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Is this lawful? Unequal pay

42 replies

snowman333 · 11/12/2024 20:06

I work in an industry with a lot of casual employees who work maybe 2 days a month. I work 3 days a week in an admin role but am also on a casual contract. My department is the only one with a mixture of casual and permanent staff.

Recently the permanent members of staff in my office were given a pay rise but this won’t be given to the casual staff. I do exactly the same job as the permanent staff members and until recently was paid the same as well.

I have complained to my manager but am not hopeful it will make any difference. Is there any action I can take? I’m a bit worried if I complain too much they will just terminate my contract. It is really upsetting me though especially as I am expected to train new entrants who earn more than me.

OP posts:
NotVeryFunny · 11/12/2024 23:58

Mumofteenandtween · 11/12/2024 20:33

If all permanent workers work full time whilst casual workers work part time then there may technically be a discrimination case here. Because part timers are significantly more likely to be female. So it could be indirect discrimination. Bloody difficult to prove though.

This. They are in dodgy ground by not allowing any part time permanent staff which means that all part time staff (mainly women) will have less favourable terms.

JoyousPinkPeer · 12/12/2024 00:11

Why is your post casual when you have worked there 3 years doing 3 days per week ... what does the contract say?

prh47bridge · 12/12/2024 10:28

The Equality Act does not require everyone to be treated equally. It prevents staff being discriminated against due to a protected characteristic (age, sex, etc.), but does not prevent them being discriminated against on other grounds. In general, it is fine for an employer to say that they will pay casual staff less than permanent staff. However, this can be a form of indirect discrimination if, for example, casual staff are significantly more likely to be female.

Also, if casual workers are all part time and permanent staff are all full time, this may be a breach of the Part-time Workers (Prevention of Less Favourable Treatment) Regulations 2000.

You need to consult a lawyer who specialises in employment law if you want to know if you have a case. If you have legal cover on your home insurance, they may be able to help.

ThatCoralShark · 12/12/2024 10:45

I think some confusion here, the part time workers regulations does not prevent seperate contracts for casual work.

legally a causal employment contract is fine, it is often a guaranteed min hours, or zero hours, or a fixed term contract.

casual contracts are not entitled to the below and are classed as workers not employees.

  • minimum notice periods;
  • protection against unfair dismissal;
  • the right to request flexible working;
  • time off for emergencies;
  • Statutory Redundancy Pay.

companies are absolutely allowed to differentiate pay between employees and workers. And they can absolutely have all full time staff as employees and have all casual workers as part time, on different pay, under a different contract, be it min hours, fixed term or zero hours etc

BlueRaincoat1 · 12/12/2024 11:22

OP I missed your previous post where you said that you had been offered a permanent contract loads of times but turned it down.

Why was that? Would you have had to go full time? Or did they offer the permanent contract for 3 days per week?

ThatCoralShark · 12/12/2024 11:24

BlueRaincoat1 · 12/12/2024 11:22

OP I missed your previous post where you said that you had been offered a permanent contract loads of times but turned it down.

Why was that? Would you have had to go full time? Or did they offer the permanent contract for 3 days per week?

Clearly it is for full time?

MarnieRey · 12/12/2024 12:09

Part time regs may apply to you, and there may be a case based on the fact that you're actually working less casually than your contract states. Practice and custom should be looked at as well as the actual contract. Call ACAS/ A law centre for advice.

prh47bridge · 12/12/2024 13:27

ThatCoralShark · 12/12/2024 10:45

I think some confusion here, the part time workers regulations does not prevent seperate contracts for casual work.

legally a causal employment contract is fine, it is often a guaranteed min hours, or zero hours, or a fixed term contract.

casual contracts are not entitled to the below and are classed as workers not employees.

  • minimum notice periods;
  • protection against unfair dismissal;
  • the right to request flexible working;
  • time off for emergencies;
  • Statutory Redundancy Pay.

companies are absolutely allowed to differentiate pay between employees and workers. And they can absolutely have all full time staff as employees and have all casual workers as part time, on different pay, under a different contract, be it min hours, fixed term or zero hours etc

Edited

Re your final paragraph, OP apparently works regular hours. Although her contract says it is a casual contract, a tribunal may conclude that it is not really casual and is, in fact, an attempt to bypass the Part-time Worker Regulations.

