10 month old sleeping disaster

[TheChineseChicken]

I need help! 10 month old DD has always been an ok sleeper, never slept through but usually goes 7-7 with a 5-minute feed around 3am. The last few weeks have been pretty bad. Still going down ok at 7 but now usually waking up between 5.30 and 6 and often waking up 2-3 times during the night. DH often tries to settle her but she goes crazy screaming and will only settle for me and often only with a feed. I've been trying not to feed every wake up as I don't want to reinforce her waking but it's the quickest way to get her back to sleep so I often give in.

Last night she fed at 1.30 then was awake screaming again at 3. I spent 30 minutes trying to calm her and resisted feeding even though she was thrashing around in the cot and she eventually went back to sleep, only to wake at 5.30.

She's been teething recently but I feel like this is a more fundamental problem than tooth pain IYSWIM.

Any suggestions for how we can get her sleeping back on track? Thanks

[FATEdestiny]

Do you have an alternate way to get her to sleep? How does she go to sleep at bedtime and naptime?

For independant sleeping she needs to be going from fully awake to asleep in the cot and for feeding and sleeping to be completely seperate.

Frequent waking can also be linked to lack of daytime sleep and also lack of total calories over the whole day. So what is daytime sleep like and how is weaning going?

[TheChineseChicken]

Hi FATE I can usually get her back to sleep with shushing etc, it just takes a lot longer! She goes down for naps and bedtime awake and happy and hasn't been fed to sleep for most of her life TBH. Her last feed in the evening is 6.15 so there's a good gap between that and bedtime.

Naps: she has about 1h15 at 10am and the same at 2pm (on a typical day). The afternoon nap is sometimes on the go e.g. in the car.

She eats well. Porridge for breakfast, yesterday lunch was a sandwich, 2 small rice crackers, cherry tomatoes, blueberries and some fruit purée. Dinner was about 30g of pasta with tomato sauce and cheese. 4 milk feeds at least in 24 hours.

[FATEdestiny]

They are good naps, assuming about 11-12h sleep at night. Since night time sleep went pear-shaped, has she been making up for lostslerp with more daytime sleep? Because it could be that you have gotten into an over tiredness cycle. A baby not getting enough sleep has more disturbed sleep, more light sleep, wakes more easily, less deep sleep. So it ends up spiralling into worse and worse sleep.

If it was me, assuming baby had alternate comfort in the night, I would night wean. I know feeding to sleep is quickest and easiest, but I would start shushing etc instead.

And also work in increasing daytime sleep so baby can catch up on sleep lost with broken nights.

[TheChineseChicken]

I wonder if overtiredness could be the key. We're at home today so plenty of opportunity to nap so I'll see if that helps tonight.

On your point about night weaning would you wean completely, even the usual one wake up? I have been considering this, particularly since I am going back to work soon, but I read conflicting advice about it. There is a suggestion that it doesn't necessarily stop night wakings but means you don't have an effective means of getting them back to sleep. What is your experience?

[HomityBabbityPie]

We had this with our now fourteen month old and the key was night weaning. He was just at the age where I think waking up for the milk was stopping him settle back afterwards.

Since we night weaned he's slept through 6.30-6.30.

[TheChineseChicken]

Thanks Homity, that's interesting. Can you remember how you night weaned? Any tips on how to do this would be great

[FATEdestiny]

I read conflicting advice about it

That's because there are loads of different 'right' things to do, not just one definitive answer. For example what id do would be right for my parenting style and child, but doesn't mean all alternate options are 'wrong'.

So The Answer depends on (a) your parenting style and (b) your child's tempriment.

An attachment parent would always want to be her child's source of comfort. So while encouraging less waking, would always feed/cuddle when wake ups do occur. Night weaning would hapoen only when child no longer wakes for a feed, so could be a year or 3 down the line.

A parent favouring independant sleep would have completely seperate feeding and sleeping, will have a few options for independantly accessed soothing methods and would night wean for the sake of independant sleep.

