Dodgy Redundancy Selection Process

[Nassy]

Hi,

2 out of 5 team members (including myself) have just been made redundant.

I have phoned ACAS and I will be appealing against redundancy on the following events:

1- When originally put 'at risk' 3 out of 5 members of our team were polled because not have 'senior' in their job title.

2- My company then appeared to bumble through proceedings without sending the correct letters or really discussing any of our proposals.

They also couldn't tell us how many people (1,2 or 3) they were cutting but scheduled in scoring meetings for each of us based on skills, performance etc

3- A few days a ago my company then inform 2 of us that there has been a terrible mistake and that they had just found out that 1 of the members put at risk is also 'senior' in his job title and there for by default the remaining 2 of us are being made redundant!

I feel that using the 'seniority' in job titles to decide who should be made redundant is dodgy as none of us have ever had any appraisals or performances reviews. 1 of the colleagues who got made redundant is actually more experienced that one of the so-called 'senior' members!!! Also my company selected the wrong people as they didn't know who was senior and who was not.

I know for a fact that some people in the company wish that things had been done differently given the end result ie who lost their jobs and who hasn't.

Any suggestions on this? I had been told that had I had a scoring meeting I would have done very well and while it is nice to hear this it only makes it worse. I think that if they had selected everyone in my team (who are doing the same role) then there would be at least a small chance I would keep my job.

On the one hand I am thinking about drawing a line under this and moving forward. On the other hand feel there is nothing to lose in an appeal. Some closure would be nice

Appeal it but being honest don't expect to get anywhere (sorry to be honest).

You don't make people redundant you made the position redundant. Now having "senior" in the job title might not seem massive but if they had put all 5 at risk then that might have cascaded into others in the company.

The company cannot also decided how many people it is making redundant before the consultation starts (though many do).

At the end of the day its a bum deal, try to move on if you can.

OP your original post is a little confusing to read so I will just offer some general advice. In order to contemplate a redundancy you have to write a plan and follow a set procedure, if these are not followed correctly or if it can be shown that the selection pool was too small or if the criteria for selection was unfair then there is a good chance that there is a case for unfair dismissal.
From what I can make out your company appears to have failed to plan and follow procedure and if this is so you have a valid reason for an appeal. The CAB can be very helpful in this please contact them.

Sorry I also meant to say that ACAS are not always the best.

You do have grounds for an appeal, the process does sound dodgy, selection criteria not sorted out properly, information and consultation not done properly.

I would appeal it if I were in your position. You may not get the actual result changed, but at least you will draw your employer's attention to how their procedure wasn't fair, and if the people who wish things had ended up differently are influential people, that's good as well.

To overturn your redundancy at appeal may mean making someone else redundant who has been told they're safe, so from that point of view you can see that the chances of a reversal are fairly slim. But if you want to move on and get some closure, you may find that easier if you are comfortable that you did everything you could.

Thanks for the replies. I have just been away on a 1 week holiday to Portugal and have appealed.
A meeting is to be set up at the end of the week on Friday.

The latest is that reading my work e-mails I have now learnt just they are now thinking about a second redundancy selection process within the same team!

Given that someone in my company had let slip that they still hoped to get rid of the guy that they had wrongly put 'at risk' (ie because he happened to be protected by the very same criteria which I believe the company chose specifically to help oust him) I find the timing of this second selection process very dodgy indeed

It is not as if redundancies are being made across the board in other departments so to start a second consultation process just days after the result of the 'bodged' first process seems very very odd.

I totally agree with Flowerbeanbag that a U-turn is probably unlikely. Even if management realise the process was wrong, giving people their jobs back is a massive climb down.

I have already experssed anger when the decision was made and told the Company that I felt they had messed up their own selection criteria and therefore it wasn't fair to suddently make an apparent hasty decision to make me redundant (especially as I'd been promised a scoring meeting etc). They agreed and said I could vent anger but said it was the employee's fault (the one who they hoped to put 'at risk' but kept his job)!!

I think the objective for me at the appeal meeting is try and force my company to answer some very tough questions on this and see what they say. If they somehow managed to explain themeselves then I will accept this. Otherwise I will look at whether it is worth pushing to the next stage.