Why do some experienced roles still ask for GCSE grades?

[Rewis]

I’m currently applying for jobs and have noticed that quite a few ask for a degree as well as GCSE grades. One role I was Deputy Head of Contract Management, requires a master’s degree, several years of experience in contract management, and at least a grade 4 in English and Maths GCSEs. They actually asked your grades in the application form.

Why is that? I can sort of understand GCSE requirements for entry‑level roles that don’t need a degree. But still having to provide results from exams you took decades ago as a teenager?

This has puzzled me, too. I have two degrees and a diploma, none of which could I have studied without English and maths GCSEs, so why bother asking? But I was 47 the last time I was asked, so 31 years since I did my GCSEs. I think I'd need to do a bit of revision on quadratic equations...

I had to provide my O level results at 63 for a casual invigilating job! Luckily I had all my certificates

yeah Im 42 and still having to provide GCSE results (social worker)

Do they expect proof? I have a good idea of what my O-level results were but have no way of proving it. I don’t know what exam boards my school used or whether those boards even still exist. The school itself is long gone.

Luckily I’ve never been asked.

Everyone is treated the same as a new starter, there are processes to follow and minimum standards to be met.
Why would someone older be treated differently?

I've been asked for my GCSE certificates for all but one of my jobs!

I'm a chartered accountant and I got rejected for one role because GCSE or A level business studies was required; my relevant professional qualification and experience was not sufficient.

Because to get a degree, we needed to get good A-Level grades. To get onto the sixth form courses, we needed five A-Cs, including in English and maths.

I’m also needing to find my gcse certificates to be able to study a masters level course. It does feel a bit weird at age 42 to prove what I was capable of at 15 (August baby). I suppose there’s been that many fraudsters and scam artists that nothing is sacred, including someone’s word that their 15 year old self was capable at maths.

Because if you’ve got degrees, masters, professional qualifications etc, an exam you took 20 years ago as a child is hardly relevant? Would you check with a conservatoire-educated concert pianist whether they had passed their grade 2 before booking them?

In any case it’s hardly universal. I’ve never been asked, not even in my first position out of university.

It's not about being older, it's about having higher qualifications that are more relevant than your GCSEs.

I've never even been asked to show my degree certificate tbf

Because no one has ever asked in the previous 30+ yrs. We didn't even have to pass GCSE english and maths back in the day. We just went to college then got a job.

I’ve never been asked for GCSE certificates and that includes acceptance onto postgrad courses and submitting evidence of suitability for professional qualification. Thankfully, as I have no idea where they are. It is odd to insist on their relevance for someone who has more advanced qualifications and many years of working experience.

Do they expect proof?
Yes
I had a turbulent teenage life and never went back to collect my certificates.
I never needed them all my adult life until the last 8 years or so.
I did a degree in my 30's so jobs have normally accepted that or I've had to do a basic maths and English test, even though I write out reports for court, on Protocol etc nearly every working day.

It's because they have to have a single set of rules for everyone in order to identify potential issues. Employers want by defailt to assume that every employee is basically numerate and capable of both generating and comprehending complex information communicated in words, but this isn't always true.

It would be possible for someone who is good with words to have a degree and masters in an essay based subject whilst never having got to grips with numbers and never got a GCSE maths and maybe such a person shouldn't have charge of a departmental budget without support.

It would be possible for someone who is a whizz with numbers to get similarly high grades in academic subjects that a heavily numerate while being generally bad at words-based communication.

These are extremes and most people muddle through at an acceptable level in both numerate and words-based disciplines but having a GCSE grade 4 or better in both Maths and English is the baseline standard that there isn't a whole sphere of endeavour where you'd be totally adrift. Pretty much everyone applying for professional level jobs will have reached this baseline with no trouble but if an unusual case arises with someone whose abilities are heavily skewed they need procedures that are robust for this scenario - which isn't to say that someone innumerate should never be employed, but that it should be a serious topic at recruitment stage to figure out case-by-case whether to waive the requirement and rejig responsibilities so that the post holder isn't required to do things they cannot do, or (as happened in one case I know of) take them on with an extended probation and a half-day per week study-leave to work on and gain the missing qualification, or whether the role can just not be done by that person.

It’s a huge assumption to assume every person who has a degree has English and maths qualifications.
It's far easier to ask every employee for GCSE grades at application stage.

Just putting this here in case anyone browsing realises they have lost and need theirs:
https://www.gov.uk/replacement-exam-certificate

I've been tempted numerous times in recent years to sit my Nat 5 Maths and English.

I left school at 14 with no qualifications, through no fault of my own. I'm 37 now with a decade of management experience, chartered qualifications, first class BA(hons) and MSc with distinction. Yet there are so many jobs I wouldn't get past the sifting stage due to lack of basic high school qualifications.

It is ridiculous. What happens to the likes of me who are naturlised Brit but had my schooling in another country? We didn’t have anything like the GCSE or O-levels. Where do we stand?

When I first came here, this was never an issue but when I resumed my job search after fair few years as a SAHM, suddenly everyone was asking this. Luckily I eventually found a job where they were sensibly not interested in seeing my math grades from 1988.

Unfortunately you can still get some degrees without a basic level of maths and English, that’s why.

@WendyFromTransvisionWampthere is a list of equivalent qualifications that it’s not hard to find if needed.

It is slightly baffling if you have higher level qualifications. If maths is a key part of the role then include a brief relevant test eg drug calculations for healthcare workers.
My GCSEs were pretty good (mostly As, rest Bs) but my AS grades were DEEU (due in part to mental health & family issues) so I didn't progress to A Levels. They look awful on applications, but I went to university in the evenings in my 20s & achieved a First Class BSc in Biomed while working full-time - which I like to think says more about me than my performance as a 17 year old in a difficult situation.

I had to complete security vetting recently. I am senior management, late 40s. They wanted my GCSE certificates. I haven’t seen that NRA for years. They asked me to contact my school / they only keep records for 12 years. Then they wanted me to contact the exam boards. I have zero idea who they were and most have changed names several times since then. Went round in circles for about 6 months before they would approve higher level clearance because of GCSE certificates. I do have my IB and Degree though. Maybe Msndlrdon bc couldn’t find his 😂

Or maybe fortunately- my DD is studying for a performing arts degree without Maths GCSE. She’s very talented and very good with words and despite being severely dyslexic she has a decent grade in GCSE English and a triple distinction star in when she studied a BTEC. Personally I think it’s very fortunate she’s been able to study a subject she loves at degree level.
Several of her extremely talented tutors, who have masters degrees, have admitted to her they don’t have GCSE maths.

I don't have GCSE Maths, but I did get my GCSE English a year early.
By the time I did my second apprenticeship I was told my English GCSE was no longer valid (after 5 years! I was only just 19 at the time!) so I had to sit another exam in lieu of it which would last my lifetime basically. Made me question what the bleeding point in GCSEs even was at the time.
I did have to prove my GCSE results recently actually for a new job but that was involving education so made sense.

I'm a chartered accountant and having sat with Y8 DD preparing for the UK maths challenge I can confirm my A in GCSE maths is now totally worthless 😂 I always think the higher qualifications should supercede the ones that come before.