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Maintaining boundaries with difficult employee - did I handle this wrong?

42 replies

marriagehelpplease · 14/11/2024 09:25

I need to navigate a tricky situation at work and would really value some outside perspective. I recently had a difficult employee leave. Looking back, I'm questioning my approach but also feel frustrated by how it's been perceived.

The employee had a pattern of inappropriate behavior - questioning my diary movements, repeatedly asking what was wrong in front of the team, and generally crossing professional boundaries. I responded by maintaining more professional distance and limiting informal chats, keeping our interactions to necessary work matters and formal meetings. Previously, I had been intimidated by them and didn't challenge their behavior, continuing to be friendly, but I finally had enough. They were also recently under performance review, adding an extra layer of complexity, so I chose not to involve them in extra activities to allow focus on performance improvements.

My decision to create this professional distance has been criticised by some (male) colleagues, who think I should have just "stayed friendly" and that my approach made things unnecessarily unpleasant. They keep saying the outcome would have been the same either way, so I should have just been nicer.

The employee claimed I created a horrible environment, saying I'd "changed." They even complained about me not speaking to them in their final weeks, despite being on annual leave and working from home for most of that time.

What's particularly frustrating is how my male colleagues consistently prefix any discussion about her with "I like her, but..." which makes me wonder what conversations are happening behind the scenes. They refuse to see her behavior as calculated, while my female colleague understands exactly what I've been dealing with.

I'd really appreciate thoughts from other managers who've dealt with similar situations. How do you maintain professional boundaries with someone who doesn't see their behavior as problematic? And how do you handle the criticism when others think you should have just "been nice" regardless of the behavior?

Is withdrawing from personal conversations and maintaining purely professional interactions wrong in such situations, even if it makes your feelings evident? I'm trying to learn for next time (hopefully there isn't one!)

Looking back, I think my main mistake was not setting firm boundaries from the start. Because we were both senior, I thought the dynamic could be different, but I now see this may have been naive.

OP posts:
marriagehelpplease · 16/11/2024 08:55

Thanks @bluejelly and @MarkingBad

The other issue is that most interactions became button-pushing, particularly towards the end - which is another reason why, rightly or wrongly, I took the avoidance approach. I kept interactions minimal and work-related.

They definitely would have noticed a difference, and on reflection, I think the reality is that as a manager, you're just expected to take things on the chin no matter what.

I guess I just feel bad that my intention was never to affect someone as much as they say I did. My intention was to stop accepting nonsense, but maybe my message came across in the wrong way.

The inappropriate behavior extends to things such as, fairly recently, accusing me of lying and trying to change their remuneration by saying one thing and doing another (this is false, as this person still debates they never had metrics to deliver on, despite my ability to evidence this in writing six times over 12 months and often have selective memory, despite this I agreed to stick by their version of events and I had no thank you whatsoever!).

They had also been accessing files that I felt were inappropriate, and after highlighting this to them, they never apologised or acknowledged they did anything wrong. I could tell they were annoyed at being told their actions were inappropriate.

On reflection I feel this person has serious entitlement and has never had anyone o it their foot down, however this has resulted in denial and I don't think they're ever going to acknowledge their part in anything. Their denial of things I was able to prove with a paper trail makes me believe there was never any hoping this person so as other posters point out, I should forget and move on!

OP posts:
MarkingBad · 16/11/2024 15:21

@marriagehelpplease

You are well rid of team members like that. They are never going to hold their hands up to any wrong doing and will lie their heads off to anyone who will listen. You will always feel like you did something wrong even though you probably didn't or it was no where near as bad as they said. She is making this sound worse to upset you, don't give her that level of control over you. She would love that you are still upset about this.

Lying team members is another part of management, it sounds like you keep records anyway. Don't allow their lie to live otherwise you've just let them railroad you. You never get thanks for giving in.

If any of your colleagues get mentionitis again, just remind them they only have half the story and as it was a staff member, past or present, it is tied up with confidentiality, you cannot talk about it. This is not a lie, unless they are your manager or HR, it is nothing to do with them.

