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Had a reply from CRUK re "cervix havers"

(299 Posts)
ShotsFired Sun 24-Jun-18 10:26:26

(Longstanding donor, I emailed them following this article: www.thetimes.co.uk/article/smear-test-campaign-drops-the-word-woman-to-avoid-transgender-offence-263mj7f6s?shareToken=84b68d81ce844a6f55b8e64b9a36757b)

The meat of their reply as follows.

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We want to make it clear that this is not about disengaging women from the screening programme, or eradicating the word women. It’s our duty to make sure that everyone who is eligible for this screening programme knows about it. Research shows that cervical screening prevents at least 2,000 cervical cancer deaths each year in the UK so it is vital that we raise awareness that Cervical cancer develops in anyone who has a cervix.

In addition to this, screening might not be relevant for all women such as those who have had a full hysterectomy. We phrased our information on cervical screening to reflect this. Some women identify as men but still have a cervix, so we wanted to make it clear that they would still need to be aware of the screening programme.

We do always welcome feedback and so I do thank you for getting in touch. We definitely want to ensure that our messaging is as accessible as possible for lots of different audiences and do not want to discourage anyone who has cervix from the screening programme. We will make sure that’s considered for future communications.
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Based on this I have now decided to withdraw my donation from CRUK and support a charity that focuses specifically on female gynae cancers instead.

Serfisafleur Sun 24-Jun-18 10:27:54

We do not want to discourage anyone with a cervix...
shock

Serfisafleur Sun 24-Jun-18 10:28:12

Fuck that shit

SwearyG Sun 24-Jun-18 10:31:05

In addition to this, screening might not be relevant for all women such as those who have had a full hysterectomy

This is right out of the TRA playbook. We can’t say women because what about women who have had hysterectomies? Are you telling them they’re not women? What about their feelz?

It drives me bananas. Those of us who’ve had hysterectomies know we’re women and everyone else does too. We don’t feel excluded when someone says women to mean women who haven’t had part of their anatomy removed. It’s just such patronising horseshit.

TransplantsArePlants Sun 24-Jun-18 10:31:17

If this is there aim I really wouldn't have a problem with 'Women, and others, who have a cervix' I suspect that is pretty redundant because I suspect (I don't know) that trans men are likely to be much more aware of biological terms than the average punter.

ScienceIsTruth Sun 24-Jun-18 10:35:31

Well, @ShotsFired, I'm glad you posted their reply. I, too, will be withdrawing my monthly donation (after over 10yrs). This is ridiculous behaviour from them, and I'm really disappointed.

TimeLady Sun 24-Jun-18 10:38:12

I find it hard to believe that any transperson with a cervix or prostate would be allowed cross-sex hormone treatment or surgery without basics like this being explained

Kettlepotblackagain Sun 24-Jun-18 10:38:52

In addition to this, screening might not be relevant for all women such as those who have had a full hysterectomy

Eh? Since WHEN has it even been a passing through that women who have had hysterectomies are not women?

What a load of patronising bullshit.

They've fucked up. They know it. But theyre too arrogant proud to admit it.

TuTru Sun 24-Jun-18 10:39:19

I don’t have a problem with it anyway. I think their reply is valid too.

TheDishRanAwayWithTheSpoon Sun 24-Jun-18 10:39:51

What about women who might not know they have a cervix? It's definitely more than possible that there are women in the UK who are uneducated and aren't aware of what a cervix is, what about women who don't speak much English? They are much more likely to know the word 'woman' over the word 'cervix'
If you want to prevent cancer you want to make it as easy and accessible as possible, and by complicating the language you immediately make it that bit less accessible

Kettlepotblackagain Sun 24-Jun-18 10:42:55

Good news - TuTru has come along to tell us all it's no problem! That's it then. Debate over.

Mossandclover Sun 24-Jun-18 10:44:05

If they can’t say women because some might have had a hysterectomy and not be aware that they no longer have a cervix, how on earth can they assume that women who have not had such drastic surgical intervention know they have a cervix?

LangCleg Sun 24-Jun-18 10:47:26

It’s just such patronising horseshit.

More evidence that all our large third sector orgs have been taken over by pomo-addled nitwits, if you ask me.

Woke credentials are more important than service users. That's where we are now.

I don't donate to CRUK but if I did, I'd cancel the DD and find a smaller, woman-centred cancer charity to support instead.

InTheRoseGarden Sun 24-Jun-18 10:47:41

I completely agree dish. Trans men and those who have had hysterectomies will know more about female anatomy than most. Given the huge general ignorance about female anatomy, using the term "cervix" will reach fewer people than using the term "woman". Their reasoning is bullshit.

HotRocker Sun 24-Jun-18 10:49:26

As if women who have had a hysterectomy wouldn’t be deeply, painfully aware of their own biology.
Why don’t they just say women and people who have a cervix?
They won’t say that because nowadays not all women are women. Another case of the many being fucked over for the few.
Are we going to see their campaigns for testicular and prostate cancer change?
Honestly I could rant and rave about this. It’s disgusting, dangerous and deeply exclusionary.
Ah well, as long as it’s only women they’re excluding…

MyRelationshipIsWeird Sun 24-Jun-18 10:50:19

I find it hard to believe that any transperson with a cervix or prostate would be allowed cross-sex hormone treatment or surgery without basics like this being explained

This.