DowntonFlabbie · 12/12/2024 13:31

You could all be on the same contract and still legally be paid a different amount for the exact same job.

ThatCoralShark · 12/12/2024 15:19

prh47bridge · 12/12/2024 13:27

Re your final paragraph, OP apparently works regular hours. Although her contract says it is a casual contract, a tribunal may conclude that it is not really casual and is, in fact, an attempt to bypass the Part-time Worker Regulations.

But a casual contract can legally be regular hours, as per my post , they aren’t even allowed flexible working, a guaranteed hours contract is an example of casual working and can be the same days and hours each week. This is fully legal.

and as the pp said, there is no law that says even people doing the exact same job on the same contract, have to be paid the same, as companies can take into account experience, potential, performance etc, as long as the difference isn’t due to discrimination ie gender, ethnicity, religion etc, then employers can pay different rates for two different people on the same contract to do the same job.

an example being, I know I am paid more than my colleagues doing the same job, as I am the most experienced. By far.

employers are perfectly entitled to have casual workers, and they can have them in many formats, as said, from guaranteed min hours through to zero hours or fixed term and there is nothing to say they need to be paid the exact same as others on a permenant contract. They are not even classed as employees legally.

Karatema · 12/12/2024 15:26

@snowman333 Go to Acas! They are the experts in this field and will advise you.
As an employer I wouldn't dream of treating my part-timers differently to my full-timers - it's asking for trouble.
You do have rights because you've worked the same hours for 3 years. ACAS will tell you exactly what they are!

prh47bridge · 12/12/2024 15:31

I am aware that casual workers are not classed as employees. However, they are still covered by the Part-time Workers Regulations.

I have not said that OP has to be paid the same as permanent staff. She clearly doesn't. However, permanent staff have been given a pay rise. Casual staff have not. If OP took this to tribunal, the tribunal would consider whether having her on a casual contract was an attempt to bypass the Regulations which require that part-time staff and full-time staff on the same kind of contract are treated equally. They may, in that situation, decide that the correct comparator is a member of full-time staff who is on a permanent contract. OP's employer would then have to justify giving a pay rise to all permanent staff but omitting OP.

I am not saying OP would win on this basis or on indirect discrimination. She would need to consult a lawyer who specialises in employment law if she wants to go down this route. All I am saying is that she may have a case.

SapphireOpal · 12/12/2024 15:50

snowman333 · 11/12/2024 21:01

Thank you. I think I am taking it far too personally. They've offered me the permanant contract loads of times including today so I suppose they must value me a bit.

Why haven't you taken the perm contract then?

BobbyBiscuits · 12/12/2024 15:54

If the roles are exactly the same, it still makes no odds if the contract is different. I worked in a zero hours contract for 15 years doing the same as salaried colleagues. Their pay etc wasn't my concern and I couldn't say anything about it.
That's why they have 'casual' staff, so they don't have to give them such things.
But on some occasions I would take home more as I worked on multiple projects as well as the admin role. But with zero job security.

BlueRaincoat1 · 12/12/2024 16:01

prh47bridge · 12/12/2024 15:31

I am aware that casual workers are not classed as employees. However, they are still covered by the Part-time Workers Regulations.

I have not said that OP has to be paid the same as permanent staff. She clearly doesn't. However, permanent staff have been given a pay rise. Casual staff have not. If OP took this to tribunal, the tribunal would consider whether having her on a casual contract was an attempt to bypass the Regulations which require that part-time staff and full-time staff on the same kind of contract are treated equally. They may, in that situation, decide that the correct comparator is a member of full-time staff who is on a permanent contract. OP's employer would then have to justify giving a pay rise to all permanent staff but omitting OP.

I am not saying OP would win on this basis or on indirect discrimination. She would need to consult a lawyer who specialises in employment law if she wants to go down this route. All I am saying is that she may have a case.

This is correct

Microgal · 12/12/2024 16:03

Can you take the permanent role and use unpaid parental leave to give you 2 days off a week?

Microgal · 12/12/2024 16:05

In my workplace contractors are generally paid a slightly better hourly rate however they don’t get the annual bonus, year 4.5% pay increase or health insurance.

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