Working out Maternity Leave + Annual Leave accrued = when to return to work.

[AbFabT]

Hi.

I am going to email my Personnel Department in the next couple of days with the following which I have just drafted. Just wondering if anyone here thought it was reasonable what I am asking, and if there are any legal issues I should be aware of in case they try and tell me I can't do this, when I can!

I am due with my first baby on October 4th. I have an amazingly generous maternity package from work which is nine months on full pay (woo hoo), I can then take three months unpaid as further time off work. I also accrue annual leave during this time, which is where it gets a bit potentially tricky for my calculations!

Our annual leave year runs April 1st-March 31st. I currently have 42 days between now and March 31st 2011 (due to special circumstances, I was able to carry some days over from the previous year). I think the normal yearly annual leave entitlement is 31 days. With that in mind, can anyone make any sense of the following please!!! (Which is what I am planning on sending our personnel department, just without the above preamble!). Phew.

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Hi, ***

Hope all is well with you.

Are you the person I need to speak with regarding my MATB1 form, and any outstanding annual leave entitlement?

I haven't got my form yet, but 15 weeks before my estimated due date is 21st June 2010, and I believe I need to inform you by that date when I intend to work up until. My estimated due date is Monday 4th October 2010. I was planning on working as long as possible, seeing as most first babies are late, my commute to work is minimal, the actual job is sedentary and I can do it easily; I thought it would be manageable to stay on with my last day at work being Friday 1st October 2010, as I was hoping to have more time at the other end with my baby!

I currently have 42 days of annual leave left to take before 31st March 2011. How will this work, if I don't plan on using any of these days before I go on Maternity Leave? Will I be able to tack them on to the end of my year off (I also appreciate I accumulate a new batch of annual leave come 1st April 2011, which at my reckoning is exactly six months' worth (i.e. half of my annual leave allocation for the year = 15.5 days?) until I would be due back on 1st October 2011. My understanding is I can tack this on to the end of my year out, so I'd be back on a half day thus re-starting on afternoon of 24th October 2011), unless I am able to carry the annual leave for 2010-2011 out here, in which case, by my calculations, I would be due back on the afternoon of the 21st December 2011.

So:
1st October 2010 to 1st July 2011 - nine months' maternity leave, full pay
1st July 2011 - 1st October 2011 - three months no pay
1st October 2011 - 21st December 2011 (half day) - back on books as working, but not in work, on accrued annual leave using 42 days from 1st April 2010-31st March 2011, and 15.5 days from 1st April 2011-1st October 2011.
Return from maternity leave plus annual leave and commence work on 21st December 2011 (half day).

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MNers - as you can see, I am wanting to take as long as possible off after the birth! Any thoughts?!
I do know you experienced mums will probably laugh that I think I can work up to two days before my EDD, but this is what I'd like to tell work. If I give birth earlier, so be it! Physically, I really think it is doable - it's a five-minute walk from my front door, and the job itself I've been doing for so long I can do it on auto-pilot with my eyes shut!

Thanks.

Most organisations don't let you carry over leave into the next leave year. You may have to take it before you start your maternity leave, unless you can get them to agree otherwise.

I wouldn't worry at this stage about telling them when you intend to return. They'll probably assume that you are taking the full year in any case.

Have the baby, see how you get on with your amazingly generous 9 months full pay. You may want to go back then, you may not. Who knows how you'll feel? After my first DS was born I wanted to go back very part-time after 5 months. With my 2nd I stayed off for 13 months (I finished work at 29 weeks pregnant, took 11 months annual leave and 6 weeks or so of annual leave) before returning, somewhat reluctantly, to work.

Just get the annual leave question sorted so you know where you stand theoretically, then see how you get on. Good luck.

As far as your calculations about adding the holiday you've accrued from 1 April 2011 goes that makes sense (remember you could if you wished take more than six months' worth of that holiday year's leave at this point).

Whether they let you roll your holiday over from this holiday year to next though is entirely up to them. I would have thought they might be willing to do that for a week or so's worth but the full 42 days' worth sounds a big ask. I suspect that they will simply not believe you will be working up until a few days before your due date and will say you can't roll over simply to force you to take some of that holiday beforehand.

Haven't time to read in depth as off to bed. Great maternity and leave package! One thing you might have to be watch is that you may have to take a certain amount of leave before you go, depends how much you are allowed to carry over but we have to take a minimum amount of leave per year.

I like to spend my time at work figuring out how long I can take off as leave! Also, do you accrue BH as TOIL? I do.

One last thing is they may make you leave at leave a week before your EDD, I'm sure my work have that sort of policy. Do you really want to be working right up until your EDD? It will be the last freedom you will have ever for a while. My DD was only 2 days over due and I had 5 weeks off before she came along (it was bliss). I'd really recommend a bit more time. Good luck!

Hi,
I work for the NHS and was told I had to take all the leave I'd accrued up to the date I started ML before I went off on leave. I've taken the full year, and get 33 days leave, and had one week of leave due before I left.

So, my first week off was AL, then 1yr of ML began which ends on Sep 18th, and I'll return to work 33 days after this, as I have accrued 33 days during my year off.
I suppose it didn't really make any difference as I always had that time, and I personally wanted some time before DS was born (3 weeks early, be warned!!) But that's the way they've "labelled"it.

So if your company does this it's uinlikely they'll let you work up until just before the birth as there's no time for the AL to be taken.

