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Soft approach failed, I don't know what to do

25 replies

PurpleSky300 · 09/10/2024 22:15

So… I’m having problems with one of my team, I don’t think I’m handling it well and I need some advice.

She is in her probation period. At first, she seemed great – good interview, experienced, seemed motivated. But after the first couple of months, it hasn’t been like that. Very, very slow to complete basic work. More complex items just never materialise. I’ve prompted and coaxed, spoon-fed work, juggled tasks and tried all the “softly, softly” approach but she just became more and more ‘checked out’ – less productive, leaving as early as possible every day, multiple periods of sickness. When I questioned this, she disclosed MH issues, and now I’m stuck.

I ask her if she needs any adjustments or support, she says no. I ask her to do a piece of work, she agrees maybe half the time. I am now doing most of her work because a) I know she won’t and b) I don’t want to be accused of exacerbating the MH issues.

I have been reluctant to involve HR formally because I was trying to give the benefit of the doubt, hoping gentle conversations would be enough, and it was the wrong call. My manager understands but said even if they implemented a PIP, for example - they’d need evidence of where targets weren’t being met. And I’ve been such a soft touch, and I’ve covered work and so on, to an extent that I don’t really have that trail of proof. I feel so trapped, burdened and stupid.

OP posts:
Whoknowswhatanymore · 09/10/2024 22:31

So now is the time to stop being soft and start building that trail of evidence!

tulippa · 09/10/2024 22:32

How much longer does she have left on her probation? Stop doing her work for her. Explain you were helping at first as she was new but now you would expect anyone in her role to complete whatever basic tasks need doing.

Set targets explaining exactly what needs doing by when. This just needs needs to be the basics of the role, nothing stretching. Then if she can't do those, it's relatively easy to let her go when her probation finishes.

Flag this with HR and explain what you're planning to do. They'll be able to advise if the targets you're setting are appropriate given her mental health issues.

I've been too soft on staff members on probation in the past and it backfired on me. I had a nightmare getting rid of them once I'd passed them and they turned out to be a real risk to the organisation. I certainly learned from that experience.

MeowCatPleaseMeowBack · 09/10/2024 22:35

Whoknowswhatanymore · 09/10/2024 22:31

So now is the time to stop being soft and start building that trail of evidence!

Yep.

Stop asking her to do tasks; assign tasks. Via email so you have a trail. If she tells you verbally she can't do it, email her saying "After our conversation earlier where you said X, here is some training/guidance to support you in the task."

She'll probably go off sick again but involve HR and follow your sickness policy and performance management policy to the letter.

NigelHarmansNewWife · 09/10/2024 22:35

Probation can be extended. Change tack and extend the probation period to give longer to see if a different way of managing her changes things.

SanctusInDistress · 09/10/2024 22:35

Document everything. Can you extend her probation?

GailTheFish · 09/10/2024 22:36

I’ve been there, and it’s tough but it’s in both of your interests to tackle her under-performance. How long does she have left on her probation? Does she have objectives or a development plan? I would start documenting everything - both keeping a log of conversations you’ve had, as well as moving to more written feedback.

Also, you mentioned that she’s had a lot of sickness absence. Does her probation terms cover attendance as well as performance? Where I work, a certain number of absences within a certain period would at least lead to discussions about whether that’s a satisfactory level to pass probation.

Sneakybusiness · 09/10/2024 22:37

I had to do this really recently. It was stressful but it was important to be very transparent so she had the choice to respond. Here is how we approached it after the softly approach didn’t work:

Have a meeting where we review her targets and laid out very specific objectives and timeframes for them. E.g. not just ‘do a guest list’ but ‘do a guest list in excel, saved in this folder, by this daye’

Explain in this meeting that if these targets aren’t met then she won’t pass her probation. We were very clear about this and repeated at the beginning and at the end.

have a discussion about what else she might need to help her with it (she already had loads of support).

Discussed extenuating circumstances (e.g. staff changes that made it hard to do her job).

It was hard as I really like her but it wasn’t fair for either of us to carry on. Her work improved dramatically but she resigned before her probation period was over.

Tiredofthewhirring · 09/10/2024 22:37

Why is your manager talking about a PIP in a probation period?

RosesAndHellebores · 09/10/2024 22:39

Set at least half a dozen smart objectives, and include punctuality and attendance. Evidence support. Put meeting in the diary monthly with a two weekly check in. Every meeting needs to be written up and sent to her.

Reasonable adjustments providing they are operationally feasible can be put in place. The contractual requirements, possibly with a 15% to 20% reduction need to be met.

Dot the i's and cross the t's. If necessary extend the probation period by four to eight weeks. Failing probation shoukd not come as a surprise.

HR would have advised. That's their role.

90yomakeuproom · 09/10/2024 22:40

Tiredofthewhirring · 09/10/2024 22:37

Why is your manager talking about a PIP in a probation period?

I was also thinking this. Action plans don't really apply during a probation period. Has this person had 8, 16 and 24 week probation meetings?

Quitelikeit · 09/10/2024 22:42

Just let her go - usually within probation it’s only one weeks notice

Tel12 · 09/10/2024 22:48

Speak to HR informally and come up with a plan. Being a manager is tough but this one seems to have sussed you out as a soft touch. You need targets, deadlines and reviews. The quicker you can let her go the better. Otherwise you'll be covering for the next 20 years.

