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Being openly gender critical

(52 Posts)
Frankenterfer Sat 29-Sep-18 08:26:19

The Ocado issue has made me peak for the hundredth time and I've just posted this on Facebook and perhaps I've not had enough coffee yet but for once I am not worried about what other people will think.

I wonder if it will disappear like the last article I shared...

OP’s posts: |
ThomasRichard Sat 29-Sep-18 08:30:30

I think you’ll either get a couple of likes or it will disappear, unless you have someone on your friends list who already has strong views either way. Good luck!

KatVonGulag Sat 29-Sep-18 08:34:35

People are noticing. They are too scared to stick their heads above the parapet. Chatting in real life loads of people are peaking.
The idea that a man can dress part time as a woman and win a women's award has hit a nerve.

qumquat Sat 29-Sep-18 08:35:51

I’ve posted a couple of things on FB. Lost a night’s sleep after each time. Eventually worked up the nerve to go on FB and invariably tumble weed and no responses at all. I did the same last night and again got no sleep and am now too scared to go on Facebook! I think it will probably be more effective to bring it up in conversation with friends, which I have managed to do once and I certainly got them thinking. I’m a teacher so I immediately panic about losing my job when I post online. Sorry for the ramble. Good luck!

Frankenterfer Sat 29-Sep-18 08:37:55

I appreciate not everyone is in a position to post, and having real life conversation is probably the best bet, but my social circle is super small 🙄 I guess we will see.

OP’s posts: |
EmpressAdultHumanFemale Sat 29-Sep-18 08:46:12

I started off posting stuff cautiously a year or so ago, then last month I thought WTF & my profile pic is me in my Adult Human Female T-shirt. Some people unfriended me. The usual response to the posts is tumbleweed but I sometimes get likes / comments from the most unlikely people.

VickyEadie Sat 29-Sep-18 08:49:39

I sent an email with links, text and an invitation/exhortation to complete the GRA consultation to a number of friends whom I assumed would be GC enough to do it.

I've heard nothing back from several of them, not even a 'I think you're wrong' and wonder if that's the last I'll ever hear from them!

Estellesylvia Sat 29-Sep-18 08:50:06

To be honest you’ll probably find you have no or very few likes. Though you do get the odd surprise person who likes things which is always nice.

You may also get a well meaning but I’ll informed friend who will puff up with self righteousness and ask you what’s with all the transphobic hate? They will do this either on the post or by messaging you. They will be unable to defend their accusations of transphobia - they always are.

Estellesylvia Sat 29-Sep-18 08:50:51

For context, if I post a family photo I will usually get 30 or 40 likes in comparison.

Frankenterfer Sat 29-Sep-18 08:54:14

Had some welcome but unexpected support so far from one person, but yes, expecting tumbleweed. I don't need people to openly agree with me, I just want to encourage people to think about it. I was totally in the TWAW camp a year or so ago, I mean, at first it seems right. And I do want all people to be happy in their skin and feel safe, have every opportunity to succeed. But that means all people, including women, and no group at the expense of another.

OP’s posts: |
EmpressAdultHumanFemale Sat 29-Sep-18 08:57:14

Pips Bunce might be a good place to start. That photo of him in his two different guises, with the headline about his award, says it all, even at a quick glance.

Followed by Karen White.

EmpressAdultHumanFemale Sat 29-Sep-18 08:59:16

Incidentally, if Bunce chose to go to work in a dress & wig once a week while retaining the name Philip & using the men's toilets, I'd have no problem with that. It's the concept of woman as a costume that I object to.

calpop Sat 29-Sep-18 09:04:29

Im the same Frank. My occasional facebook posts get 2 likes. One from a very gc woman i know and the other from my mum, original feminist 😁. My gc stance doesnt go down well with the school muns, let me tell you. HOWEVER, i do sense the tide is turning. As many of them have genius level daughters who are just destined to be futire Olympic athletes (of course), the men winning womens races isnt going down well.... Their daughters wont be too cowed/cossested/uneducated to call themselves gc feminists I predict.

glagdy Sat 29-Sep-18 09:07:31

I mentioned something at a girls night recently and got yelled at by 12 women. It's viewed very differently where I live. These women all see themselves as staunch feminists, liberals etc.

Now everyone thinks I'm some kind of bigot. sad

TransposersArePosers Sat 29-Sep-18 10:39:16

I don't post anything political on facebook, but have spoken to people who do and am pleased to see that one posted the FPFW video of Dr Nic talking about the consultation and then another friend who I had spoken to had shared it, and they have much wider social circles than me so hopefully the message will continue to spread. A late surge of interest and people motivated to actually respond to the consultation (rather than just think about it) would be perfect.

