Is this age discrimination discrimination, and can they make me go back FT?

[Floofydawg]

I work in financial services in a mid senior role. Mid 50's. Two years ago it was agreed for me to work 4 days (80%) as a stepping stone to retirement. I was still coping with a FT workload as I had a member of support staff who reported to me.

In the last month I've lost this support person and they have not been replaced, so I've been struggling with workload and have been quite stressed. I arranged a meeting with my manager to discuss this, and it became a conversation about the fact (in his mind) that I should really go back FT. I feel like I'm being pushed out and that he doesn't want a PT person doing my role. Things he has said to me:

I don't know how you manage to do that job in 4 days
Do you want my job eventually? (To which I said no, I want to retire in the next 3 or 4 years so why would I take a step up). He felt that this was a problem as he needs someone who is eager to get promoted.

So my question is around where I stand and whether I can be forced to go back FT?

Apologies for the double discrimination in my title, don't know where that came from!

What was your support person doing?

Lots of things really, stuff that was below my pay grade, which I now have you do.

Is there the possibility of doing 5 days worth of hours in 4 days?
If you are doing unpaid overtime to cover the full role then you might as well get paid for it.

Now you've had an initial conversation with him I'd follow it up now you've both had time to reflect and take it from there.

Was that person full time?

So now you are being asked to cover your own role at 4 days a week, plus around 5 days worth of work of someone else?

They were FT supporting me and another person.

You told him that you were expecting to retire in 3-4 years' time. He felt that this was a problem as he needs someone who is eager to get promoted.

So basically this was him telling you that he doesn't want someone (ie you) in the job because you are approaching retirement age. That is blatantly discriminating against older staff members, because people approaching retirement are unlikely to fulfil his criteria.

I would certainly be keeping a record of this and similar conversations, just in case something happens down the line.

@twingiraffes that's what I thought, thanks.

It doesn't sound like the manager is against someone who is approaching retirement age, he instead wants someone he can mentor to take over his role and you don't want to because you want to retire. It could still be discriminatory but it's not quite as straightforward as pp thinks. I'd see a solicitor to discuss.

He sounds like a pretty crap manager tbh. As someone has left, you cannot be expected to do their job alongside your own - that’s just bad management not to replace that person. Expecting you to work FT because of their lack of management is ridiculous. You need to meet again with your manager and be assertive.
’Hi manager, I’d like to explain my position. I work part time for a very good reason, and will not be returning to full time. My role is full enough as it is without me having to take on the role of another employee who you have chosen not to replace - I am not able to do 2 jobs at once. Your desire to have someone who you feel should be eager for promotion is not my concern. I do my job very well, which is what you should be aiming for. I will not be increasing my hours, nor will I be completing extra tasks now my coworker has left. In fact, if I am expected to take on more of their tasks, which ones of my tasks would you like me to cut back on?’

If one of my reports said they would be looking to retire in 4 years, I would say; “good for you, how do we support you with this goal?” - then I would be succession planning for your eventual retirement. Finding someone who could support you since you lost your support, with a view of that person eventually taking your role on when you leave.

win win for everyone.

your manager sounds very inexperienced at best, and discriminatory at worse

So there are a few things to consider:

• can they make you work FT? Depends on the arrangement for PT? Did you get a permanent arrangement or one that is reviewed annually? Assuming it was perm and contract states 4 days and that's that. If they want to change you to full time they'd have to run a consultation to make a substantial change to your T&Cs. You'd have the opportunity to make your case etc and it would likely not work
• is the manager discrimating due to age. Well that's a whole different story, that was an inappropriate comment but ultimately nothing he can do. You are in post, you're permie. He can't make you redundant due to age and just replace you with younger model. So then you're stuck with a sub par manager for your last few years of work. If you feel he's continuing inappropriate behaviour and comments you can escalate to HR
• workload... you've got too much workload due to this vacancy. So if I were you I'd write back to the manager following the conversation and put your points in writing and keep focused on workload. This person has left, there's too much work to do. You haven't got time and the work tasks are not in your job description. Ask him when is the person being replaced and what is his recommendation around workload in the interim. Offer some suggestions eg I could defer this project, I could not do these tasks etc.

I wonder if it's the same Financial Services organisation that I am at, but leaving shortly due their sudden and hostile U turn on any form of flexible working which they had promoted for years , I'm delighted as I'm getting a big redundancy payment because of their short sightedness.

Are you in the union OP? I'd probably join if not to be on the safe side.

@Anameisaname has good specific advice. Also are there any groups in the organisation that focus on pre retirement/late age careers? If there is well worth having a conversation with them.

They need to recruit someone else to provide the support that was provided.

It does not make sense to assume you will do everything and go back to full time at this stage.

I assume the person who left workload included providing the equivalent of 2.5 days a week if they were dividing their time between two people so even if you went full time you would not be able to cover the whole workload.

They have agreed you worked pattern of 4 days until retirement so you are perfectly right to stand your ground.

I would seek some advice (ACAS, Citizen Advice) and make sure you keep a written record of everything.

It just sounds to me like a poor manager and a company that many is trying to save money by not recruiting adequate staffing.

I think I've been moved to a permanent part time contract. It certainly hasn't ever been renewed. This isn't the first time my manager has asked me to go back FT. It's one of those places where the expectation on people is just becoming higher and higher, and when people leave it's expected that their work gets absorbed. It's toxic. I refuse to work a lot over my hours and that doesn't go down well.

@rookiemere how did you negotiate the redundancy from this situation?

They changed our job titles to force us all to work Mon-Fri 9-5 - yes that's just how petty they now are, apparently 8.30-4.30 would cause the demise of the business - so as a result it is called change to contract . It's so shortsighted because in my role we are sometimes required to work out of hours during the night and weekend, which we all happily did in return for the flexibility and in my case reduced salary.

I'm lucky because of my age and circumstances, many with young DCs have been forced to suck it up.

Unfortunately you are in a different situation, but I would speak to your union or anyone senior involved in late stage careers - even at our place they still encourage those near retirement to phase down rather than leave straight away.

Yes it sounds like age discrimination and they need to be very careful.

What about the other person who has lost their support, can you join forces with them?

Thanks @rookiemere, that does sound petty in the extreme. I don't know if we have late stage careers advice, HR haven't exactly been helpful to me in the past. It feels very much like they just want to get the oldies out without any thought for the experience they're losing.

ACAS has helpful info on discrimination of part time workers: https://www.acas.org.uk/part-time-workers

And age discrimination:
https://www.acas.org.uk/acas-guide-on-age-discrimination

This is important to check. When you did your original PT request you should have received a letter and ideally a new contract. You should check your emails for this. This will give you a view on how firm a ground you stand. Although after 2 years of working PT ypu can argue that it's custom and practice anyway.

Going to give another perspective (devil’s advocate and all that).

Could you be doing a slow slide into retirement, and not putting as much enthusiasm into the role as you could? 3 or 4 years of this is wearing in the rest of the team.

You are only mid fifties so looking at retiring very early (younger than 60?) so it is not surprising eyebrows are raised about you scaling back and slowing down.

@OhBeAFineGuyKissMe are you my manager?

Just a thought. A friend wanted to work less as she moved into retirement. They employed someone more qualified than she was - who took over the more challenging parts of her role and allowed her to go from 5 days to 3 days a week - her salary remained the same. She is very happy with the outcome and will retire completely in a couple of years.
Age discrimination is a challenge for companies - when people are on the go slow as they wind down to retirement, it's quite demotivating for the team to work with someone like that. Not saying this is the case here - but it is mentioned quite often on MN.