Please help. What are your rights if you face being sacked and you have no union representation?

[MaHumbug]

My colleague is facing a disciplinary for which I'm not sure she'll be able to return to work. I don't know what she's done yet. I'm going to speak to her tomorrow.

She'll have a hearing soon. Where can she go to get advice? who will be able to support her when it comes to her hearing? I had spoken to her previously about joining the staff union but afaik she never joined.

I'd just like to know what I can do for her if she needs my help or support.

Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

ACAs, CAB give employment advice.

She should be able to bring another employee to the hearing (ACAs Code of Practice) or as you mention, a union official. Most unions won't represent people if they haven't been a member for a certain amount of time. But do check with the union. If nothing else, they may give good advice as to how to deal with situation and protocol.

She has the right to bring a colleague or union rep with her, make sure she does so.

Otherwise if she needs to talk to someone ACAS are good in this type of situation.

If you want to come back here with some more details happy to help.

Flowery - I spoke to her today. She's being disciplined because she franked 2 xmas cards - which I know is classed as stealing. They want her out of our company. I'm so angry but I'm also scared she will get the sack.

Aslo, she's just joined our union, but they're not able to represent her at her hearing because she's not been a member for very long.

I'll check ACAS to see if there's anything on their website.

How long's she been there?

Out of interest, what makes you think they want her out of the company?

She's been there for 13 years.

They want her out of the company because she is not performing on her job role. Our company has recently changed the way it measures our performance, which makes our job role predominantly sales-driven. Until last year she had been working in our admin section, dealing with our paperwork and telephone calls. She also was considered a reliable and trustworthy person as she would authorise and check her colleagues (including mine) work.

We had a Union newsletter approximately 4-5 years ago warning that people could get sacked for stealing stationery, franking personal post etc - all seemingly petty things which basically boil down to stealing from our company. I think the union newsletter is the only place where it explicitly says what is classed as stealing from the company. She doesn't read the newsletters as she wasn't part of the union, and due to the hours she works with us she's never at any team meeting or talks where these kind of conversations come up. (She covers lunchtimes)

bump

It doesn't have to be specifically stated what is classed as stealing. A union newsletter mentioning sounds like helpful article rather than an official communication from the employer that franking personal mail is now considered stealing. Particularly if not everyone is in the union anyway.

So would her defence be that she didn't think franking her personal mail was stealing? I don't think it's reasonable for a company to provide a list of exactly what behaviour would and wouldn't be classed as stealing, so the fact that she wasn't specifically privy to any official information spelling that out won't be much of a defence.

What might help is if everyone does it without consequences, or something like that, plus a previously exemplary record.

What Flowery said!

In addition, I would suggest that your friend concentrates on thinking about these things:

1. Is franking personal mail something everyone does?

1. Have her managers been aware of her franking personal things in the past, or done so themselves?

1. Do employees not in the mail room send Christmas cards or other personal post down in the post that get franked?

1. What's her disciplinary record like?

A policy that makes it clear that personal mail must not be franked will be helpful to her employer, but in arguing that it was an honest mistake, the lack of an official notification will not be a complete defence I'm afraid.

Another thing to think about is that it was quite clearly spending the employer's money (albeit only a few pence), so she might want to think about why she thought that was ok? What are the rules on, for example, personal phone calls. If short calls are allowed, did she think franking a couple of pieces of post fell into the same category - i.e. it's allowed, but don't overdo it? If not allowed, why did she think post was different?

Thanks for your help so far.

We do have an employee fraud policy which gives a lost of examples of employee fraud but states that it is not an exhaustive list.

Franking mail...I don't know of anyone who does it but it's not mentioned to new starters that it is forbidden. I think this is the first instance where a manager has picked her up on it. I'm unsure if she's actually done it before.

Disciplinary record is fine. I used to be her line manager for a while and had no problems with her.

Again, nothing's really been said about personal phone calls although I think they'd be frowned upon too.

It feels a bit oppressive at work at the moment.

The trouble is, as it is clearly spending the employer's money for her own personal benefit, unless it's fairly well known that most people do it occasionally she will find it difficult to claim it was reasonable to think it's fine to do that.

What Flowery said I'm afraid...

Thanks - it's hard to be objective when it's a friend.

P.S. Can I add an extra thank you for all on here. You've helped me a couple of months ago with another problem. Happy Xmas to you and carry on the good work!

My friend has asked me to be her respresentative in her hearing.

Is there anything I need to know?

I am not able to say anything in the actual meeting, but we're able to take breaks and talk about what has been discussed.

Can she offer to pay for the franked mail via the petty cash before the hearing? I wouldn't mention it to anyone, but just give the person who has the petty cash the money and tell them its for two Christmas cards that she franked.

All the staff in my office frank mail, and though we're not very tough on it, we ask them to pay for it and the money goes into the petty cash as a receipt.

You are allowed to speak. You are allowed to make statements on your friend's behalf, and you can ask questions as well. If they are saying you can't speak they are attempting to deny her her rights to representation.

ACAS says -

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The companion should be allowed to address the hearing in order to:
? put the worker?s case
? sum up the worker?s case
? respond on the worker?s behalf to any view expressed at
the hearing.

The companion can also confer with the worker during the hearing.
It is good practice to allow the companion to participate as fully as possible in the hearing, including asking witnesses questions.

The companion has no right to answer questions on the worker?s behalf, or to address the hearing if the worker does not wish it, or to prevent the employer from explaining their case.
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If she has to appeal, their attempt to deny her her rights will be a good point to make.

Thank you Flowery - really, you don't know how much I appreciate your help on this.

She was dismissed.

Thank you for your advice.

I hope that didn't look sarcastic - it wan't meant to be. It's been really good to have people in the know on here. You were objective and fair when replying.

I just wish I could have waved a magic wand and it all not happened.

Sorry to hear that MaHumbug. Is she planning to appeal the decision?

Yes she is planning an appeal.