anonymous as you start to talk to them.

Bitterballen · 12/07/2023 22:12

I think it's hard to judge the therapist without being in the room.

The therapist has recently confirmed to OP her thoughts on her wife's behaviour. No doubt she's had these thoughts for some time. But if OP previously hasn't been sufficiently open to questioning this, it would have been risky and probably unhelpful for the therapist to call out openly the wife's behaviour as abuse, if OP wouldn't have been willing to hear it. It would just have endangered the relationship between OP and her therapist.

Calling OP's therapist incompetent on the basis of OP's posts I don't think is helpful. It just adds more doubts to OP's thoughts on "who can I trust?"

OP I really think you should have this conversation with your therapist, ask her why she didn't challenge you on the mat leave and explain how you now feel.

On another note - given the level of control exerted by the wife - I'm astonished she "allows" you to see a therapist. Why is this? Does she know?

MisschiefMaker · 12/07/2023 21:43

rosesarentred3 · 12/07/2023 20:06

I've just looked online at the women's aid number and I'm absolutely filled with dread. The thought has just occurred to me, what if they contact social services? Or they think DC is in danger? She isn't in danger. But it feels very risky.

Well they won't take your child away off the back of this .

However if they did contact SS (bearing in mind I have no idea what their criteria is, so I'm not saying they will) then would that really be so terrible? They would be advocating on your behalf which might come in handy for the custody battle. You have done nothing wrong here, you have to remember that. If people knew the truth they would all support you.

MisschiefMaker · 12/07/2023 20:52

I agree with @billy1966

I have nothing useful to add but am absolutely horrified by what I've read here.

billy1966 · 12/07/2023 20:06

Your therapist sounds completely incompetent and every update on this vile woman gets worse.

This is one of the worst cases of abuse I have ever read about, ever.

Denied mat leave, forced to return to eork, expressing milk, and still doing night feeds, paying for it all?

Truly bibaric.

Absolutely coercive control.

I sincerely think this is a police matter.

Your therapist is a waste of space.

You poor woman.

Original poster
rosesarentred3 · 12/07/2023 20:06

I've just looked online at the women's aid number and I'm absolutely filled with dread. The thought has just occurred to me, what if they contact social services? Or they think DC is in danger? She isn't in danger. But it feels very risky.

OP posts:
Original poster
rosesarentred3 · 12/07/2023 19:44

@Clarinet1
I don't travel for work. I don't really go anywhere without her. We are together most of the time. I do see friends maybe once every 6 weeks for a couple of hours. And she has a problem every time I do this. Saying I can't take care of DC when I'm out, that I might not be safe, that she's worried about me and I can't handle it. Then tells me how shit my friends are so why do I want to see them. Then she might offer to drop me off and pick me up.
There are times she'll say she will wait in a cafe across the road while I see my friend etc.

OP posts:
Original poster
rosesarentred3 · 12/07/2023 19:41

@Bitterballen
I think you're right. I'm looking for her permission. I want her to agree it's the right thing and then work together to make it as amicable as possible for our DC, which is unlikely when I really think about it.

I have spoken to my therapist, however I've had this therapist for many years and looking back I've told her of many red flags and she hasn't really said about it being controlling or wrong until recently. She also knew about me not having maternity leave and didn't challenge me on this or say I need more time or anything like that.
I know it isn't her responsibility as such as I make my own choices (to some extent) but I would have thought she would have questioned this when I look back.

She has apologised to me and said she is sorry that she didn't challenge me further when I said I wasn't having any maternity leave.

OP posts:
Bitterballen · 12/07/2023 18:55

rosesarentred3 · 12/07/2023 17:55

@Bitterballen
I don't know. Just so she knows I'm not weak. I was hoping she'd say 'right that's fine then' and then we'd talk about separating and selling the house, divorce etc. probably unrealistic.

I think you are still hoping for her permission to end things.

The reason for this is because she has controlled you for so long, it's hard to imagine doing something so big without her permission.

But the tiny rebellion happening in your mind, where you are imagining leaving, and she doesn't know, is where you need to focus and develop.

