No more flexible working.

[UnicornMadeOfPinkGlitter]

Quite a long story so will try and keep it short.
have been in my role for over 5 years and am the only person in my role so I am different to everyone else, in that they all work a full day, whereas there are periods of my job where I work much longer hours and also expected to be able to work from my annual leave. Have been sending emails and chasing queries from the side of the pool before. And also often not get lunch breaks.
now I don’t mind this and was prepared for this because I’ve always been able to work half and hour later and leave half an hour earlier.
a new manager has taken umbrage to this and has questioned it multiple times. I have always referred him back to the big boss who has said it’s fine and I’ve carried on.
I usually come in the half hour later due to commitments at home and taking dd to school as no transport from home to school. So she’s getting there half an hour early so that I can still get to work on time. (She’s 6th form so has the common room to sit in) and rarely leave that half an hour early, usually leave about quarter to ten to so 15/10 minutes early but often there until 10pm at etc.
sorry also forgot another element in that I have a voluntary role outside of work where I have been allowed to leave an hour early one day a week.

my line manager started questioning it again so the big boss called a meeting. He started off the meeting by saying he didn’t have an issue with my hours and appreciate that I always go above and beyond and work hard.

somehow by the end of the meeting because of my line manager not giving in, I now have to work the full time hours and have been given a term notice to stop the voluntary work or drop an hours pay a week. And any overtime will be given as time of in lieu that I can’t use as I want as they would rather that I say worked an hour and half overtime a day for a 6 week period and then for the next 6 weeks leave an hour and half early!!!

im very unhappy with this arrangement and said that I would want to take time off in lieu when I wanted to eg if I had a weeks worth could tack it on to my holidays. What good is going home early? I won’t benefit from that as a short term thing.

do I have a case to answer in that for 5 years this has been my standard practice and any way I can object and have my hours to changed?

Whenever I have had a job with flexible working and core hours, we had a system to log our hours worked each day. If we were under (rarely) we made it up evenings/weekends if we were over we were allowed to leave early or take a day off. But the crux is, my boss knew exactly what I worked each day.

Yours sounds messy! If you're insisting on working this way, you need to keep a timesheet.

My current role is flexible, in so far as I'm allowed to nip out to pick the kids from school or finish at 4.30 instead of 5 occasionally. But if I was taking the piss, it would be removed and I feel like you're playing the system a bit and the boss has noticed.

Record your hours. Continue working as you have for the last 5 years. After a month go back to the head with proof of your hours worked. Renegotiate your flexible working.

Some managers just can't think in a flexible way at all and therefore end up shooting themselves in the foot. Presenteeism at it's finest. I agree with others - malicious compliance. And don't be available for extra if they ask. Remind them that you used to be but they wanted you in earlier🤷🏻‍♀️

How much longer has your DD at sixth form? Not much longer presumably if it's Y13. I wonder if you could negotiate to keep the current arrangement until the end of this school year and then start the new hours after then. A change in terms and conditions should be mutually agreed. I also agree with keeping a timesheet to show them how many hours you actually work now.

I’m not claiming toil.

I would imagine everyone who consistently witnesses you starting late and finishing early is pleased with the new manager and the fact they have stood up to the big boss
Exactly that. Your attitude is not that of her person benefiting from some level of flexibility but someone self employed which you are not.

Wouldn't be great if we could all pick the hours that suit us, being paid more up to an hour more w day than work and then claim that these hours are made up weekly without any evidence that thus is the case.

Your expectations are ridiculous and I've heard of anyone benefiting of such an arrangement in the public sector.

It's up to you whether you do work during your holidays although this would be seriously questioned by occupational health.

Your boss's request is perfectly reasonable. If you don't agree, go ahead and look for another job. Good luck finding one that would agree to that.

