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Original poster

the "don't have kids if u can't afford them" mentality...

645 replies

MermaidCheeks · 06/08/2022 14:23

Who exactly do this lot think are going to be looking after them in hospitals and care homes when they're elderly and infirm?

If only those who could really afford to have kids had them - a decreasing well-off demographic -we'd be even more fucked than we already are.

Immigration is not a long-term solution when 80% of elderly are going to be spread across low and middle-affluent countries by 2050, either. Every country is going to need their own citizens.

Instead of resenting people who need their wages topped-up by the government in order to afford having a couple of kids - maybe embrace those who are making sacrifices to have kids at all, especially in the face of the overwhelming decrease in value that society and successive governments have placed on the role of raising children.

OP posts:
AhaLyn · 06/08/2022 15:40

The NHS is crumbling because it’s being choked on purpose towards privatisation.

I won’t be having kids when I can’t feed myself. Hope that’s okay.

Cameleongirl · 06/08/2022 15:40

I thought this thread was asking whether the “don’t have kids if you can’t afford them” mentality was reasonable?

Why do some posters think it’s bashing child free people? It’s not even relevant to them.

Original poster
MermaidCheeks · 06/08/2022 15:39

Oh look another bash those that don't have DC thread

How have you managed to work this one out? Defensive to the extreme.

OP posts:
LittleHeapOfBooks · 06/08/2022 15:39

Yes, be grateful the lower class scum are breeding so they can take care of you because your own children won't. Lovely.

To be honest, with the low pay and poor working conditions, it is already the situation where elderly arent really being taken proper care of. It is getting worse and will continue to do so, I know a few people who have left the industry because supermarkets, amazon etc pay better and not as horrific work environments. They are leaving due to crap pay and poor working conditions. Not because the poor aren't breeding enough. I wouldn't count on them to be taking care of you OP.

PriamFarrl · 06/08/2022 15:39

MermaidCheeks · 06/08/2022 14:46

Yes, only the well off are not judged for procreating. My original point stands.

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I judge anyone who has an excessive number of children. The world doesn’t need this many people and thankful contraception is available.

rainbowmilk · 06/08/2022 15:39

ilovesooty · 06/08/2022 15:37

Does that mean that the child free shouldn't expect any help or social care in later life?

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We’re not even supposed to have nice picnic tables or 4 bed houses according to MN!

Algbu6 · 06/08/2022 15:38

Watchthesunrise · 06/08/2022 15:02

Back to the point though, it's possible to raise happy, well-adjusted, healthy children poor. I live in a developing country. Material wealth is not necessary to raise incredible kids. A stable home, sufficient food, basic healthcare and connected community is all that really matters.

in the developed world, poor means insecure housing. Housing is where it all unravels.

Who wants to raise poor children though or live in poverty? Its no life for the DC or the parent. It leads to many things if you fall upon an unfortunate job loss that is very different to having 3 to 5 kids that you knew you couldn't afford after 2 DC but continued.

Original poster
MermaidCheeks · 06/08/2022 15:38

I am really baffled how people can see creating more people as a solution.

I agree that seriously long term it's not a solution.

But boy will there be suffering in the interim, surely.

The demographic time bomb is already exploding, by the way.

OP posts:
JorisBonson · 06/08/2022 15:38

PaddingtonBearStareAgain · 06/08/2022 15:34

Oh look another bash those that don't have DC thread 🙄

I've got my bingo card at the ready, waiting for someone to tell us we shouldn't be on here.

EmmaH2022 · 06/08/2022 15:38

ilovesooty · 06/08/2022 15:37

Does that mean that the child free shouldn't expect any help or social care in later life?

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Oh we childfree folk are always told that. Then I'm told I only have time to help neighbours due to no kids...as if my parents didn't/don't need help.

Cognacsoft · 06/08/2022 15:37

BMW6 · 06/08/2022 14:51

What on earth makes you think all these future children will fill roles in nursing or Care when they grow up?

They're not now, so why will the next generation? 🤔

Because supply and demand.
If carers are needed then they will have to be paid well if there is a shortage. Wages will go up.

In France dc have a legal obligation to pay towards their parents care. But that's because dc can't be disinherited.
Some Brits don't want to help their parents at all but still expect an inheritance.

SuperPets · 06/08/2022 15:37

Changingmynameyetagain1 · 06/08/2022 15:33

This. This this this.

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No, not this. This is a complete misunderstanding of how the system works!

What you are paying while you are working is not for your (public) pension. IT's for the pensions of people taking them now. You money is gone, there is no pot for you. In order to have a public pension, you definitely do need enough people to be working when you want to take it.