There will be women who, for whatever reason, don’t know what their cervix is. There will be women who have had surgery and are aware that they no longer have a cervix. There will be trans people who, however manly they feel, know full well that they have female biology and that anything regarding women’s cancers still applies to them.

The most likely group to be disadvantaged by this message is women who don’t speak English as a first language or those who are less well educated. I don’t imagine for one moment that trans men are going to miss the message if it includes the word ‘women’ whereas those others may well miss it if it doesn’t .

I appreciate that by not saying ALL women CR are avoiding the possibility of a trans woman turning up and asking for their smear test, but I’m sure that is an unintended positive from this!

Shampooeeee Sun 24-Jun-18 10:52:09

Thanks for posting this.
Such a shame as I used to be a regular supporter and my friend is just about to run a race in memory of her sister who died of cancer at a shockingly young age. I would have given an enormous donation but I can’t support them now.
I am a woman, not just a person with a cervix.

Randomname234 Sun 24-Jun-18 10:52:23

Why are you acting as if this is the only campaign that they do? The only message they have. Here is a campaign from 2017. Recent. Women women women.

Have a look at the cervical cancer page on their website. Women women women.

Whether you agree or not, some people do identify as men while having a cervix. Surely it's okay to have one campaign piece aimed at them? They may not think about cervical cancer or screenings.

IMHO, the more information we can get to more people, the better. And it is your right to ignore this particular piece of media. There is plenty of women-centric information out there.

TuTru Sun 24-Jun-18 10:53:49

I was just giving my opinion for balance.

The fact that screening is available to anyone with a cervix. That’s just fact.
It’s not about eradication of women, it’s available to anyone with a cervix.

UpstartCrow Sun 24-Jun-18 10:53:56

Such ignorant bullshit.

Women have a cervix until they don't.
Women that don't have a cervix are likely to know they dont have a cervix and not waste the time of the screening services - as is the GP who calls them in for screening.

Women that don't have a cervix don't resent the ones that do being reminded that they need screening. If they've lost their cervix to cancer they are more likely to want other women to avoid the same fate.

PeakPants Sun 24-Jun-18 10:55:56

Could just say 'women with a cervix' then, couldn't they. Wouldn't that be easier? Given that the number of adult trans men is pretty tiny, I am not sure that removing the word woman from the advertising campaign in any way helps increase numbers for screening.

I don't think it's a bad thing to stop donating to CRUK. They get half a BILLION in donations every year, seem to hugely prioritise easily curable and detectable cancers and pay their executives obscene amounts of money.

Lancelottie Sun 24-Jun-18 11:01:48

I know a couple of GCSE biology markers.

You'd be astonished at the words that recently-educated teenagers do NOT know about their own anatomy. Cervix is definitely one of them.

(To quote friend, 'If this candidate thinks her cervix is part of her brain, I worry for her future relationships.')

tribpot Sun 24-Jun-18 11:02:43

Here is a link to PHE's Screening Inequalities Strategy. It looks as if the major barrier to uptake across both cancer and non-cancer screening is social deprivation, followed by ethnicity. Rates of screening may be lowest in the populations which need it the most. Perhaps Cancer Research UK would like to focus its efforts proportionate to need?

Popchyk Sun 24-Jun-18 11:04:52

Random, on the CRUK website itself references to women have been removed on the list of cancer types. Yet references to men have remained. So it isn't just one Tweet. Or one campaign.

List of cancers here

Cervical cancer
Cervical cancer is when abnormal cells in the lining of the cervix grow in an uncontrolled way. The cervix is the lower part of the womb. It is the opening to the vagina from the womb. The main symptom is unusual bleeding from the vagina. Finding changes in the cells through screening can help to prevent cancer developing.

Breast Cancer
Breast cancer is cancer that starts in the breast tissue.

Womb cancer
The womb is the pear shaped muscular bag that holds a baby during pregnancy. Most womb cancers start in the lining of the womb. They are also called uterine or endometrial cancer. The endometrium is the lining of the womb.

Prostate Cancer
Prostate cancer is cancer that starts in the prostate gland, which is a walnut sized gland at the base of the bladder in men.

Testicular Cancer
Testicular cancer is cancer that develops in the testicles, which are part of a man's reproductive system.

Penile cancer
Penile cancer is cancer of the penis. It is a rare cancer in the UK. It can develop anywhere on the penis but is most common under the foreskin in men who haven’t been circumcised or on the head of the penis (the glans).

You'd have to wonder why CRUK rewrote the wording of women's cancers (and breast cancer patients are composed of more than 99% women and less than 1% men) and yet somehow chose not to do the same for men's cancers.

LizzieSiddal Sun 24-Jun-18 11:04:55

Why are they still asking men to go for prostrate checks??

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