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to understand why some people have a problem with abortion?

(1006 Posts)
LolaRennt Sun 12-Jun-11 15:56:43

I am pro choice first of all, just to get that out of the way.

But what confuses me is that on many threads I have seen if someone in a tiny voice dares to admit that they might have a an anti abortion view they get jumped on pretty quickly.

But surely if someone belives from a purely emotion point that abortion is the ending of a life you can't change that view simply by calling them a woman hater or abusing them? I can understand how pro choice people don't see abortion as a feminst issue or a human rights issue at all and can't get past the view that it is just ending a life.

I am a vegan and I don't wear leather or fur. I see it as murder. I know other people do it (even my friends, husband and family) but for me it will always be murder. Its a purely emotional view that go against what the vast majority of the western world see as normal. But there is nothing any of you could ever say that would make me change my mind. So maybe I can empathise better than some?

My belief is that women need safe access to abortion, no one likes the idea of abortion butit needs to be avalaible because the alternatives would be devastating. Wouldn't it make sense to approach it from that point of view to someone who is anti abortion? Accept that the idea maybe abhorent (and that they arent wrong for feeling that way) but it is a basic human right to not be forced to pregnant and that for many reasons it is the best choice for the woman?

LolaRennt Sun 12-Jun-11 15:58:31

and that they arent wrong for feeling that way

by that I mean none of us can be considered wrong for our feelings whatever they may be

Lady1nTheRadiator Sun 12-Jun-11 16:01:42

I find your post really wishy-washy tbh. The pro-life arguments I have read never agree that it's a human right to not be forced to be pregnant.

heleninahandcart Sun 12-Jun-11 16:05:37

YABVU not to have the fucking compassion to start this post almost in competition with another thread on abortion where the OP has a RL genuine distressing issue. Why now OP?

LolaRennt Sun 12-Jun-11 16:06:26

I didnt say they did! That's my point I think that would be a better point to get across to someone who is anti abortion than just saying they are wrong and to fuck off out of other people's private lives.

And yes, it probably comes across as a wish washy post because I am trying to be nice and say while I see their POV I still don't agree with it.

heleninahandcart Sun 12-Jun-11 16:07:05

Should read NOT to start this thread

LolaRennt Sun 12-Jun-11 16:07:56

There have been several abortion threads lately, heleninahandcart. This isn't to do with one in particular at all. And I certainly don't mean to be seen as offensive.

Lady1nTheRadiator Sun 12-Jun-11 16:08:07

So you are telling people who are pro-choice how they should interact and discuss with people who are pro-life? Have I got that right? And your veganism gives you some insight into how pro-lifers feel, is that it?

MsTeak Sun 12-Jun-11 16:08:10

Its not just about feelings and opinions though, is it? Because pro-lifers want to actually stop women from having abortions. So, yes, they get jumped on.

If you say "I personally don't like the idea of it and would never have one, however its not my place to have an opinion on YOUR body", you wouldn't get a kicking. But they don't say that.

Northernlurker Sun 12-Jun-11 16:08:51

Right I'm not totally sure what you're saying tbh but for me pro choice means that each individual makes their choice. They may choose something that I would not in that situation but that's fine because that's their choice for them. On the otherhand those who hold determinedly pro life views seem to want their choice, fitting with their moral compass, to be applied as the choice for everyone else.
In my view there is no decision more personal than the decision to continue or end a pregnancy. Others saying what you should do is neither helpful or kind. Posts who attempts to do that will get flamed and rightly so because we do not speak for one another on this issue. If and when you've been in that situation you know how hard the choice is. The idea that you should be oppressed by somebody else's choice is truly vile.

scarlettsmummy2 Sun 12-Jun-11 16:09:22

I am mostly pro life but I do totally accept that there are some circumstances where abortion is the best or only option. I do think it is wrong to abort a baby because it is inconvenient or doesn't fit in with your life plan.

