Lack of diversity in interview panel in civil service

[JoanJettsBlackheads]

I currently work for the civil service, am a G6, and recently had an interview for a job in another department. They wanted someone with strong experience of leading large teams, and I was asked if I would consider applying for the job, as I’ve previously headed up departments of 80 and 60 staff.

I was one of the last two. The interview didn’t go well, and I could tell from body language that they weren’t really interested. I found out later that the job went to a male G7 in his mid 30s, on promotion. He’s never had to manage more than four people. (This job is managing a department of 70+)

The interview panel consisted of two fast stream G7s, both Oxbridge, in their early 30s, and the SCS hiring manager who was in his early 40s. I’m in my late 50s. I also realised after the interview that there was no independent panel member, as both the G7s work directly to the SCS man.

The SCS officer has offered me feedback, which I’ve accepted. Would it be wrong of me to point out the lack of diversity in the panel (although one of the G7s was a woman), and the fact that there was no independent panel member? I know I could have appealed this within 24 hours of the interview, but wasn’t really in any position to do so - I’d only had 48 hours notice of the interview. Should I also complain to HR?

Alternatively, has anyone any advice on how to interview with the confidence of a 30 something Oxbridge man? As I keep being beaten for jobs and 9 times out of 10 it’s to someone who fits this profile. I’ve also interviewed men with this profile for jobs and while a lot of them can talk the talk at interview, they’ve been arrogant disasters actually doing the job!

Actually I’ve just looked up the panel members. I thought they were both G7 but one is G6. The G7 is not HR, it looks like they have some kind of private secretary role.

Why yes, I am. Might look a bit tired and not with as much physical energy as a young, non-disabled male, but my employer recognised that that has absolutely no bearing upon my intelligence or ability to more than fulfil the requirements of my role when I went for promotion.

If you raise a complaint about this @JoanJettsBlackheads, do you think it will work in your favour in future interviews?

I’m sure op would have mentioned if she was disabled. Why would you burble on about “potentially” disabled, when it has no relevance here?

I think given the feedback you were given (definitely sounds ageist, whether it was or not, I'm surprised they actually said that, they normally think it but aren't daft enough to write it) also surprised they had a G7 on the panel, it's my department's policy to have a gender split and independent panel member for all G7+ roles. We also tend to have to have a BAME panel member (although not something I'm hugely supportive of as I feel quite sorry for the small number of BAME staff we have constantly getting called into panels to meet this quota which feels unfair for them). Was the SCS also male?

So I would raise with HR to ask about the policy, if it was applied, and if not, why not. It's not about the job at this point, but standing up to unfair practice.

CS panels should be mixed gender, have an independant person & 5 days notice to prepare. Anything else isn't deemed fair as far as I know. And I recruit in CS

CS staff can be on interview panel for own grade but not for a higher grade.

Because it's another reason why making decisions and comments of 'tired and lacking in energy' is completely inappropriate in an interview context.

To make those judgements puts the panel at risk of discriminating against sex, against age and against disability.

but then how can he get the experience if gatekeepers such as yourself said you would not hire him due to the lack of experience.

someone has to let him try

@Soiltypes there’s a middle ground from going from managing a small team of four to an entire department of 70+ staff. You would normally go for a larger team or department of 15-20 staff and prove your worth there before stepping up. Otherwise you tend to crash and burn or need significant support from your manager.

I’m not actually that fussed about the job. I’ll probably take early retirement next year as I feel I’ve outlived my usefulness in the civil service.

reguardless of your view on usefulness im sure you have much wisdom and experience thats still useful.

that said i can understand your management view, its just frustrating sometimes with companies wanting people with x experience but then not giving anyone a chance to gain x experience etc, sometimes even experienced managers can and do burnout so in theory experience is not always a certainty as to how well they will do, so worse case the inexperienced one fails, best case they show promise and begin to do well.

If you aren't challenging the outcome, then why challenge the process, apart from marking your card? If this was "wrong", then go the whole hog, not part of the way.

Perhaps young men interview better because they interview better? Sorry, but are you saying that older women don't? I have never had a problem interviewing against younger men, and they didn't seem to do all that well since I got the jobs!

Honestly - this all feels rather "half-hearted". You said your interview went badly. Perhaps that was the reason you didn't get the job? Not process. Not younger men.

Who asked you apply. For a job in a different dept. Not yours. Is someone in your dept trying to get rid of you? Chat to them about why they asked you.

Sounds like they always intended to give it to him, and just bought you in to cover themselves?

How old are you @EmmaMaria ? I had no difficulty getting interviews for jobs (and jobs) until I hit my mid 50s. Then I wasn’t even getting through the first sift for jobs. I cut 15 years off my CV and the interviews started to come again.

I just find it a bizarre system that means you can get a job through your application (which might be a work of fiction as no-one signs off to say it’s an accurate reflection of your work) and your confidence in a 30 minute interview (which could be another work of fiction), with no regard given to experience or previous performance in jobs. So if you are good at talking the talk you’ll get the job. Whether you succeed in it is another question, but there’s usually someone there to carry you.

If you aren't challenging the outcome, then why challenge the process, apart from marking your card?

What? Are you just trying to argue on MN for arguing's sake? Are you really so passive in real life? Most civil service departments have strict HR policies around recruitment in order to encourage diversity and inclusion, it does not matter if OP should have got the job or not, what matters is there should be a fair and transparent process, if policy has not been followed it should be pulled up on to remind these young men of the importance of fair recruitment practices, they presumably have long civil service careers ahead of them hiring a lot of people, this needs nipping in the bud now, even if they have unintentionally been unfair.

@Oblomov24 the head of the department asked me to apply. I’d worked with them before and they said they needed someone with experience of managing large teams (they needed to fill it quickly as the previous incumbent had moved on). They weren’t involved in the recruitment process though.

@EmmaMaria and just to remind you, civil servants work for the state, they enact the policy and operations of government for citizens of the UK, it is extremely important that the workforce reflects the society it services so it should be taken seriously and not dismissed.

I don’t know about ageism. But at the moment the world is for the taking for women. DH in recruitment and he is constantly being asked to find a woman.

Have a chat with HoD then re how it all went?

I wish they’d pin a post at the top of every thread to remind posters that no one cares what their husband thinks 😭

OP I’d absolutely challenge that feedback. How are people getting through Oxbridge degrees but failing to understand (or thinking it’s okay to ignore) the basic principles of unconscious bias training?

I wasn’t commenting on this one in particular, just in general. I see it a lot when interviewing.

Honestly if the feedback you received was tired and lacking energy ( which you're not disputing) I think you were never going to score highly. You were never going to get this job on the back of a poor interview regardless of who you were up against

I've had almost exactly the same experience OP. I fed back in writing to the HR team and never received a response.

@lizzyBennet08 that doesn't really condone policy not being followed though does it?