AIBU to complain about the state of A and E last night?

[waterjungle]

I arrived at 9pm with my 1 year old. He had croup that started the previous night. We had two Drs appointments that day where they had said it was just a chest infection and not to be worried. Later in the evening he began to have problems breathing and we couldn’t get his temperature down so decided it was the sensible option.

A and E was heaving. Went to reception, they said wait to be triaged, 3 hours later my we were still waiting. There were so many people with what looked like minor ailments, cuts etc. One family with their 6/7 yr old had an additional 5 family members with them. They had set up a picnic and were feeding him trifle. There was nowhere to sit we got a space in the corner on the floor.

There was a paediatric Dr dealing with a mental health case in the children’s waiting room. That person had been turned away from the emergency psychiatric unit and the police.

The Dr came out and said there would be a 6/7 hour wait and they were overwhelmed. At this 50% of people got up and walked out including picnic family who left all their empty sandwich / crisp/ trifle detritus behind .

Dr caught sight of my son, noticed how unwell he was and rushed him through to resus. His oxygen levels were chronically low. He was in danger and at this point hadn’t even been triaged.

Various doctors came in and apologised saying we had been badly let down and hadn't got the care we should have. They are making a complaint, they told us it was only a matter of time before they missed something and somebody died. They said they were scared and wanted us to make a complaint too so it is officially flagged.

My heart goes out to them. They must be frightened to go into work, I have never seen an emergency room in such a state before. There is obviously chronic understaffing and underfunding but what were those people who walked out doing there? If they had a real emergency surely they would have stayed?

My son was admitted and is going to be fine but it could have been different. It may be different for someone else’s son or daughter. Please don’t go to A and E unless it is really nessacaery. AIBU to think I shouldn’t even have to say that?!

Also how do we go ahead making a complaint or who do we complain to without blaming the doctors or staff who are so obviously doing their best?

[Zebraaa]

Contact PALS
Sadly this isn’t uncommon :(

[HoneysuckIejasmine]

I think if the staff have requested that you do, you should. I'm not sure who to though. Sorry, nor helpful.

Hope you DC recovers quickly.

[Wellmet]

That sounds horrific. Glad your little one is going to be ok.

[AforEffort9]

PALS, MP. Compliment the individuals but complain about the system. This is my worst nightmare as a junior Dr- working at breaking point and still unable to deal with demand. Sorry about your DS, it sounds like he is on the mend though.

[Sewrainbow]

Ring pals. You can even mention the staff recommended that you do. Sometimes it is only through the complaints that the senior management take any notice. Sounds horrendous, but sadly it's the same everywhere. I agree with you about all those people who just got up and left, I do believe people should take some responsibility themselves about whether their situation is truly an emergency. I could give you many a tale about people in A&E who shouldn't have been there or end up demanding treatment for the most minor ailments even though they can see people in much worse situations having to wait.

[WarshipWarrior]

You should have called 111 they would have got an ambulance to you and admitted him straight onto a childrens ward. This happened with my daughter and we were told we would only get to this specific ward for child emergencies if we came in by ambulance if the paramedics deemed it necessary. Made much more sense in a way and she was in and out within a few hours and sorted (query meningitis but was a virus and chest infection in the end)

Just a heads up for next time. A&E is not a place for children anymore.

[Lwmommy]

You need to complain to the people using A&E when they shouldn't. All those people are taking up resource that should be allocated to genuine accidents and emergencies.

It's not like there's a big secret on how to access services, for the 'choose well' campaign I have seen billboards, adverts on TV/internet/radio/buses/bus stops/social media, news stories and posters in pharmacies, GP surgery's and in hospitals.

The NHS can only cope with so much, if it continues to be used and abused it will crumble.

[Wowzel]

You've got two choices if you decide to complain

Complaint to PALS - this is more informal

Compaint to the Complaints department - this is a formal complaint which generates a formal complaint response etc and a bigger investigation

I'd do option 2 in this situation

(disclaimer, I work in A&E)

[SauvignonBlanche]

Please complain, it’s not about the individual HCPs but about the pressures they were under.

[DirtyWindow]

Yes, complain.

[Bobbiepin]

@WarshipWarrior I'm afraid that isnt true. Both myself and my daughter have been taken to hospital via ambulance and everyone still gets triaged and treated in order of urgency. I had suspected meningitis and was made to wait in the waiting room and DD had lost consciousness and I couldn't wake her and we waited in paeds too.

[taytosandwich]

There always have been and always will be people turning up inappropriately to A&E, more and more now that it's so difficult to see a GP. those people really need to be factored in when the Powers that Be are deciding how much funding to send to A&E etc. My point is that it's a problem at Government level and they like it when we turn on each other and blame each other. Takes the heat off them.