A child without any other ways to get to sleep would need to be fed to sleep regardlesss of the mothers preferred parenting style, otherwise the child would end up sleep deprived.

... and all of the other millions of connotations.

Personally, I would have stopped that night feed some time ago. The best time to night wean is when the child is well rested, so getting plenty of daytime sleep. Then you don't have an over tiredness cycle on your hands. So at the time when baby was sleeping all night (apart from the 3 minute wake) and sleeping well in the day, I would have taken that stable period as the time I would night wean.

[HomityBabbityPie]

Absolutely - we just went cold turkey. I went in and offered comfort, didn't leave him to cry at all - dummy, patting, cuddles etc. First night he was livid and it took 2 hours to settle him. Second night he settled in twenty minutes. Third night he slept through and has done pretty much ever since. Funnily enough, when he has the odd bad night due to teeth or an illness I've sometimes given him milk for comfort but when he's feeling better he always goes back to sleeping through.

[TheChineseChicken]

Ok, this is all great. Spoken to DH about night weaning and we have agreed that we will start the process on Saturday night, all being well. Thanks so much for your advice, both!

[CosyPinkBlanket]

Hi ChineseChicken, how did it go last night? I'm about to try and stop feeding 9-month old dd to sleep and try and get her into her own room so I'd be interested to know how got on and also hopefully pick up a few tips!

[TheChineseChicken]

Well last night was a bit odd in the end. DD woke several times in a row moaning and I could tell we had a night of multiple ups and downs ahead. So I brought her in with me for the first time ever and she slept there all night without a feed. So... while it wasn't a typical night it suggests to me that her night feeds are for comfort rather than hunger so I'm feeling confident about night weaning! Going to try it tonight so will report back

[CosyPinkBlanket]

Good luck! I'm still too scared to try not feeding her and putting her in her own room after last night. She had a proper meltdown which she's never done before.

[TheChineseChicken]

I think a meltdown is probably to be expected, sadly! But the key is to be consistent so stick with it. I guess you may find tonight is easier?

[CosyPinkBlanket]

I'm no good with meltdowns. I feel so guilty and bad that I do everything I can to soothe her. Including bfing her and putting her in little crib beside our bed! Dh is away for a few days so I'm on my own so not even got him for moral support! I am going to try not feeding her to sleep tonight but will keep her beside me. One step at a time but I know I'll cave as hate seeing her upset.

[TheChineseChicken]

How did your night go Cosy? I'm really sorry to say that DD slept through totally out of the blue! It's like she knew... Hoping it wasn't a one-off

[CookingMamama]

My DD is nearly 10 months and I personally think a bit young to be going cold turkey with milk if waking for it. Could she be having a growth spurt?

I put DD to bed at 8pm, any earlier and shes awake by 4/5am. I still feel once in the night but she does 8pm-6/7am mostly.

[CosyPinkBlanket]

Wow Chinese, that's great! Hopefully you're feeling pretty well rested this morning although I know it takes more than one good night to feel refreshed! As dh is away, I just kept our same routine of BFing to sleep in the crib beside our bed. It was 11.30pm when she eventually went dowm and she was up at 6.15am. She woke once (I'm sure it was only once) through the night for a feed. My dd doesn't really do sleeping. She rarely naps through the day and if she does they're either long naps in the car or buggy or 5-10 minute power naps at home. She's never asleep before 10pm despite starting her bedtime around 7.3pm. She fights sleep whether it's a nap or bedtime. My dm tells me that I didn't sleep for two years when I was a baby (karma?!?!) and maybe my dd is just one of those babies who doesn't need a lot of sleep.

Cooking, I could never just go cold turkey as she gets quite upset even if it takes me too long to latch her on. She loves nursing and sometimes she just uses me as a dummy (she's never had a dummy and just used suck her fingers although she's stopped doing that). She will feed, drop off at the breast but still keep suckling. If I try and put her down then she will wake up. I am more than happy to keep feeding her through the night as she needs it but I really would like her to start falling asleep without BFing and also in her cot in her own room as she's getting too big for her crib as she can stand up now and is at risk at toppling over!