Also remember that if you have any time off sick in, I think, the 4 weeks before your due date, your mat leave kicks in automatically. Which means you might not be able to go back to work even if you get better and are ok to work right up until the wire.
9months full pay????????? You lucky so and so!
Good luck x

Thanks for all the super-speedy answers! Wow!

llareggub, I am absolutely sure I won't be wanting to go back early!!! I've worked a lonnnnng time (I'm 36, this is my first baby), and I am SO ready to leave work and concentrate on my baby. I actually don't even want to go back to work at all - I have told Personnel this already, and they have advised that I should leave my options open, and that their policy is to pay me maternity leave even if I NEVER go back!

Ok, thanks, pumperspumpkin. That's kind of what I wanted to know, if I was legally entitled to carry over all this annual leave from this year, or if I'd be forced to use it up before I go off. If I have to use the 42 days prior to October, I'll be off WAY before this baby arrives!

Bumperlicious, thanks, I know! It's a brilliant package, and I am lucky.
Sorry, but what is TOIL? I do think I'd rather work as late as possible, though I guess a week before is also reasonable! 1st October just sounded like a nice round date, as the new annual leave starts on April 1st, it made my calculations easier!

Thanks, lovely74. I guess I just email Personnel and see what they are willing to give me.

I'm pretty confident that they could only make you take the al you've accrued up until you start ML so pro rata. And legally you are entitled to all your leave when you're on ML so if you normally get 31 days, then that is what you can tag onto the end of your year of mat leave.
They give you 9 months paid leave and you can then not return AND NOT PAY IT BACK?????
Good god, I need a new job!!!

Yes, I have been told I can definitely tack the 31 days on the end of the year off (though I think if it runs from April, it would just be 15.5 days), be paid for it. It's the 42 days I currently have until 31st March 2011 that I am not wanting to lose. I can carry seven days over from each year, so potentially 22.5, if I can't have the 42 at the end. My head hurts!!!
If I am off October to October, and the annual leave year runs April to April, do I have 31 days of annual leave at the end of my year off, or just half? I just don't know!

I wonder if I can start using my 42 days from October 1st, and then start maternity leave 42 days later, even though I'd already have had the baby by then!

Yeah - I am pretty sure that's what they said (about not paying it back if I don't return! If that's not the case, I'll return for the bare minimum that I have to, and hopefully have baby number two as quickly as is safe!).

You definitely won't be allowed to be on annual leave once the baby comes, as your maternity pay is automatically triggered by the birth of the baby. So if baby comes earlier than your EDD, so does your maternity leave.

I do understand how you feel about maximising your maternity leave. But honestly, no one really knows how they'll feel when baby arrives and the advice from your HR team to keep your options open is good advice.

It doesn't matter when your leave year starts and finishes, mine is also April - April. It's all to do with how much time you have off. So, you have a year, you accrue a years worth of leave, you take 9 months, you accrue 9 months worth.
But, you may have to take what you've accrued up until you start ML (definitely starts one the babe arrives I'm afraid) BEFORE you start mat leave. So what you've accrued pro rate April to October.

Legally they can't make you loose any of the leave you'll accrued already (unless some of the carry over was discretionary - I am allowed to carry over 5 days beyond april but if it's not used by the end of may, it#'s gone!)

Your HR dept are going to be the only ones who can tell you how it works. Just explain how much leave you have and see what they say.

And FWIW - I recommend taking somethime for yourself before the EDD, it is the last bit of this chapter of your life and should be appreciated befpre life changes beyond all recognition!

Ok, thanks for clearing that up, llareggub.
I hope I don't have to just waste 42 days though, you know? That's eight and a half weeks!

Though the maternity package and certain benefits are good, a few things have changed at my place of work making it actually quite unpleasant in the actual department I work in (and the job I do is specific, so I can't move departments), and I can't imagine even slightly wanting to go back to that. I have worked for a very long time, there alone I've been there nearly ten years. We've worked hard to have ok savings and reduce our out-goings, meaning I don't have to return for financial reasons, and DH earns ok in an industry that is reasonably secure - I really am quite confident I won't be feeling the lure of going back to work.

I loved those last few weeks of pregnancy. With my first pregnancy I used up all my leave beforehand and had 5 weeks of pregnancy yoga, aquanatal, reading, it was bliss!

Good luck with your pregnancy.

Thanks, lovely74. (I am also '74!)

Ok, well that's something, if I get the 31 says to tack on to the end rather than just 15.5, that's what I initially thought, but started to get confused! (Easily done!!!)

We are allowed to carry over seven. I carried an extra two from last year due to special circumstances. Don't think pregnancy is special circumstances for this year though (to them!)!

I'll send HR the letter above in the next couple of days then, unless I get any more advice here advising something better. Hope they are nice and generous! I don't REALLY see what harm it does them to allow it, if it's my leave, you know? I've earned it!

Thanks for the tip. I know this is my first pregnancy, but I feel SO ready for this chapter in my life - we had an extended trip recently for our honeymoon, I feel rested and good, and just want to prolong the time off at the end, and make the money go further, if I can.

Thanks, llareggub. I am more likely to do bugger all!

Bugger all is exactly what you should be doing before the baby comes! That and reading magazines/papers (which you may never do again!) See how you feel but I would take at least a week.

As for your annual leave they may just make you take a pro rated amount before you go. TOIL is time off in lieu. Basically I get to add up all the public holidays and tack them onto the end. Makes at least another week.

Good advice from the poster saying to wait and see how you feel. You don't have to decide now, aim for 9 months and then just see how you go.

Have a good time, and I'm glad you are feeling so fit and well (wish I could say the same. I'd finish tomorrow if I could!)

Ok, thanks for the advice. Hm, would be great to be able to add the bank holidays on as well. I'll ask about that!

Hope you are feeling fit and well soon!