I can't be the only one that thinks like this? on all the other forums I have seen if anyone even remotely mentions being pro life they are jumped on. I am from Northern Ireland and over there abortion is still prohibited. Many of my friends think the same as me but this very much doesn't appear to be the case on mumsnet. Are other members just reluctant to be set upon if they express this view?

LolaRennt Sun 12-Jun-11 16:10:24

Actually as my point has been made that I am pro choice and that I think people who are not pro choice should be shown compassion but still be convinced otherwise. I don't actually see how it could be seen as offensive.

honeybehappy Sun 12-Jun-11 16:12:34

At the end of the day it doesnt really matter what other people think. My old friend would sleep with everything that moved and got pregnant several times and just aborted the babies.... i think she is a cunt and do not agree with what she did. However there are lots of reasons that i agree an abortion is the right choice. I can't say i would never have one because i don't know what the future holds and the circumstances that i may be in.

LolaRennt Sun 12-Jun-11 16:13:45

So you are telling people who are pro-choice how they should interact and discuss with people who are pro-life? Have I got that right? And your veganism gives you some insight into how pro-lifers feel, is that it?

No, Im saying it might work better to discuss it one way than another. And I actually think veganism is a pretty good comparison. As it is a Prolife view of sorts

heleninahandcart Sun 12-Jun-11 16:14:10

OP have some imagination.

Lady1nTheRadiator Sun 12-Jun-11 16:14:51

scarlettsmummy I actually find your views harder to understand than staunch pro-lifers to be honest. How can you be 'mostly' pro-life? I think on the whole that the people who think abortion is murder of a real proper baybee are barking but at least they are consistent. Are you saying you think it's murder too but only sometimes? I mean abortion is abortion is abortion. You can dress it up and say, oh, there are abnormalities - so what, it's NOT murder now? THIS baby doesn't count? How do you decide which ones do and which ones don't?

scarlettsmummy2 Sun 12-Jun-11 16:15:53

honeybe- your friend is an example of exactly the kind of abortion I think is wrong. I don't think in her case he right to choose is more important than her babies right to live.

Lady1nTheRadiator Sun 12-Jun-11 16:17:00

You think veganism is like being a pro-lifer, yet you are one and not the other? I don't understand. Is an unwanted pregnancy the same as raising cattle for beef or leather? In what way?

Oh, I've got better things to do than this.

Lady1nTheRadiator Sun 12-Jun-11 16:18:59

Oh so abortion is only okay if you feel lots and lots of GUILT and ANGUISH over it and it breaks your heart. If you're relieved then you are a bad bad person. Right.

scarlettsmummy2 Sun 12-Jun-11 16:19:08

I think abortion in the case of child rape, rape and incest is understandable give that the mother had in no way control of the situation, although I do struggle with this. You are absolutely right- murder is murder, but i can understand why in those cases it would be very difficult to go to term. in the majority of other cases i think if you really don't want a baby give it up for adoption. their are lots of childless parents who would love the chance to adopt a baby.

youngwomanwholivesinashoe Sun 12-Jun-11 16:19:29

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

valiumredhead Sun 12-Jun-11 16:20:33

I agree with helen NOT nice to start this now, quite quite tactless.

youngwomanwholivesinashoe Sun 12-Jun-11 16:20:40

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

troisgarcons Sun 12-Jun-11 16:21:09

It's a personal choice. TBH I cant see the necessity to be hawking highly emotive and personal matters in public. Some things are just private and should remain so along with personal sex life,religion, politics and money. All provoke extreme responses. There is no right or wrong. It's preference. Don't shove your preference down my throat, and I won't shove mine down yours' If everyone followed that rule, we'd all be a lot more chilled out.

scarlettsmummy2 Sun 12-Jun-11 16:21:34

i really don't care about how the mother feels after the abortion- my concern is for the rights of the baby. I am currently 8 weeks pregnant. while my baby could not survive outside the womb, it still has fingers and toes and a heartbeat, and is absolutely not a buddle of threads. It is a real thing.

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