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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Sexual assaults on Vulnerable Women Prisoners

27 replies

Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 08:52

Reported in the Sun and Mail today.

This makes me really really cross. It was blindingly obvious this was going to happen. Putting a convicted criminal with a penis into a woman's prison is wrong and a complete infringement of their rights.

It doesn't just impact those assaulted. Can you imagine how it must feel to be locked up with someone who is in for violent or sexual crimes, even rape?

This atmosphere where it is'transphobic' to consider, mention or describe the impact of this on females has to stop. It is beyond ridiculous.

OP posts:

Report

Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 08:58

Maria Miller's enquiry were provided with written evidence from experts that this would happen. It included an offer of oral testimony. Not only were the experts not called to give oral evidence but the written evidence was ignored. Not even mentioned in the considerations.

What kind of 'purported feminist' would do that to some of the most vulnerable women in society?

I hope Penny Mordaunt cares and thinks about these women.

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nauticant · 18/07/2018 08:59

Others were quicker off the mark:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3309758-This-never-happens-male-offenders-in-female-prisons

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3309831-To-feel-sickened-that-this-man-is-being-referred-to-in-this-way-WARNING-UPSETTING-CONTENT

The latter has a startling post in which one of the TWAW cult calls women who want to discuss the danger of men in women's prisons "bitches".

BigGreenOlives · 18/07/2018 09:05

I hope that the women are represented by a shit hot lawyer (to quote the divorce threads) and sue the governor/Home Secretary - surely there is a duty of care assumed when you encarcerate people. Those poor women.

Popchyk · 18/07/2018 09:33

Sun link

Transgender lag ‘sexually abused four female prisoners’ days after arriving at West Yorkshire jail

The inmate was sent to a women’s prison despite not having had gender reassignment surgery

Popchyk · 18/07/2018 09:36

Daily Mail link

OvaHere · 18/07/2018 09:42

This is such a violation of human rights. No woman incarcerated should be at risk of becoming pregnant, forcibly or otherwise.

What is their ultimate solution to this? Force every female below menopause on to birth control? What if that is contraindicative to their health needs?

I can't believe this is being done despite the Prison Service making it clear to Maria Miller what a dangerous road this was to tread.

Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 09:49

Thanks all sorry I missed other links!

This just makes me so cross.

How have we got to the point where it is 'transphobic' to even talk about protecting women who have no choice about being locked up with rapists?

And then you have people like Dr Harrop sending malicious email communications to hotels who host meetings for a Labour women led movement to discuss and raise awareness of issues like this.

And God knows who persuading the Quakers we shouldn't be able to meet there to discuss safeguarding implications for women either.

The idea that discussing the impact on women of men saying they are women and changing policy and law to reflect this has GOT to change.

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Popchyk · 18/07/2018 09:51

Good article in The Metro actually.

link

"Women and Equalities Committee looked at the issue of transgender prisoners as part of their wider report on Transgender Equality, published in January 2016. The Committee said there was a ‘clear risk of harm’ where trans prisoners are not located in a prison ‘appropriate to their acquired/affirmed gender’.

The report references risk of harm to the male offender, not the female inmates forced to share accommodation with them.

Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 10:34

The report references risk of harm to the male offender, not the female inmates forced to share accommodation with them.

This sums up everything that is wrong with that report and the state of the worldwide debate on this issue.

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nauticant · 18/07/2018 10:41

It looks like this is the issue that finally gets a breakthrough on AIBU with nearly all posters saying "WTF!" while the very few trans allies saying TWAW are looking deranged to the rest of the thread.

Accepting self-ID means that TWAW which means it could soon not be possible to keep rapists with penises out of women's prisons. The AIBU thread seems to have a fair few lightbulb moments where posters are now seeing this. And they really don't like it at all.

OvaHere · 18/07/2018 10:59

So much misinformation bandied about on that thread. People are still buying into wrong body and lady brain.

