Civil service - Request remote work permanently

[Brightsparks2102]

Hi,

I work for the Civil Service, Cabinet office, GRS specifically. I'm a permanent staff member in civil service since 2011.

Currently my office base location is in Newcastle upon tyne. I work from home as there's no real demand to go into office due to capacity issues. Even though guidance says we should go in 40%-60%.

Now my husband has been offered a job that's located in Birmingham. We have 2 young children and we're a dual income household. So flexibility of my current role comes into question.

Would it be reasonable for me to request a home working contract under these circumstances where I'll be uprooting and relocating? It's an operational role, so easily done from home.

Don't want to go straight to my line manager as they are new to the department and I'm not sure where I can get 'anonymous' advice in the Department as everyone knows everyone.

I'll appreciate any assistance/guidance.

@Nw22 Sorry to hear that, is there any way to appeal? What was the reason for rejecting your request?

I did a flexible WFH which enabled me to reduce office time down to 2 days a month, I have a very easy going manager and he doesn't chase me down for those 2 days so sometimes it's less but I think it would have been difficult for me to push for full time because it shows no compromise and there is some benefit to some contact time I have to admit.

I think the problem you'll have is it wouldn't be for the purposes of reasonable adjustment, it's because you're moving, I would explore the option of moving your base first. I'm not sure where GRS is based but even London might be feasible if you can get them to agree to say 1 day a week as the London salary may well help cover that? Although if it's like my organisation they are trying to avoid London basing where possible.

A flexible working request can be refused for any business reason. A business might not offer working from home contracts because it affects quality/output.

You can offer flexible working without this meaning working from home.

I think a lot of people have wrongly got excited about the plans for flexible working that Labour are bringing in. They think it means that businesses can’t refuse requests. For those companies that already offer flexible working though little is going to change as they are already approving unless there’s a business reason. They are already doing all of this and the only thing that will change is it will become a day 1 right (and most of the CS has already implemented this)

Exactly, we would allow home working as a reasonable adjustment under The Equality Act, or other relevant legislation. We might offer temporary home working under certain situations (end of life relative etc) but this would be at HRs discretion and would fall outside of custom and practice as it would be for that purpose only.

We have to follow the minimum % mandated. If the Civil Service guidance says 60% office based, that’s what we have to mandate.

We don’t necessarily follow up on enforcing it.

@AllThePotatoesAreSinging Thank you ☺️ It’s interesting to hear that the % time attendance isn’t necessarily being enforced. What would usually be the HR process if a member of staff did relocate and no longer attended the office (obviously they’d be in breach of contract so presumably some kinds of disciplinary?). I work in a devolved govt dept where there is currently no mandated % time attendance, just a requirement to be in the office “part of every week” which isn’t in any way monitored or enforced. That could change next year when the policy is due to be reviewed though, and I’d be moving and getting a mortgage hundreds of miles from the nearest office so a huge risk that a % time requirement is introduced. I assume written approval from my line manager to attend the office only once a month wouldn’t count tor much from a HR enforcement perspective?

That's a very helpful insight. GRS is part of the Cabinet office within GPG (Government people group), confusing i know 😐. I'm happy to compromise and will look at other nearby office locations they have incase they can't change my location to my first choice, as Cabinet office also have presence in Sheffield and Manchester etc.

If there’s a requirement to be in the office X amount of time then approval from your line manager wouldn’t exempt you from this, unless they had agreed it with HR and HR agreed in writing. Otherwise everyone would just get their line manager to ‘write them a note’ (I definitely would!)

I work closely with several similar devolved groups in a sort of HR working group and it’s the same for them - could change at any minute depending on what happens ‘upstairs’.

One of our staff members moved some distance away during Covid and they chose to book overnight accommodation at their expense for face to face team meetings. We wouldn’t have given them a working from home contract as the move was their choice, and we would have had to fund their travel and accommodation if the wfh contract had been granted.

