home visit for sickness absence - what is the purpose?

[pavlovthesmugcat]

My boss told me yesterday that I have to have a home visit as I have been off sick since 26th April (with gp certificate) for hyperemesis (i work part time).

She gave me no reason for the visit only that she had to visit this week, and can only do this evening at 5pm.

I have agreed, but I don't feel comfortable about her coming to my home. I don't get on with her really. We get on fine with 'work' stuff but not with 'manager/employee' stuff (mainly as she is a crap manager and I make sure she does things properly in relation to me). She is notorious for not correctly recording/taking from meetings the content that was discussed, she hears what she wants to and acts like that was discussed and agreed. She takes things and twists them to suit her needs and I dislike meeting with her at the best of times at work let alone when I am in my own home.

Our policy I beleive states 20 days is the trigger for home visits, but I am sure it it recommended not compulsory? Can I refuse her to come to my home when I am off sick?

I say i agreed - she did not ask me if she could visit, she told me she was, and asked what time the latest she could come was (on way home) !!!

I don't think you should refuse, especially if there's no other reason than you don't like her. Bite your tongue, get it over with and hopefully she'll leave you alone after it.

It is not that I don't like her. I don't trust her.

(I don't like her though, your right!)

What do you think she's going to do? Say you're faking?

Play the game, let her visit. But take minutes of the meeting and then send them to her and your HR department to make sure everyone is in agreement with what was discussed.

Sorry to hear about the sickness.

You have the right to see her notes before she puts anything in your file. If it's anything like our organisation, you'll also have to sign them to confirm that the meeting took place, so if there is anything that you're not happy with then you can refuse to sign and bring in HR.

LOL, i could always stop taking my medication for the day, that would demonstrate the severity of how sick I have been! She was surprised I needed time off at all for 'morning sickness' at the beginning, when I took the first week off she was like 'oh, so what about your groups?' er, your problem I am too sick!

I have another issue with her (needs a different thread) which is unresolved, and is being handled through my union rep. I think I am in part concerned she will try to address this while she is here. She has done this before recently (tried to deal with it while discussing something else).

I think I am also concerned she will try to persuade me to return to work in a manner I am not ready to - she had previously put me on a 12 hour shift ending at 9pm followed by an 8am start even though I told her I had concerns due to my sickness (before I went off sick). This meeting we will be having, if it happened on tuesday next week, the health and safety officer (who also happens coincidently to be my union rep) will come along for input into my H&S risk assessment.

And, I just don't see the point of it. She is meant to leave me alone other than check I am ok, which she has not actually done - at no point has she asked 'are you ok'

Hi pavlov! My boss tried to do the same thing, and I refused. Initially they wanted me to come to a meeting, and I said due to being as ill as I was and having mobility issues due to SPD, I wouldn't be able to do it.

I have agreed to go to occupational health (on advice from the union). Requested a home visit from Occ Health, but they won't do it. Going next week--it will be hard as walking any distance and going up stairs kills me for the rest of the day. I fully intend to let them know just how inappropriate I think it is, given that I've been signed off my my GP and my social worker phoned my boss to tell her I wasn't well enough to be dealing with all this crap.

Can you contact HR and ask if this is policy? Do you have an occupational health department that should be dealing with things like this?

Personally, I was so depressed and paranoid, I thought they wanted to just come and gawp at me and watch me have a meltdown. I don't buy the 'we just want to support you' bollocks. Frankly, it is not up to them to decide whether or not I'm too sick to work. It is up to my GP, and if they want their own people to verify that, it should be occupational health, not the manager.

And...I have had so so many problems with my employers over the last few years, they have caused so much stress in my life, including during my last pregnancy, to the point I took a grievance out (which included this manager) and was off sick with stress, I just don't want them in my home. I would be happy to go into work for the meeting.

cross posted with all that!

I don't trust my boss either. When she knew about the hyperemesis, she said quite flippantly 'just have some ginger biscuits, you'll be fine'.

The next time we spoke on the phone I told her comments like that were really not helpful and I felt she was quite dismissive. She actually denied ever saying it! So from then on I have made sure everything is in writing, and won't talk to her on the phone anymore.

How about asking for a meeting at work rather than in your home and asking for a third party to be there (union rep/colleague)? That way it should limit the meeting and stop her straying off into other territory.

My boss would prefer OH not involved - as it means they would tell her my hours need restricting most likely and it will affect her operational needs.

I had initially started OH but she withdrew it as she put on it completely irrelevant things like my previous sinus problems, the fact that my DH has lost his job and my home life is stressful (WTF!) and nothing to do with my actual sickness due to being pg!!! I told her I would not sign it with that on it as it was not the purpose of the referral and she said, 'we should be able to deal with any pregnancy issues between us anyway, lets not do it'.