FloralBunting Sat 29-Sep-18 10:49:15

I posted something sometime ago and everyone agreed except one person who is an active Green Party member who did the boilerplate script of "More oppressed than ciswomen, stats from South America, where can they go if they don't go in women's spaces and take women's places, why can't we all just work together?" I'm sure they haven't changed their mind at all in the interim, but the PMs I got showed very clearly that those reading the exchange were persuaded by my responses and thought the GP person was being very naive and silly.

PurpleCrowbar Sat 29-Sep-18 10:52:52

I usually get one particular friend having a go at me & calling me a 'bigot', a 'monster' & 'history will judge you!'.

No idea why he hasn't just unfriended me.

I haven't unfriended him because a) we go back years & b) every time he froths his bollocks off shouting at me, I reply calmly & politely with facts & examples, & another couple of mutual friends start going 'what...hang on?!'. It's like having My Own Personal Adrian!

If I post in response to anything TRAish he posts (he was all over that crap about razor blades), I get absolutely dog piled by about 3 of his Super Woke Mates - & still people start going 'hang on - wtf?!'.

I've definitely lost one friend - a TW who actually I really liked, who quietly ditched me in the aftermath of an exchange with the friend above. I'm sad about that. But I've also made several excellent new FB friends who are GC...

I'm lucky enough not to live or work in the UK, so reasonably un-doxxable. But it's still bloody scary - I posted the Indy article on Guides late last night, woke up this morning, saw who'd commented & thought 'uh oh...'

BUT the tide is definitely turning. I can feel it. smile

ThefusilliJerry Sat 29-Sep-18 10:56:16

One of the benefits of living in the Tory shires is you can generally count on a sensible response if this issue comes up in conversation.
The vast majority of people in this country think the whole thing is nuts - if they know about it

TransposersArePosers Sat 29-Sep-18 11:13:09

The vast majority of people in this country think the whole thing is nuts - if they know about it

That says it all really, but the media interest in the last few weeks has helped me enormously as I'm sure people were indulging me earlier this year when I started talking about Swim England! If everyone tells 10 people we can really get some coverage on this issue

AngryAttackKittens Sat 29-Sep-18 11:18:31

Incidentally, if Bunce chose to go to work in a dress & wig once a week while retaining the name Philip & using the men's toilets, I'd have no problem with that. It's the concept of woman as a costume that I object to.

I mean, I might point out that shocking pink lace is not really office appropriate, and that middle aged people look very silly with bows on their heads, but in general if men want to wear dresses that's fine with me. Just as long as they don't pretend that it makes them women on the days when they do so.

Womaningreen Sat 29-Sep-18 11:23:55

@ThefusiliJerry

"One of the benefits of living in the Tory shires is you can generally count on a sensible response if this issue comes up in conversation."

I did wonder this actually. I live in London and hardly dare raise the issue. I haven't had anyone yell transphobe at me, but they certainly think I'm being "overly suspicious" of men as a class.

liltclassic Sat 29-Sep-18 12:01:53

I mentioned something at a girls night recently and got yelled at by 12 women. It's viewed very differently where I live. These women all see themselves as staunch feminists, liberals etc.

Now everyone thinks I'm some kind of bigot.

They might yet come around. I had one friend tell me I was a transphobic bigot when I first raised this issue. He now seems to agree with me, having thought about it.

Interestingly though, we were discussing it last week and I asked if he thought women who asked for a female doctor/nurse for a smear test should be given no choice but to have a trans woman doctor/nurse carry out the procedure. He said he thought we should have no choice.

Once I’d recovered from my disbelief I asked if he felt the same about trans men and prostate examinations. Surprisingly, he didn’t, and changed his mind about the smear question.

MagicMix Sat 29-Sep-18 12:12:51

It must depend on your social circle. I'd be crucified. I have mutual friends with some full on public TRAs.

glagdy Sat 29-Sep-18 12:46:44

To be fair I live in a very liberal area of the States. In other areas there's so much bigotry and hatred I think it causes an ott knee jerk reaction to normal, kind people when faced with issues like this.

ThirdAttempt Sat 29-Sep-18 14:35:13

The thing is, if you only get 2 likes for a GC post instead of the 30 you'd normally get for a family photo or whatever, you don't really know what the other 28 are thinking. If they don't respond, they might vehemently disagree with you, or they might be GC but even their clicking Like would 'out' them as being such.

(Btw I've been lurking on FWR for months, especially around the trans/Self ID discussion, and this is my first FWR post - please be nice!!)

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