Do you think I am underpaid? PhD from Cambridge

[Ramphamosa]

I’m 29. I’ve got a PhD from Cambridge in a STEM subject. 1st class undergraduate from Oxford.

I work for one of the big four. I earn about £58k a year in London. I work 9am-8pm most days. Get very little bonus.

I know it sounds like a decent salary, but I honestly thought I’d earn a lot more than I do. Big 4 was my fall back choice.

DH has a PhD from Cambridge and is in touch with five of his mates who also took theirs at a very similar time around 1993/1994. Three of them including DH remained in academia and are the least well paid by far on salaries of around 70k, DH has just retired early. The other two are on mega bucks 200k plus having sold their souls, they work in banking. They all took STEM subjects.

What you will find is that how you can communicate and get on with people will influence more than you think. Lots of qualifications isn’t enough. I know some very clever folk but good grief their communication skills are awful.

Fellow PhD grad here, but a bit older than you - I started off on similar and now (8-10 years on with 3 kids mat leave) earn low 6 figures in the City. So what I am trying to say is I think you have to stick it out, do great work (and I am sure your PhD will help with that) and it will all come together depending where you want to go. It’s early days in your post-academia career.

Unfortunately PhD is mostly irrelevant outside of academia or academia adjacent fields. Especially if it is unrelated to your work.

Do you have the relative qualifications in your field? Do you get paid the same as your colleagues or less?

One of my colleagues has a PhD. It's just a fun fact in our line of work.

In 25 years of having a PhD *related to my professional field, my main take away is that you're an academic PhD = 3 years less relevant work experience, regardless of university or field.

• from a University highly regarded in my field.

I think you need a role and company that values a PhD. For example, you could have a PhD and work at a check out in Tesco because the role doesn't require a PhD.

Look for a role in a private company that requires a PhD and you will likely be paid accordingly. For example, a quant researcher in a hedge fund.

If you'd gone into industry in a PhD related role, you'd likely be on ~£40k (unless you're in high level tech), so your salary seems relatively high by comparison.

what’s your role and are you fully qualified?
I’m assuming the PhD is not related to your area of work and salary is based on experience, level in organisation and ACA status.

I’m not comfortable giving my exact role. But it doesn’t require any professional exams.

80% of my team have PhDs and if not have distinctions in mathematics from Imperial etc. I work in a highly numerical role, coding, etc so it’s not your run of the mill general consulting

How many years have you worked there?

you need to start considering your career path tbh. Build the cv you need for that next role

So you'll know your role better than randoms on the internet. What is the industry standard for your role? Have you looked on Glassdoor for similar job titles and salaries? What's the progression in your field? Eg I know people make partner younger in tax than consulting as a general rule. If you're doing something that pays far more highly outside the Big Four, then it would make sense to move out if the career progression isn't then hugely out of whack?

Look at the market rate for what you do, then. If you are in fact underpaid for your specific role, it should be easy enough to make a data-based case for that and/or get an offer closer to par from a competitor.

I found the have-not-yachts article in the Guardian - here for anyone interested. A bit of interesting context to this thread.

Unless it is a very specialised work discipline then PhDs dont count for much whereas work experience does.

Does your PhD specialism actually help you in your role? or is it a nice to have?

OP, nobody can really comment on whether your salary is typical if you aren't prepared to say what you actually do.

Salaries are usually based on the nature of the work rather than on the qualifications of the individual worker. If a job requires specific skills or qualifications, that will probably be reflected in the salary but the fact that you have a PhD isn't really relevant unless that's an essential requirement for the role.

It isn't clear from your posts as to whether you a) think you're being paid at less than the market rate for the kind of work that you do; b) think you should be entitled to higher than the standard market rate for your role because you perceive that you deserve more recognition for your academic qualifications; or c) whether you're actually just a bit disappointed that your career hasn't progressed in the way that your academic success led you to believe it might.

If it's (a) and you think you're being paid less than market rate, ask for a raise or look for another job.

If it's (b) and you think you should get paid more than the market rate just because you have a strong academic record, it's time to get real and recognise that your employer really doesn't care about your qualifications, they are just paying you to do a specific job.

If it's (c), then it's probably time to review your career plans, set some clear, ambitious but realistic objectives and identify if there are any specific weaknesses or skills gaps that might be holding you back.

Move into financial services sector and you’ll earn more. Big 4 don’t actually pay all that well.

the PhD gets you the interview, not the job. And after that you need to move firms to increase pay. Look to make every 2-3 years to maximise raises.

Data Science/analysis? Is this really complicated algorithms/machine learning or SQL that you can copy off stack overflow?

I do coding, I earn the same as you and I have a BA geography degree from a mid uni so it’s not always that relevant.

What do similar roles in other companies pay?

How many years experience do you have?

Are you being underpaid? Probably, but you need to justify it with what you actually do rather than what degrees you all have.

The PhD really is the least of it all! I have plenty of friends with PhDs, and their incomes range from minimum wage to serious wealth. It's down to the job they end up doing.

Where do you work out of interest? My husband has a BSc computer science and is a senior dev (10 years experience) and gets paid approx £60k and I am convinced he’s underpaid but he doesn’t believe me. I’d love to be able to point him in the direction of what he should be getting.

Can I ask - why did you choose to do a PhD?

If it was because you thought it would get you a higher salary, then you may have been misinformed.

The Oxbridge PhDs I know tended to choose that path because they were really into their subject and wanted to pursue it further, and/or just enjoyed the studenty lifestyle and wanted to do that for a bit longer. Afterwards a lot of them tended to take entry-level positions in the Big 4 (or similar) at normal entry-level salaries. They made pretty quick progress in terms of careers and salaries, though, because they were very bright and worked hard.

The only way to find out if you're underpaid is to start looking around for other similar jobs and see what the salaries are. There's no formula "these are my qualifications / experience and this is my employer so I should earn x amount".

Sound advice. As someone who used to work in professional assessment, when someone is frustrated because their career isn't progressing like they think it should, nine times out of ten there is a clear issue with their soft skills, emotional intelligence, or both. The tenth time, they lack the get up and go to go after a higher salary, for whatever reason.

The salary for most highly technical roles has a functional ceiling, unless you are in quantitative modelling for the City, or are a rockstar software dev.

You probably won't want to answer openly, but you have to consider how long you have worked there in that role and what have your performance reviews been like? I am surprised you hadn't had a good bonus which may indicate they don't view your performance as "outstanding". What feedback have you had from fee-paying clients that you can take to them to request a salary increase? What "beyond your role" elements have you delivered? Now you are in the role it's now what qualifications you have, it's what you do in the role that counts.

(Ex big4, now in fintech).

where i am we have a good system of apprenticeships. Where i work we have coders with an apprenticeship, and coders with a degree (some with a masters, one working on his PhD thesis on the side)

They are all paid according to how good they are. And those who didn't go to uni are on average higher paid at my place. Other places may be different.

Are you going to take on board what a lot of pp have been saying about how working at the Big 4 is an investment in your future?

Surely the question isn't whether you get paid enough (because the salary bands are what they are + it's a tough environment for pay rises) but whether you're at the right grade?