If we get to the point where life expectancy keeps rising and birth rates keep falling (which is extremely likely) the money won't be there to pay for all the pensions needed.

rainbowmilk · 06/08/2022 15:37

How is the govt/society vilifying people who can’t afford to have kids? I’ve seen people judge people for having kids when they can’t afford them, and I think that’s fair enough. That’s not vilifying, it’s natural to be appalled at a person making a conscious decision to have a child in horrible circumstances.

EmmaH2022 · 06/08/2022 15:37

We could do with development on care robots...not a big fan of tech but sounds like that might be useful.

ilovesooty · 06/08/2022 15:37

MermaidCheeks · 06/08/2022 14:44

As long as you're not expecting any medical or social care when you're elderly.....

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Does that mean that the child free shouldn't expect any help or social care in later life?

Original poster
MermaidCheeks · 06/08/2022 15:36

Fuck me oh virtuous do you think you are.
Kids or no kids everyone makes sacrifices in life.
Ever considered the extra tax that people without kids pay for the services you use?

Have you actually read the thread??

OP posts:
EmmaH2022 · 06/08/2022 15:36

Btw I'm 46 and the demographic time bomb was talked about when I was a teen.it depends what you think is a crisis. But no matter how many people you make, the job of care is never going to be popular.

community fills a lot of gaps. The oldies I help/have helped all have kids.

btw my parents did wait to have us, I'm glad they waited. We still didn't have the heating on as much as people do now. I used to wear my coat and read in bed after school. I think we switched the heating on at 6 or 7.

I am really baffled how people can see creating more people as a solution. I think it was the solution suggested at the last similar point in the cycle.

Original poster
MermaidCheeks · 06/08/2022 15:35

I guess our problem with recruiting into the care sector is sorted then now that all of MN are having kids to wipe old backsides.

eh?

OP posts:
Breconhelen · 06/08/2022 15:35

Fuck me oh virtuous do you think you are.

Kids or no kids everyone makes sacrifices in life.
Ever considered the extra tax that people without kids pay for the services you use?

SpilltheTea · 06/08/2022 15:34

The vacancies in health and social care aren't being filled by the existing generations, why are you deluding yourself? The jobs get more and more undesirable. The problem isn't going to be solved by adding more humans who will need to use the services, in the vain hope they choose to work for them. Lots of people in my generation don't want children and no form of encouragement will make them want to saddle themselves with the crap that comes with them. Why would the government give you a medal for choosing to have a kid? I wouldn't have a child I knew I couldn't afford because I want to have an actual life and I don't think other people should fund my choices.

PaddingtonBearStareAgain · 06/08/2022 15:34

Oh look another bash those that don't have DC thread 🙄

Original poster
MermaidCheeks · 06/08/2022 15:34

So in your world, it's a good plan to raise children in poverty so they can then go on to do a job they don't want to do because it's the only option available?

Really not what I'm saying, no.

OP posts:
Cornettoninja · 06/08/2022 15:34

EmmaH2022 · 06/08/2022 15:28

So in your world, it's a good plan to raise children in poverty so they can then go on to do a job they don't want to do because it's the only option available?

have you considered running a communist dictatorship?

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Not necessarily working directly in care, although that needs an abundance of attention right now, but with advances in medicine and technology it’ll be future generations propping up any system with their taxes.

My grandparents (actually parent) had a pretty decent expectation and experience of retirement and elderly care because their generation was supported by a larger younger one. Even someone who has invested heavily and wisely in their own retirement can’t afford to completely build the infrastructure they can buy elderly care from. If there isn’t an investment in care then it simply won’t be there to buy.

Changingmynameyetagain1 · 06/08/2022 15:33

BigChesterDraws · 06/08/2022 15:03

Oh goodie, the old “my children will be working to pay your pension” myth. No, they won’t. The working childless people have paid more than their fair share into the pension pot throughout their lives. They have continuously paid into the “general welfare fund” without receiving child benefit, SMP, tax credits, free school meals, or any other such benefits.

Your children will be working for their own pension. If they have a job. They could be on the dole their entire lives, in prison, unable to work through accident or illness. No one can predict the future.

Who do we think will be caring for us in old age? If we need care, and remember not every 80-year-old is in a nursing home and advances in science mean that people are living independently longer, it will be someone that we pay to look after us. Your children might be glad of the job opportunity.

This. This this this.

Original poster
MermaidCheeks · 06/08/2022 15:33

Oh yes thank you so much for having kids so that I might have someone to look after me when I'm old. Have a medal.

Ha, my OP was obviously written terribly - this is not what I am saying.

I'm saying, society/gov should not be vilifying the ever-increasing group of people who can't afford to have children, given the ticking demographic time bomb.

OP posts:
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