Employer told me to take leave, then treated part as unpaid

[MumAli]

Hi ladies,
Just looking for advice on where I stand with something really. So I knew I had some holiday left to use up before the end of March but I wasn't sure how much so I had emailed my boss to ask but she never got back to me so I just left it and thought I'll lose out on what holiday I have left I don't mind then the start of March my manager came into work and said that she has arranged cover and I have the last 2 weeks of March off because she doesn't want me to lose out on it so obviously I said ok great thank you.

Anyway middle of April I got my payslip and I'm over £400 less than usual so I emailed the boss and she got back to me and said it's because you took 8 days unpaid leave so basically those 2 weeks I got told to take only 6 were holiday days the rest unpaid leave which I would never have taken as I'm a single mum of 3 and I have bills to pay.

Basically all my boss kept saying is that it's my responsibility to check what holiday I have but the app we use isn't accurate it said I was in the minus but obviously had 6 days left so I told her this and told her that I'd emailed her to find out about holiday but no response as usual.

So it's ended with me being paid this month for 6 of those unpaid leave days but it's been taken out of this year's holiday which still isn't fair as I did nothing wrong.

I decided I would speak to my manager when we were next in together but got told not to by the boss. Anyway I decided that if I go in and my manager doesn't apologize and take accountability for her mistake then I would go to citizens advice and see where I can go from here. So I go into work and she completely blanks me.....we spoke towards the end of the day but she's still not said sorry and nobody at the company is taking responsibility for majorly messing up.

Anyway been in this situation before? Anybody know where I can go from here? This affected my mental health so bad and feeling it's all my fault is not fair. Thank you in advance!

And you honestly didn’t know that this was 4 days more than what you had left to use?

i a single mum too and very closely track what holiday i have left!!

you are both in the wrong, but you have had the leave and you have also been paid so learn from this.

How do you not know how much leave you have left? Surely you know how many vacation days you have taken?

Are you part-time? Ie working it out on an accrued basis.

How do you not know how much holiday you have left? It’s down to you to keep track.

And “mental health” my foot, you’re a bit skint that’s all, develop some resilience. Fed up of every single blip someone has causing “mental health issues”.

Also your days make no sense, presumably you don’t work 7 days a week so how can there be 8 days paid and 6 unpaid in a period of 2 working weeks?

Keep track of your own holiday better going forward

What a repellent post. Nasty.

I don’t think it was that she used 4 extra days, I think she’s saying she knows she had 6, but the app was only showing 2 and was wrong.

It's not all your fault, but it's partly your fault. You should have been able to work out how much leave you had left and known you were being given more than you were entitled to. But the manager should have told you how you could check instead of giving bad advice.

So if she knew she had 6

then she’d have known 10 days was too much by 4 days

the app is irrelevant. She knew that was wrong and flawed

There is shared blame. You should have kept track of your leave. Your manager should have been more clear. Allowing you to take it out of this years leave rather than unpaid seems a fair compromise.

I don't understand how when your boss didn't get back to you thought: "I'll lose out on what holiday I have left I don't mind."

You should mind - holidays are paid and are therefore worth money to you, also it's time with your three children. You should very much mind on not losing out on any holiday you are entitled to. I don't understand the attitude of not minding.

As others have said, you should track your holiday - keep your own spreadsheet if the app is unreliable - I always know how much leave I have because I make a note of it in my diary. Particularly because sometimes holidays can be cancelled or moved. That is your responsibility.

That said if your boss knew that you only had six days remaining then she should have just told you that and asked if you wanted the last six working days off in March. It seems bizarre that she rounded it up to two weeks without ever having a conversation. Maybe she thought she was being helpful who knows. But if she is as incompetent as you make out it's even more of a reason to keep your own records isn't it? I also don't understand a boss who tells you not to talk to your own manager - unless they planned to speak to the manager themself.

As it stands, you have taken the time - which has been taken off your next annual accrual - and you are not out of pocket for last month. I don't think there is anything else that can be done - CAB will just tell you it's your responsibility. It's a lesson learned in keeping a close eye on your own entitlements.

Oh I’ve just got the numbers wrong. She knew she had enough holiday, the numbers on the app were wrong and she’s been paid based on the app.

You didnt apply to take unpaid leave. I'd out in a grievance and take it from there ... stating that you did not give permission for them to make a deduction from your salary.
You may want to take it further via ACAS as an "illegal deduction from wages" ... you only have 3 months less 1 day to claim.

Very strange that you would take 2 weeks leave without actually checking it on the system. Or even clarifying it with your boss. If my boss has said I still had 2 weeks leave to take and it wasn't showing up for me, I would be emailing her asking for the exact number or days and asking why it wasn't right on the system. I'm sorry your boss got it wrong, but you knew something wasn't right when you took the leave and still took it.

So yes the extra days should be unpaid

You’ve misunderstood.
again

How could you possibly have gotten to the end of the year and not known whether you had 2 weeks leave left or not. Surely you would have had some idea of whether you had only taken about half of your annual leave entitlement or nearly all of it?

Blimey you’re a peach aren’t you.

That’s how I read the post. She thought she had x number of days, app said she had less and they paid her based on the number of days.

maybe i am wrong, just how I read it.

Given she hasn’t been back to update, I’m not sure how you know I’ve misunderstood…unless you’re the manager i guess 🤷‍♂️

Blimey, you’re a sensitive soul 😆

Yeah I am a bit tbh.

But that has nothing to do with this. You were rude. Most people would be annoyed by that.

Yeah I am a bit tbh.

👍

How many days a week so you work? You said 6 paid, 8 unpaid, which is 14, but most people only work 5 days a week.

If you requested to take leave and hadn’t accrued enough to cover it, your employer would usually be entitled to require you to take it unpaid.

However if THEY required you to take the leave then there’s a pretty good chance you’d retain your entitlement to pay, as you didn’t ask to be placed on unpaid leave, and presumably would not have taken it if you haven’t have been told to, or you’d been told it was unpaid!

Agree with a PP about raising a grievance.

The problem with that is that ACAS currently have a 12 week turnaround and will only issue you a certificate for Tribunal which in some areas are booking in 2028/2029. So you're looking at 3 years for a resolution.

I agree OP should raise a grievance but the response will likely be she should be keeping tabs on her holiday and she won't just get the additional days written off as then OP has had a higher holiday allowance than everyone else. If she doesn't have the holiday the company doesn't have to pay for the extra time, hence the only real option being unpaid leave.

You are both at fault here.
You should know how much leave you have left to take and she shouldn’t have just put unpaid leave without talking to you first.