We had one staff member move but wanted us to pay their costs for commuting … that was a no.

If someone based in an office moves far enough from that office that they request a working from home contract due to the move, if approved then the business becomes liable for their transport costs. That’s a valid business reason for refusing to grant a flexible working request.

I think GRS are going to be based at the new Manchester Hub, an 90 mins ish on the train from new street then the free bus from Piccadilly to Whitworth Street West.

Not the most fun journey but doable if it’s once a week and the mandate isn’t enforced

@AllThePotatoesAreSinging That’s good point about expenses. It’s totally fair enough for people to have to pay for their own travel/accommodation imo. Were there any repercussions for your staff member who moved away during COVID as they were presumably not attending the mandated % time? I think I’ll just wait and see what happens with the upcoming hybrid working review. I wouldn’t expect a home working contract, but would be looking for an exemption to attending the office every week (once a month would be manageable plus for any in-person events/meetings). I wouldn’t feel comfortable moving and taking on mortgage 100s of miles from the office without it. The reason for my move is for caring reasons for my parents - while not urgent, I will need to make a decision on moving (or put in place some support for them if not) soon.

@Brightsparks2102 & @Ilikewinter Keep us posted on how you get on with your requests 🙂

It’s not come up yet as we aren’t clamping down (yet!) but we expect there will come a point where we are asked to provide figures. It’s just not happened yet.

Completely understand your predicament - I’m actually one of the people that moved house and for much the same reason as you, I’m a carer for an elderly relative. Office is a bit of a mission but manageable for now. Once both kids are in school, if we have to enforce 60% that’s when I’ll have to consider my options.

Will do, my manager confirmed my request is now sitting with the Grade 6🤞🤞

This mandate about 60% in the office came from the previous Govt, and I know it wasn't enforced locally in lots of places!

Mainly because some places didn't have enough room, some people were recruited during Covid & lived too far away to commute & some SCS said stuff you Jacab Reece Mogg hybrid working is very successful here, not causing any issues & we will carry on as we are thank you very much!

Good luck with your request OP!

@Brightsparks2102 @ellabellaaaa.

Hi guys, just coming back to say my WFH request has been granted today ... I'm honestly gobsmacked !!!! Hope its also good news for you both 🤞🤞

@Ilikewinter that's great news. It does feel like some pragmatism is returning on the matter, we've heard new guidance is due out shortly (it won't necessarily require less than 3 days, but should be worded so it's not quite so dogmatic...)

I certainly hope so, my department is one that's been a real stickler for implementing 60% but we have quite a few new starters coming on board over the next few months at which point we won't have the office capacity for us all to do 60%! I'm hoping it will start to quietly drop off!

Ah that's great news. I haven't had the chance to submit my request yet as I've had to take care of some personal things. But could I ask did your work place request any adjustments from your initial request? And what did the conversation involve with your Grade 7 before they put your request forward?

I still can't believe it!. My reasons for requesting it was to go back home nearer family. I said that I was willing to be flexible and attend mandatory training days and some face to face 1-1s. My grade 7 just wanted to understand what my 'flexible' would look like so I said I would attend the office once every 2 months. They've accepted that with no push back.

That's brilliant. You demonstrated flexibility and commitment to them, so theres no reason for them to say no to your request! So happy for you. 😃

@Ilikewinter - That’s fantastic news! I was so pleased to see your post yesterday. I bet you’re absolutely chuffed. Once every 2 months seems reasonable. Can I ask what the “approval” actually looks like in practice? Are they issuing a new contract with home as your contractual location or is it more written confirmation from your G6 to say they’re happy for you to work remotely? I have the latter from my G6 but still contemplating whether to do a formal request

Yeah im sooo happy, especially as I 100% expected it to be a 'no'. It will be a new contract with home as my place of work. I would put in a formal request, you've got nothing to lose and if business needs change they'll be able to recind your written agreement I'm sure!