[Raver84]

Ynbu but I've been to a and e a few times recently with my elderly mum and it's dire left in a chair for 8 hours left suffering infection sitting in a wheelchair. Incompetent and busy staff. Grime everywhere. Wards are no better too full understaffed no common sense approach. NO CARE. There is A lack of human hand to hand eye to eye care in recent years its the pits. I work in social care and have noticed a massive decline recently. It's dire.

[BanKittenHeels]

I work in the same set up as the HCPs you dealt with. Please complain but please don’t complain about the staff. Complain within trust and also to your MP. I tell patients that we will not be upset about this, we are desperate for more staff and more resources.

Whilst the child who left might not have looked unwell, they may have become very suddenly unwell if they left without even going through triage. And that’s always worrying.

All the best to you and your DS.

[CoffeeRunner]

I work in a busy hospital (not usually in A&E but sometimes).

The only way anyone ever takes notice is from patient complaints. Or parents of patients in this case.

As staff. We know where the failings are. We know what risks are about. But nobody listens to us.

[Actionhasmagic]

People need educating on when a and e is right for their needs

[ShowOfHands]

Our ccg has removed all minor injury services. Signs up in every GP surgery explaining that all cuts, burns, bumps etc must now go to A&E.

[7yo7yo]

Please don’t say the staff told you to complain.
That will unleash a whole new level of shit onto them.

[Kaykay06]

We take direct paeds ambulance admissions as long as they don’t require resus, otherwise they are admitted to our short stay assessment unit and then to a ward if needed.
This sounds really scary, especially with croup, why weren’t you even triaged??
Glad your wee man is ok, def complain as the outcome could’ve been much worse.

[BlueCornsihPixie]

I think you should complain. Often it is only patients complaints that are listened to

Make it clear it's not about the staff but about system.

You wouldn't believe some of the crap people come into A&E with, but then a lot of the time they've been let down somewhere else along the line and so go to A&E because they know that they can get healthcare there. Which is wrong but it's the entire NHS that is crumbling.

It must be awful for the A&E Drs, that must have been so scary for them and theres no let up.

Glad your little boys going to be okay and he was seen in time

[7yo7yo]

But yes, complain.

[SinkGirl]

Definitely make a complaint. I hope your son is okay. Unfortunately we’ve been in situations like this - where we’ve pursued the advised route, GPs have been dismissive, only to end up in A&E when things deteriorate. Unfortunately lots of people end up doing the same - if they can even get a GP appointment at all. Sadly the lack of primary care appointments and the rushed nature of those appointments puts a lot of pressure on A&E, and then people are chastised for going there when they have (or believe they have) no other option.

A few months ago my twins had chicken pox. One had a temp of 40 and screamed for 8 hours straight overnight. I called 111 as I was very worried and you could hear the woman on the phone was really concerned with what I was telling her, but no one called us back until 3am, at which point he’d briefly fallen asleep so they closed the case! Next morning I could see an infection was brewing so got him a GP appointment, DH took him - GP rushed through an exam, didn’t even look under his nappy where the worst of it was, said it was nothing to worry about and by 6pm that night his leg was bright red, streaky and swollen and he had black weeping sores, and we had to rush him to the hospital for the out of hours clinic there.

I honestly should have just taken him to A&E the night that he was screaming all night, but there’s obviously a big push not to go there. Sadly some people haven’t got the memo but many others end up going because they are desperate and badly let down elsewhere.

[Jollitwiglet]

Absolutely complain. Sadly no one listens when staff complain about the system failing, they just expect the staff to keep doing more when they have nothing more to give. Things like this need to be flagged up to support the staff when they say how understaffed they are

[StealingYourWiFi]

Yes please complain. I worked in a&e for 5 years and left because I felt there could be a preventable death at any minute and I didn’t want to be a part of it.

It’s amazing the amount of patients (with all their relatives in tow) that would come in, I would triage then they ask how long the wait is. I would tell them and they’d go ‘ah, I can’t wait that long. I won’t stay’. A&E isn’t the right place for a huge amount of those who walk through the doors but other services are lacking also and people simply aren’t educated enough. There’s needs to be some televised adverts or something, if can’t continue as it is.

[IDontDrinkTea]

Contact PALS and definitely complain.

But please don’t say that the staff told you to. The managers read that and look in the notes to see which staff you saw and who else was on shift, then those staff get called in to the managers office and get given a bollocking a formal polite reminder that the unit is adequately staffed if only you could work harder and more efficiently