Staff member issue

[Jammylou]

I manage a large team.
On the whole majority are great.
I have a couple though that just love to cause trouble.
One in particular, a make in his 40s is a manipulative person and I flummoxed how vest to deal with him.
One minute he is all charm I'm the best ever Manager he loves me but this is when he feels he is getting his own way or wants something.
He'll either work really hard or be clever and do hardly anything. He likes to make out he's the best staff member we have and constantly blows his own trumpet. This is far from the truth.
The issue is when he isn't getting his own way he will happily throw me under the bus. He's done this many times. Either to my own staff or senior management.
Just to clarify he is known in the organisation to be difficult and I am fortunate that people tell me what he's been saying and that how sorry they feel that I have to have him on my team. He's not popular in the team either.
However recently I had to make a decision that he wasn't happy about in the interests of the team.
I then found out he has been criticising me to our Head of Service.
As I've said he's done this many times but due to his complex character I've never really addressed it. I felt that I would grey rock him so to speak. Not give him the attention he craves. I feel now though I must as he's done it so many times and now gone too far I need to let him know.
Has anyone else managed what I can only describe as a narcissist. How have you dealt with such complicated manipulative behaviour.

Micromanage him and document everything. Keep a timeline. He’ll soon get the message.

If his complaints are falling on deaf ears because everybody knows he's a twat, just carry on as you are.

If it is affecting your reputation or work then either ask senior managers or HR (depending on how helpful each are) for advice on how to manage him out.

Becoming a micromanager could work as most people can't stand being micromanaged, but you open yourself up to bullying accusations and it will be exhausting to maintain.

Your job is to manage. Why havent you managed this cunt out?

Especially if he has form for such bad behaviour?

This is on you - you know he's bad - get rid of him. If you dont, then thats on you.

Ugh, we have one of these and so far the approach seems to have been to pander to them and flatter their ego. They’ve been in the organisation for years and know our sector inside out, so can be very helpful when they want, but it’s always on their terms, and the rest of the time they are difficult and disruptive. We are public sector and I have made the point that in the private sector they would have been managed out years ago, but now managers are looking at trying to move them into a different area (so someone else’s problem).

So no advice but empathy.

Where I work it's not easy to manage anyone out tbh.
Also his behaviour is covert and crafty.
It's hard to get evidence as he says things in a sly way.

Similar situation.

😬

I expect it’s common across local and national governments. I don’t line manage our difficult person but their behaviour affects my role (not least because they think they should have my job). I am looking for a new job because nothing is going to change in my current one and I’ve had enough of them.

If he says sly things, document it - and follow up in an email.

"Just to clarify, you said XXXX earlier in our conversation. Sending you this note so that you are aware of the exchange that took place".

If he challenges it, then you have it in writing that he is challenging you, ergo, he has to prove he didnt say/do something. You are the manager, your word will always be stronger by default.

I dont buy the story that he cant be managed out. To me, that says you have either not tried, and if you have, you did a piss poor job.

you also have to consider weather you let on how you know, you need to cover your sources to be able to be kept in the loop otherwise once x person knows who is likely to talk then they may change strategy @Jammylou

Watch Dr Ramini on YouTube and Jefferson Fisher. It will give you tips on what to say etc
P.S. Jefferson Fisher is so hot!! Lol! Just watch him anyway!

document EVERYTHING!!!

Any experienced HR person will be familiar with that kind of covert/sly behaviour. The question is whether you have good HR and how spineless the company is when dealing with performance issues.

We don't. I have tried to manage someone else out before they shout mental health issues and HR back down.seen it happen so many times.
I am going to rethink my approach and strategy and will document everything.

Sorry to hear that. Weak HR makes it so tricky.

Are you in the UK? It is very difficult to get rid of someone here

Are you able to document unprofessional behaviour examples and include them in his appraisal, giving him ‘below expectations’ due to unprofessional behaviour?

encourage him to move to a different department and help him with job applications

Manage with a straight bat, all the way. Micromanaging could work but then you run the risk of singling him out. You could set up a meeting with HR and advise him that you've heard how unhappy he is and that it is important for the buisness and him, that the issues are aired and addressed. HR are there to protect the buisness interests at the end of day. Give examples of what you have been told and see what happens. If you don't address it, he will continue and it might be construed that you are unable to manage effectively. Meet him head on in the most professional way possible. Loose lips sinks ships at the end of the day. Let him do the talking as he seems so fond of doing.

Had one like this!

He was a nightmare - won't go into details as it went to disciplinary & dismissal.

Sit him down, as you are his manager, and document the conversation. Every little comment - every tantrum he has, document, document. It's very hard if HR are not behind you. I would speak to HR and get advice.

But sometimes with these people, they are always right, always the hardest worker who does the most work, everyone else is wrong, jobs a joke, etc

It took 6 months to get rid of the guy who worked for me from start to finish but he did something that brought it on so he did us a favour really or I may have still been stuck with him now.

You have to consistently call out the poor conduct, in person, follow up with an emails so that the expected standards are clear and you have an audit trail. It’s exhausting, but in most circumstances the annoying twat will start looking for other opportunities

Yes I am.

And the UK is by far one of the easiest places in the world to fire people.

Just look at how many big corporations axe jobs in the UK before looking at job culls internationally.

No other manager will touch him.....reputation. He's been in several depts before and has a long history of moves.

I would never leave a criticism until an appraisal.
Every time he does something I'd raise it, or I'd quote a few examples and tell him to stop, follow up by email. If he does it again tell him next time it happens you will raise a greivance .... you need to apply consistent pressure.

I’m a CEO of a charity and have had similar issues. I would a say document everything, give him SMART objectives and focus on behaviours, people like him struggle with criticism so frame the feedback around observed behaviours and its impact on the team/org. You will need to appeal to his need for recognition so align his personal goals with the org or team goals. And praise publicly when you have the metrics to back it up - when you don’t have the metrics - stay silent.
Be calm and fact based - ‘when you said this the impact was that’ and have the evidence to back it up.
you are the manager - so set those boundaries and enforce them.
Also call it out - when he throws you under a bus say something like “ i noticed during the meeting that I was held responsible for blah blah - this is not my role so I want to make sure we’re aligned on our responsibilities going forward “

good luck ! It’s a bloody nightmare I know !!

Have worked with similar people in the past , the places I've been at have made the ppl redundant rather than sack them .

Any chance of that.