PurpleSky300 · 10/10/2024 19:34

I decided to seek some advice from HR as I'm struggling with this. There are objectives, and I do need to do a probation review. You know the line about how 'these conversations should never come as a surprise', people do generally know what direction they're heading in? I feel like it would come as a surprise, right now.

Her attitude is very 'tick-box' like, along the lines of, "You asked me to deliver X and I did it so what's the problem?". Not taking into account the standard of work at all - like the fact it took 2 months instead of two weeks, and the level of planning was poor, and someone else had to pick up the evaluation etc. She seems to think as long as it's completed, it doesn't matter whether it's good or bad or terrible. No insight. Taking weeks to do tasks that could be done in hours, it's just the same. "I'm busy", "I'm still working on X" and I just think, how?!

OP posts:
PurpleSky300 · 10/10/2024 19:40

What runs through my head 24/7, and what I can't possibly say without losing my own job, is what the hell are you doing all day?!

OP posts:
ZenNudist · 10/10/2024 19:43

Well you haven't voiced your concerns. You now have to. Only extend the probation period, if you think you might keep her, otherwise id let her go. She sounds like a nightmare. I wouldn't mention sickness specifically I would provide all the examples of where her work has been lacking. You are going to need HR help. But push back on them as much as possible to make this next step as quick as possible. Don't drag it out.

ZenNudist · 10/10/2024 19:44

Why cant you ask what she is doing. You tell her how long something should take and if she doesn't do it in that time you tell her it isn't good enough. Start saying the things you are thinking (politely).

EBearhug · 10/10/2024 19:46

"You asked me to deliver X and I did it so what's the problem?". Not taking into account the standard of work at all - like the fact it took 2 months instead of two weeks

Do you give her the deadlines? How do you measure the standard of work? What level of errors is or isn't acceptable? Absolute perfection won't happen - we are all human - and you need some room to make mistakes when you're learning. The details will depend on the type of work, but you need to give her something specific.

TentEntWenTyfOur · 10/10/2024 19:48

The next time you ask her to deliver X, give her a set date or time when it needs to be completed.

She's taking the absolute piss and is weaponising her 'mental health' against you.

Skykidsspy · 10/10/2024 19:51

You will need to be more direct in instruction - please do x, to y standard by z time. If
she then fails, she can’t say she wasn’t given a clear instruction.

check the job description. Create a training plan taking into account her experience. Lay out expectations by certain points and by the end of probation. Review progress. Write it all down.

if she is not meeting expectations, tell her exactly why without being nice about it.

’Unfortunately, you are not meeting the standards to pass your probation at the moment. You will need to be performing as laid out in the job description. The areas for improvement are such and such.

do you understand?

do you know what is required?

what support is required by you from the company?’

clear consistent communication is always required.

sympathies, it’s really rubbish to have to waste time going through the process

Chewbecca · 10/10/2024 19:52

You need to define the task more comprehensively.
I need X by X date to include ABC, having being reviewed by Miss F, with zero errors.

But ultimately, terminate before the end of probation is a far, far more sensible approach. This is very unlikely to get better!

Singleandproud · 10/10/2024 19:55

I career changed from a very deadline driven one to one where you are told to do tasks at your own pace, coupled with working remotely it's difficult to tell what exactly is expected of you. If I have a big expanse of time Infront of me then the time taken to do the task can easily creep so I set myself my own deadlines.

Perhaps you need to implement Planner for your team, so you can Add tasks and add review / final deadlines to all team members so you aren't singling her out. But she can also see the pace everyone else is working too and it is great for collaborative tasks.

RaphaelDidIt · 10/10/2024 19:56

You can definitely ask what's she's doing all day.
I've had to manage poor performers quite a lot over the years and it's got easier each time. Being clear and consistent about what your asking them to do and by when - and then following up by email is key. I also put in a daily 15 minute check in so they can ask questions and to help keep on track. And at least an hour once a week to go through in more detail. I make sure to not do their work or make corrections but to add comments to docs about what needs to change and to explain why.

Most recent case, I set what days she needed to be in the office so that she could sit with me or other senior team members for support etc. Also made it clear that the sickness levels were unacceptable and if they were genuine then I had a duty of care so referred to occupational health.

Its so time consuming but it's better than passing a poor performer and having them in your team for years.

(Edited for typo)

GiantRoadPuzzle · 10/10/2024 22:42

I had exactly this scenario and ended up managing her out.

Direct instruction, following up by email, agreeing clear deadlines with examples of how things need to be done, regular coaching sessions in the calendar & documenting everything was what worked for my situation.

It wasn’t enough to say “arrange a meeting”; I had to state who to invite, exactly how to find out availability, get her to confirm the meeting room etc and say “I expect this to take you an hour, I’ll follow up at 2pm to see how you’ve got on”. When she failed to do it, I’d ask her to break down the steps to try to understand the barrier.

She wasn’t capable in the end, in both senses of the word, so ended up quitting before she was fired. She was in a formal PIP at that stage, after I had tried the softly informal stage, plus her signed off for 14 weeks and a 6 week phased return via OH.

It’s hugely time consuming but for your sake and the sake of the business, it needs to be managed properly and not ignored.

Marblesbackagain · 10/10/2024 22:46

Your deliverables need to be spelled out . I want X task done to this standard by y date. That stops the wriggle room.

MounjaroUser · 10/10/2024 22:49

I think it's fair enough to ask her what she's doing all day! Tell her you want her to do X task to a set standard and within a set time. The soft approach isn't working with her and she's making you do her work!

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