Please can we have someone really sensible on to do a webchat about smoking in pregnancy?

[PencilsInSpace]

In light of yesterday's report by ASH on smoking in pregnancy, and in light of the current thread on smoking in pregnancy with all its usual horrible responses, which are likely to drive pregnant smokers elsewhere and lead them to conclude that MN is not a place to seek support:

Please can we have someone really sensible on to do a webchat about smoking in pregnancy?

I'm sure ASH could suggest someone who can do a webchat. The main conclusion of their report is exactly the same as the issue that comes up on any thread here about smoking in pregnancy - everybody's great at rattling off the risks. Most people are totally shit at effectively communicating with PG smokers and supporting them to quit.

10% of women are still smoking at the time of delivery. That's at least 10% of pregnant women MN is letting down, because I wouldn't come here if I needed support, would you?

This is crap isn't it? Please can we do something to change the culture a little bit? It has to be OK for women who are pregnant and who smoke to ask for support.

[ew1990]

Just placemarking. Thanks pencils

[RyanStartedTheFire]

I think antenatal MH support is definitely a factor around smoking during pregnancy too. I know this isn't what this thread is asking, but I think it's something that needs to be mentioned and I'd really love for it to be addressed by an expert too.

[Thurlow]

Seconding. Would be really useful to have a reasoned debate.

[ComputerUserNotTrained]

This is an excellent idea :)

[PencilsInSpace]

I've just been reading this briefing for MW on smoking cessation interventions and it's excellent. It's produced by NCSCT who are the people who train stop smoking practitioners.

One of the editors is Linda Bauld who has been on for a Q&A before I promise not to be shirty with her this time. One of the reviewers is Louise Ross who is a pioneer of harm reduction policy in stop smoking services. Either or both of these women would be excellent to have on for a webchat, or failing that a Q&A or a guest post.

[PencilsInSpace]

There are a lot of posters on MN who have very strong opinons about women who smoke when they are pregnant and I am wondering where they have all gone.

Anybody who really cares about infant mortality and womens' health during pregnancy and beyond would surely want to bump this thread.

One in ten.

[PencilsInSpace]

[TheLegendOfBeans]

Bumping for you as I am that close to lighting up again and I'm 27weeks pregnant (after a previous horrible miscarriage, oh and the Allen Carr course).

And I think I'm "intelligent" and "above doing that kind of thing".

So good on you Pencils.

@MNHQ take note

[PencilsInSpace]

Have you got any support in place?

You can get in touch with your local stop smoking services here. You can use NRT in pregnancy or if that doesn't work, ecigs.

If you're stuck for tonight, can you have a bath and go to bed early?

[TheLegendOfBeans]

Oh love, I've not smoked since Jan 8th so no way am I starting now! I would never ever ever forgive myself if there was the tiniest thing wrong with baby and I had even a couple of puffs. So no danger here.

But MY GOD the throbbing urge is strong.

[Neverknowing]

I totally agree op!
I think there's lots of things like this with babies and pregnancies. I think it's the opposite way with breastfeeding, we're told it's good for our babies but not specifically why. It feels like you lose all control of your body when you have a baby inside you.

[DJBaggySmalls]

I used to chain smoke and used Alan Carrs book Easiway to Quit from Amazon. I went cold turkey, no patches or vaping. If you'd told mne that I could do it before I read a book, I would have laughed in your face.

[PencilsInSpace]

Quiet evening bump

gwan gwan gwan gwan gwan

[PencilsInSpace]

Well done DJ that book works for lots of people. Sadly not for everybody though, we need all the methods.

[PencilsInSpace]

bump.

[EmpressOfTheSpartacusOceans]

Bump.

[PencilsInSpace]

thanks for the bump!

[Howwwtohelp]

Honestly, I think 'support' comes dangerously close to condoning.

People manage to stop doing all sorts of dangerous things in pregnancy. Smoking should be one of them. Knowing how much you are harming a baby for the rest of its life should be enough; if it's not, I doubt a web chat will be.

[PencilsInSpace]

So how do we lower the 1 in 10 figure, Howww? ASH clearly think there is more to be done wrt staff training.

If a webchat helps break the stigma and makes it more OK for women to seek support I think that would be a good thing and I can't see what harm it could do.

If it goes a tiny way towards changing the culture on here then MN might not let so many women down who need support to quit.

Have you shared your funny views of support with Stop Smoking Services? Should they all just pack up shop because people should know better?

[Howwwtohelp]

But don't you think that there SHOULD be a stigma around some things? Genuinely?

[Howwwtohelp]

Smoking rates in general weren't drastically lowered just by throwing money at smiley friendly support.
They were lowered because of the stigma around smoking - pictures on the packs, no advertising, plain packs, reduced smoking in the media.

It's not 'cool' anymore; it has a stigma attached to it - so less people do it.

[Thurlow]

But we are now in a position where everyone knows how bad smoking is. There isn't a smoker in the country who doesn't know that it is bad for them, and there isn't a pregnant smoker in the ciuntey who doesn't know that there is a high risk of causing issues for the baby.

Therefore anyone who struggles to quit while pregnant (or who doesn't try to) clearly has other issues in place, such as stress, depression etc.

So clearly a different approach is needed than simply saying "it's bad".

[PencilsInSpace]

But don't you think that there SHOULD be a stigma around some things?

Not where it doesn't help, no. Especially not if it's counterproductive.

I don't know what you mean by 'smiley friendly support'. Do you mean the sort of support provided by SSS? They have a relatively good success rate. Over 90% of all quit attempts end in failure so I'm completely in favour of smiley friendly support and I think SSS do a bloody good job on the whole.

How would your philosophy work with, for e.g. weight loss? Do you think WW would be more successful if they shamed everyone who came through the door and called them a disgusting fatty? What about overweight PG women? That carries significant health risks for mother and child. Should we stigmatise and shame them?

I'm not going into the smoking rates again here, and what's influenced them. I've posted about it today on this thread. None of the things you have mentioned have had that much of an effect.

[Ollivander84]

Pictures on the pack, advertising, plain packs... none of that made a blind bit of difference to me because I was addicted
It's like sticking a picture of a dead person on heroin and titling it "you might die if you take this"
They know that, but the addiction pull is so powerful you don't think about it, or your desire to smoke overwhelms it
I smoked from 12 to 32 and not once in those years did I contemplate giving up. Even when the photos went on, even when the price went up, even when they put the doors on cigarette kiosks

[Polter]

Excellent idea Plenty, and one I'd fully support as someone who wasn't able to stop during pregnancy, but was able to cut down dramatically with the support of a wonderful non-judgmental and very pragmatic midwife.