[FATEdestiny]

Growth spurts at 10 months should be resulting in bigger mealtime portions. An increase in milk feeds (daytime or night time milk feeds) would be an unhealthy means to increase calories.

We are not talking a tiny baby on a

[FATEdestiny]

(My toddler pressed post for me, too soon)

We are not talking a tiny baby on a growth spurt. Neither is 10 months in the realmes of early weaning. It's well on the way to solid food being the main diet.

Increasing night feed of maintaining them for the sake of calories isn't good for the child.

However, and it's a big However, if milk feeds are babies source of co.fort over night and baby has no other means of adequate comfort, then they become vital. In that situation you will certainly see increases in night feeds here and there, depending on the level of comfort baby needs.

TheChineseChicken - fantastic news!

[TheChineseChicken]

That sounds tough Cosy. Luckily we have never had too much of a relationship
between feeding and sleeping - DD just never really fed to sleep. The first step for you is definitely going to be breaking that association. Can you try changing your bedtime routine so you have a feed downstairs, not in the bedroom, then some quiet time in the bedroom before a bath and straight to bed? Apparently the 20 minutes straight after a bath are the most effective for inducing sleep (can't remember where I heard that). And can you move her cot into your room as an interim step so she gets used to it before moving her into her own room?

[CosyPinkBlanket]

I'm going to have to try something! She just fights sleep. She's been awake since 6.15am and is now ready for a nap. I've put her in her cot and am sitting on the floor beside it. She's sitting playing with one of her toys and babbling away. She cries if I leave the room and smiles when I come back in. If I try and ignore her (which is so hard for me to do) I think she'll drop off and it will mean that she has dropped off in her cot AND without being fed. So here I am sitting on the floor and she is sitting singing in her cot waving one of her toys around. Why doesn't she sleep?!?!

FATE, I don't think her night feeds have increased. I'm definitely BFing her less as, like you say, her portion sizes are going up. She's not on solids yet as she still only has two teeth but she's getting through plenty pureed meals and puddings and has plenty water and milk (from a cup to wash down her food).

Chinese, I'm definitely going to have to work on her bedtime routine I think.

[Luckystar1]

Fate on what evidence are you basing your assertion that more milk feeds is an unhealthy way of increasing calories??!

I'd be very interested to read that as I think your statement is a very, very dangerous one to make without backing it up with solid evidence.

Breast milk is perfect for maintaining a baby (which is what a 10 month old is) and is absolutely necessary for growth spurts and development leaps if that is what the child needs.

[TheChineseChicken]

Cosy I'm not condoning leaving a baby to cry for long periods of time but have you tried leaving her in her cot for just 2 minutes to see if she stops and goes to sleep? Sometimes babies just need to let off a bit of steam and if we dont leave them be and keep trying to comfort them they never get a chance to settle. Maybe next nap time just try timing her for 2 minutes to see what happens. Also, how often do you try for naps and after how much awake time? I find my DD kicks off if she isn't tired enough. At 10 months I would say approximately 3 hours awake time so if she wakes at 6.15 don't try for a nap before 9.15. This honestly made so much difference for us.

Playing in her cot is good as it means she has a positive association with it.

[CosyPinkBlanket]

I have left her to cry for a couple of minutes a couple of times and it just escalates. I've never forced her to nap and always taken my cues from her (rubbing eyes and face and yawning, playing with her ear and whingeing with a "booooo" noise). She usually gets tired again a couple of hours after waking but doesn't always sleep. I can see she's tired now but she just won't give into it. She's out the cot again and we're back in the lounge and she's just crawling about, standing at the coffee table and 'singing'!

[TheChineseChicken]

JUSt as an aside, it's obviously up to you how you feed your baby but don't worry about lack of teeth. I never did purees or mashed food and DD happily chomped on solid food for a few months before she got teeth