This is what makes it difficult, it takes concerted effort to start reading and researching beyond the propaganda to see what is really going on.

Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 11:00

Thanks Nauticant. It is just so clearly wrong isn't it?

What is Stonewall's line on this?

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Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 11:01

Nic Williams from Fair Play For Women on the radio about this this morning:

mobile.twitter.com/talkRADIO/status/1019496611569860608

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VulvaOfSteel · 18/07/2018 11:06

What is Stonewall's line on this?

I believe it is "Transwomen are Women".
"Transwomen are Women".
"Transwomen are Women".

VulvaOfSteel · 18/07/2018 11:06

"Transwomen are Women".

nauticant · 18/07/2018 11:09

It is just so clearly wrong isn't it?

To me it's amazing that some people are so bound to the ideology that they can't allow themselves to see that something in front of their eyes is very wrong.

VulvaOfSteel · 18/07/2018 11:10

"Transwomen are Women".

And then "Transwomen are Women". Again. Until you believe it.

The thing is, if they gave in on this, and said, yes, "TWAW but some people might be a bit dodgy and TWAW aren't like those dodgy pedophiles/rapists we're going to let you have a separate prison for them they'd probably do a lot better. As this sort of thing will increase and there will be a backlash.

It makes you wonder why they're not worrying about the larger portion of non raping transexuals rather than pandering to the sexual abusers.

Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 11:35

It makes you wonder why they're not worrying about the larger portion of non raping transexuals rather than pandering to the sexual abusers.

Indeed

The ideology and mantra implode at points like this. But yet as you all say many just keep repeating it anyway. It writes the women (the prisoners in this case) completely out of the picture.

www.order-order.com/2018/06/11/libdem-policy-transphobic-call-ian-huntley-ian-huntley/amp/

Beardy dude bros like that is one thing. But I just don't understand how normally staunch and empathetic defenders of women's rights and equality like Sarah Champion, Stella Duffy, Stella Creasy, even Penny Mordaunt FFS can't see the dangers and implication of such a powerfully asserted slogan.

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R0wantrees · 18/07/2018 12:00

twitter.com/Danvers07943910/status/1019374461471068161

Danvers twitter comment: "Submission made during the process which led to The Miller Report. These professionals who work with offenders were ignored by the Women’s and Equalities committee"

(attachment to tweet shown)

Sexual assaults on Vulnerable Women Prisoners

bd67th · 18/07/2018 12:04

What is their ultimate solution to this? Force every female below menopause on to birth control? What if that is contraindicative to their health needs?

Birth control methods all have some hazard to the user. Even my amazing frameless IUS has a slight perforation risk during insertion. Rape and sex also run the risk of STI transmission.

My "ultimate solution to this" is to require that either NO MALES EVER are allowed in female prisons, including prison guards because they use their power to rape, or that only post-SRS males (so no penis) are allowed in.
My

HumphreyCobblers · 18/07/2018 12:07

One of those reports state the transgender prisoner assaulted FOUR TIMES before he was removed from the prison.

Why not after the first one?

of course he shouldn't have been there in the first place, but why did they wait until three more assaults before they sent him away?

R0wantrees · 18/07/2018 12:12

but why did they wait until three more assaults before they sent him away?

This is such an important question.

RepeatAfterUs · 18/07/2018 12:33

This is terrible - no one seems to care about it until it actually happens. It feels like oh it's only women in prison. Who cares what happens to them.
You can comment on FB Sun and DM page. The vast majority of comments are WTF

nauticant · 18/07/2018 12:39

This is terrible - no one seems to care about it until it actually happens

You get that all the time. Trans allies argue for safeguards to be removed, gender critical women say "but what about the increased risk of assaults?", and the reply is "no problem, assaults are illegal, so firstly any assaulter would go to prison, but in any case they'd be deterred by the law".

RepeatAfterUs · 18/07/2018 14:23

Yeah I know, as I've heard said on here - women and children shouldn't be collateral damage.
But hey someone's identity is far more important

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