Are you discussing this with your therapist?

Clarinet1 · 12/07/2023 18:26

rosesarentred3 · 12/07/2023 17:55

@Bitterballen
I don't know. Just so she knows I'm not weak. I was hoping she'd say 'right that's fine then' and then we'd talk about separating and selling the house, divorce etc. probably unrealistic.

I’m afraid, OP, that you would probably get the sort of pattern of behaviour we hear so
much of from people ending marriages on MN - she would become more dangerous, which is exactly what you don’t want.
One thought re time to talk to people, make plans etc. Do you ever need to travel for work and you could dress it up as that? It would solve the car tracker problem - or is there a risk she might follow you?

Original poster
rosesarentred3 · 12/07/2023 17:55

@Bitterballen
I don't know. Just so she knows I'm not weak. I was hoping she'd say 'right that's fine then' and then we'd talk about separating and selling the house, divorce etc. probably unrealistic.

OP posts:
ErrolTheDragon · 12/07/2023 17:49

Don't forewarn her!
Do write down her unreasonable behaviour. Deliberately depriving you of sleep is torture (literally!)

Sure, relationships can be hard. Some may be worth it, others aren't. If this one isn't working for you - even if this woman actually was a saint which she very clearly isn't - then it's not working.

Bitterballen · 12/07/2023 17:46

I really don't know. I suppose just so she knows I'm serious and I'm not putting up with this anymore?
And then, what do you hope would happen as a consequence?

Original poster
rosesarentred3 · 12/07/2023 17:36

@scoobysnaxx

I will call women's aid. It's just finding when. I will also call a solicitor.
I don't know who to speak to in terms of a friend. I don't know who I can fully trust to not say things like 'oh well relationships are hard....' etc because things like that make me doubt myself.

OP posts:
Original poster
rosesarentred3 · 12/07/2023 17:34

@Bitterballen
I really don't know. I suppose just so she knows I'm serious and I'm not putting up with this anymore?
But I know she can make life really hard.
She does weird things like doesn't let me sleep. If she's mad with me she will do random things to wake me up.
The atmosphere will be awful.
She will be super happy and playful with the baby in front of me but completely ignore my existence.
These are the things she does when we argue and she'll probably ramp it up even further.

She told me from the beginning that her ex was an abusive psychopath. This should have rang alarm bells. She says her ex was a narcissist and made her life a living hell. No doubt she'll spread all sorts about me too.

OP posts:
Bitterballen · 12/07/2023 16:22

Great advice above.

So I shouldn't say anything at all today about wanting to leave?
Help me understand, what is the outcome of this conversation that you would be hoping for?

scoobysnaxx · 12/07/2023 14:27

"I feel like I'm being over dramatic and maybe the situation isn't as bad as I'm making out and I will look ridiculous if I end it and she's fine with it and doesn't make my life hell.
Although I can imagine all what she'll tell friends because she pretty much does it already*"
*
I encourage you to read back over all of your posts, as well as your many years of experiences with her, and ask yourself... am I being dramatic? If a friend told you all of this? Would you be encouraging her to leave and tell her she's probably being dramatic? Not on your life!!

You need to start seeing your doubt as the product of years of abusive and coercive behaviour. This is classic for victims to say! It's not that bad...well I did/said this too...she's not always like this...

This is the result of manipulation at its finest.

It is 100% indisputable abuse.

You've not exaggerated a thing here, no do we need to 'hear the other side' or get more info to make a judgement. Everything you've said it abusive behaviour and your doubt as to whether or not it is, is a classic consequence of abuse.

You really really are seeing the light now, don't lose sight of it, ever. It's real and it's the cold hard truth and you know it. Don't waste a second longer questioning it.

scoobysnaxx · 12/07/2023 14:16

Task 1?

Get support, information and advice.

Okay from who?
Mum/friend?
Solicitor
Women's aid

How do I do this?
I need a phone/email - use my work one/ pay cash for a crap Nokia

When?
Thursday when she's at work (eg)

Almost imagine you're helping a best friend in this situation? What would you tell her to do? How would you break it down with her into small small tasks.