You do have to take it on the chin unfortunately, it's part of the role. Sometimes you just have to acknowledge a bad experience you are having or have had and then clear it out of your head. If you are dwelling on it, just vow to recognise the signs earlier and do something different next time. Once you get into that habit the pull to dwell starts to disappear. No one is perfect and no one can do the right thing all of the time and that will be what comes into your head when you start to think about it. I made a mistake, this is a great opportunity to improve.

If I may offer a point, any file staff shouldn't be accessing, lock them down with a password for the files or folders, give those who need access the passwords and ensure that anyone asking for the password is not to be given it unless you personally say so. There are too many open files in some offices that people delve into as and when they want.

Final note about we button pushers from a self confessed one. Do stop the button pushing when it starts, something light like, "keep that thought and we'll discuss it later". If they are non-verbally button pushing (huff and puff, smirk, eye roll, mumbling, yawning etc.), then book in a meeting outside of the others team members hearing.

Once you are ready have a quiet discussion about it with the team member. Ask them why they did that or why they asked the question/made the statement they did. Listen to their answer carefully without interuption, if you need reflection time, tell them you will take it on board and get back to them. Provide feedback, not how you personally felt but how it affects the team, derails the meeting, and how you want to proceed from now on. Write out a plan and ask the team member to confirm it.

The non-verbal button pushing is the really tricky one but still worth a discussion. It could be that you always do something prior to the distraction that that could be changed, or you let one team member talk more than the others or allow them to interrupt, or the meetings go on too long. However you will get the occasional dunno or don't care team member, it is at this point you may have to speak with your manager and HR for support in a way forward.

Not all button pushing is bad, some of it averts issues, down to more experience, someone who thinks differently, or is trying to grow within their role and is really requesting more information. Understanding why they are button pushing is really helpful to you as a manager and them as a staff member and can help your whole team grow even if they button push for less than reasonable reasons.

Please don't worry any further about this staff member, she will eat into your self esteem and no one needs that. She is yesterdays news and just because others still don;t think so then maybe their need reminding that it is not up for discussion.

Swiftie1878 · 19/11/2024 09:20

I think there's ‘being professional’ and cutting out chit chat etc, and then there’s ’being frosty and inaccessible’.
It’s all about your tone, really. You can be very matter of fact and to the point without sounding harsh iykwim.

ArminTamzerian · 19/11/2024 09:56

You're only expected to be nice and be kind because you're a vagina owner. Otherwise you'd be seen as professional and appropriate. But you're a woman so you should have chatted about lipstick or shoes with her while she was underperforming and being a twat, obviously.

Candystore22 · 19/11/2024 10:21

marriagehelpplease · 14/11/2024 17:46

Thank you @Octavia64 , not quite was extreme as not saying hello no - but definitely less 'chit chat' interactions and contacting them at work at home days for general how are you chit chat yes. But never being out right/obviously rude in the way of blatantly ignoring.

It's been one of the most difficult managing situations of my life. Not because of the process but they are the kind of person to take zero accountability for anything

but definitely less 'chit chat' interactions and contacting them at work at home days for general how are you chit chat yes.
Not sure who was contacting who, but I think contacting someone while they’re working at home for general chit chat is weird. Chit chat is for during breaktimes, and doesn’t have to be personal. It could just be about the weather, yesterday’s match etc. It’s weird to phone about this stuff when someone’s working from home.

SharpOpalNewt · 19/11/2024 10:24

elessar · 14/11/2024 20:09

There's not really enough information in your OP about their actual behaviour to judge whether your approach was warranted or not, but in all honesty I wouldn't waste too much time worrying about it.

Sounds like this person was a bad apple and now they've gone, so does it matter if she didn't like how you interacted with her?

As a general rule, you don't want to leave yourself open to accusations of bullying when performance managing someone, so you should continue to be professional and pleasant. But that doesn't mean you need to be chatty or overly friendly - if anything I'd argue that you don't want to give mixed signals if you're dealing with serious performance issues.

It sounds like you may have made your dislike of her a bit too apparent in her final weeks, so that's a lesson for you - but I wouldn't lose any sleep over it.

Exactly this. She was a pain in the arse and has now left. Good!