I think I will insist on it today.

Pavlov you're right, she has absolutely no right to visit you at your home. If she was a sympathetic boss you might think she was being considerate by offering to come to you, to save your inconvenience whilst you are unwell. However, this doesn't sound like it is the case.

Will you be alone, or can you get your union rep round as a 'supportive friend'. It may be helpful to have a witness if she is likely to invent her own version of events!

Other than that, can you postpone her for a week or so until you can meet with union representation there? Tell her you are too sick etc?

congrats on your pg btw!

yankncock waves - how you feeling? Your boss sounds outrageous!!!

Susie - yes, I think I might do that, ask to go into the office. I have no problems meeting with her, just not on 'my patch' where I feel less guarded, you know, no shoes on, I sit cross legged on my sofa, cradle a hot cup of squash for comfort- in an office, we sit with a desk between us and it is more formal, more 'appropriate'.

The fact that she doesn't want OH involved speaks volumes to me!!

captaincaveman - yes I agree completely, another manager, I would be happy to have around as I thought they might give a shit, but I suspect this on is just doing tick box. She 'has' to do it, apparantly.

Unfortunately, my union rep is not contactable !!! I have tried!

'My boss would prefer OH not involved'

Oooh, that makes the alarm bells start ringing! Definitely get union involved. And try to have a look at your sickness policy. Mine (NHS) says after 20 days absence it triggers a referral to occupational health. If your boss is trying to go her own way, you need to put your foot down and make her follow the policy correctly.

I had a home visit when I was off from the civil service on long term sick (I remain convinced it was a nasty bout of glandular fever but they were talking about retiring me on medical grounds and all kinds of nonsence) The woman who visited me wasn't my boss though, she was the do-goody rep from the personnel department (can't remember her official title) and the visit was to see "what the HO could do for me in my situation" rather than a check up...If you're suspicious of your bosses motives though, I'd check with your HR dept that it is standard practice....you've hardly been off for months...I'd definitely check with the union as well.

Okay this morning, thanks for asking...

The thing is, if you're not well enough to go into work, you're not well enough to go in for meetings. My boss tried the 'I "have" to do this' route too and has gotten nowhere with it. Can you go higher up in the union?

Can you self-refer to OH? I'm also NHS and we can definately self-refer.

She sounds like a bit of a character . If you do meet with her, make sure you keep minutes and get her to sign them (and keep your own copy).

The other argument I put forward was that the law says absence related to pregnancy should NOT be counted the same as regular sickness absence---so really, I don't think it should trigger policies in the same way. Sent boss a copy of government guidelines with that part highlighted, and that seemed to shut her up for a while. Union also pointed out that fact.

She will do the OH referral, but only if she puts down all the irrelevant stuff, but as it goes on my file, I do not want stuff that has nothing to do with this on my record. My financial situation is nothing to do with them and I resent her thinking she can put it down on my OH, its either her way or not at all.

I did not know I could self-refer, will look at that. I have no problems them being involved, as I know they look at the welfare of the member of staff over and above operational needs, unlike my boss. I will give HR a call (however, the HR boss is also someone who was in my grievance from last time - I made a few enemies then I think which is why I want it all done by the book).

Good point about going in for a meeting if I am not well enough

Yank - I was wondering about that too, as it does not count towards same absences.

You could refuse but I wouldn't advise it.

She is not 'meant to leave you alone', that would be bad practice. She should be keeping in touch with you about what's going on at work, and about how you are doing. A home visit is part of that.

Whether she does any of those things well or appropriately is a different matter, but a home visit in itself is a good thing to happen as the idea is it enables you to find out what's going on at work so you feel kept in touch, it enables your manager to find out more about your treatment and about how things are going, and gives you the chance to raise any concerns you might have.

If you would rather go into work for the meeting, you could request that. I would definitely suggest you don't meet with her alone if you are not comfortable. Can someone from HR come as well, they will make sure she doesn't say anything she shouldn't. Certainly when I was working in house I attended plenty of home visits to keep an eye on the managers! You could ask for a colleague as well if you like.

I disagree with YanknCock that 'if you're not well enough to go into work you're not well enough to go into meetings'. That's not true at all. Lots of people are not well enough to be permanently back at work everyday, but are well enough to come in for an hour's meeting about their situation.

I don't think it's in your interests to refuse the meeting. She isn't handling the situation well at all by the sounds of things, but you need to demonstrate at all times that you are handling the situation reasonably. Similarly if you don't think she's handling it appropriately, this is an opportunity to put that on record.