JillMW · 19/11/2024 10:26

It is difficult for people to comment without seeing the situation. The fact that more than one other person feels you could have acted differently whereas one agrees with you is perhaps not as much a gender issue than chance.
Have you engaged in critical reflection using an in depth business tool? This way you can analyse the positive and negative actions, set them against evidence, read management theory, work with a mentor ( they can be external to your work place), put in plans for time measured change, review against outcome measures.
It may be that you could improve some actions. One to take an example, could be the way to justify your actions to colleagues.
Do you have management training? It is always an excellent way to improve your working practices and ideally should be ongoing.
Don’t dwell, reflect then act! Good luck

mewkins · 19/11/2024 10:53

I think it is really rude that they are passing comment on your management style. Were they at all supportive at the time?

I feel for you as managing a difficult person is so painful. Presumably only you as their line manager was privy to all of the information about their behaviour and work. So it's not on for those with half the story to sit back, watch you struggle and once it's all over pipe up with 'well I wouldn't have done it like that'.

TinyFlamingo · 19/11/2024 12:09

This low level misogyny still exists about us being realtors, empathetic, nice, kind etc and undermining us by their opinions when we are in charge. It's largely cultural.
Men are ambitious, woman are aggressive etc etc

Don't let them tell you, you weren't nice. Professional is still nice, you need to be really clear in these matters, they are a lot of work and exhausting and the smear campaign is what they are reacting to, here say about your leadership. Only you know if it didn't feel good because you were heavy handed or of you didn't feel good because it doesn't (they are exhausting)

You will improve next time because you've done one now and so you'll have better boundaries, better approach sooner, and that's enough:)

If any male or any colleagues bring it up again, it always causes an awkward dynamic in teams when someone is behaving inappropriately and voicing it loudly, and that you hope that they can take the measure of your leadership by how you treat them, not by how someone complains about poor treatment when they are not being professional, and it's time to move on a a team. That you value them and what they being to the team.

Jumpingoffthefence · 19/11/2024 12:25

It sounds like your actions could be perceived as bullying and may lead to a lack of confidence in your management. Whilst the situation was challenging as a manager you should have dealt with the issues in a more candid way rather than simply shutting down.

Follow Claire Benjamin Claire Benjamin Claire Benjamin Claire Benjamin Claire Benjamin she models conversations that come up in the workplace in a really helpful way.

MitochondriaUnited · 19/11/2024 13:30

I’m noticing it’s your make colleagues who thought you should have carried on smiling and being friendly.

Regardless of the ‘best way to handle the situation’, you also have some sexism at play there too.

MitochondriaUnited · 19/11/2024 13:33

I guess I just feel bad that my intention was never to affect someone as much as they say I did. My intention was to stop accepting nonsense, but maybe my message came across in the wrong way.

Wirth remembering that you put boundaries up, people often dint like it and feel victimised.
Its nitbthat they are. They just dint like being told NO.

MarkWithaC · 19/11/2024 13:47

This person has left and it's all done and dusted, yes? For me the pertinent question is why are these colleagues still discussing her and why are you continuing to respond to them?

Dinkydo12 · 19/11/2024 14:04

You are never going g to win this. Next time someone says be nice just say it works both ways. Explain you are running a business environment not a party.

hadenoughofplayinggames · 19/11/2024 14:09

Men just don’t understand women the way other women do, particularly small calculated words or actions that are designed to make you feel a certain way - they seem to just go over men’s heads.

It’s incredibly frustrating but you just have to ignore them. Emphasise that they don’t know all the facts of the situations and leave it at that. It sounds like your colleague has done the classic “be awful in an almost imperceptible way, that men won’t notice, and then cry to them when it blows up and make the other person seem like the bad guy”.

rb124 · 19/11/2024 15:50

Since this person has voluntarily left your Company, I don't think you need worry.

TheTruthICantSay · 19/11/2024 15:57

To be honest OP, I don't actually understand most of your posts so it's very hard to figure out what woud have been approproate.

Is this person still there or did she get managed out?

If her performance was weak, you should have beenc communicating expectations and, if she continued to not meet those expectations (including, for example, appropriate behaviour in the office), then those were things you could have continued to call her on.

Assuming she's now gone, a simple, "well, I was the one who had to. manage her out so at the end of the day, your experience was different to mine" is fine. If she's still there, there's a bigger issue.

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