To all those saying leave it for SLT and why would you need to do xyz have obviously never worked in the same role. I do have two other roles within the setting (not a school but similar)
in previous job I was used to tracking my hours and also had a lot to flexibility but it was encroaching on my out of hours time such as calls form team or clients late into the evening. Hence finding a new job. I had thought it was fixed hours so was surprised after I started to find out that it was the so called flexible working of 8.30-3.30.
when I said about recording my hours I was told it wasn’t necessary and it was all based on the knowledge that they knew that I would be working a lot of ‘overtime’ during the busy periods.
I have said multiple times that I don’t leave dead on 3.30 and I am usually here before 8.30. More often than not I am here past 4 but because of the so called goodwill and it suiting me I was not concerned. In fact more than happy as it gave me the flexibility to leave if I had finished a task etc.
I do have an email for the voluntary work but that just says don’t worry about it! I found it when searching through emails from a previous line manager.

I feel that because this new manager who is always late in but stays late and consistently making sure it’s known that he is working every evening at home and weekend that he feels we should all be as well.

I have already applied for a new job and will keep looking for new job and maybe I might even get more money elsewhere concentrating on my other roles that I am qualified for rather than the part of the role that I enjoy the most.

I feel that because this new manager who is always late in but stays late and consistently making sure it’s known that he is working every evening at home and weekend that he feels we should all be as well.

He's a manager you are not.

Unfortunately there are people who manage others who don't understand other people's body clocks and lives are different which they can use to their advantage.

I had a role where they wanted the flexibility on their side. They were pissed that two of us exercised in the morning so started work early. I should say they were pissed until a server went down at a major client and we were in the office to field the clients phone calls until the rest of the team strolled in two hours later....

Good luck with your job search.

I've worked in several schools and educational settings and there is no such concept as 'overtime'.

If you need to work extra hours, you do.

You don't rock up 30 minutes late every day and you don't go home an hour early. Regardless of what you're doing outside of school.

ACAS can give advice, but as others have said it's very hard to win a legal case.

If you've done similar roles in other settings then maybe you need to go back to more flexible settings as you don't sound very cut out for schools (neither am I, hence I don't work in them anymore).

The last school I worked in the Principal was actually monitoring staff arrival and leaving times via the swipe card thingy you had to show when you came in so he could put persistent latecomers on report like he did with the kids. He'd have fired you by now.

I'm not saying it's right. I'm just saying it's how it is.

If you were hit by a car tomorrow and needed extensive time off to recover with no ability to check your emails, what would happen? Would the school really let someone's future chances be ruined as you suggested earlier? How would your job be covered?

You are very important to the success of the school, I'm not saying you aren't, but you are NOT irreplaceable and recognising that will help you create a better work life balance. Answering emails on holiday and doing masses of overtime is doing no one any favours. For your own sake, implement tougher boundaries and stick to them

I agree, and certainly not for no doubt the absolute pittance she gets paid working in a school. It doesn't do anyone else any favours either, bad managers then expect more for less from everyone else. The more people are able to put their foot down, the better.

Agree with this. I’m not surprised your line manager wants to tighten up the arrangements a little.

I know you see it as a positive that you pick up emails on annual leave etc but from a business perspective I think it’s a negative. They should have processes in place to ensure work can be covered when someone is absent rather than being so reliant on a single individual.

Is your role something which could be done on a self-employed basis? It sounds like that style of work might suit you better.

You need to be usi by a time sheet to record your hours. Use the terms grace to do this.

its unfortunate that you will have to give up the volunteering for now but if the new manager is insistent that you work set hours then so be it.

i would however in your Acas draft email confirm that set hours have been issued to you and you will be complying with them. As for a written response as to who will cover the additional out of hours responses .

comply and then next time you go on holiday or one of these work peaks arrives put an out of office on and name the manager in question as the person to answer email star in the out of office you are totally unavailable and no response can be given.

you manger will soon change when they have more work.

If it was me, I'd make a case to continue bye current work pattern and take it to the big boss. If some of the flex is for the school run then you have a right to flexible working for caring reasons. It sounds like it isn't the kind of org to have a volunteering policy?

The other part of malicious compliance is to "ask for advice" whenever you "run out of work". If you are made to work longer days, I would get loads done Mon-Weds and then ask your manager what you should be doing Thurs and Fri. Sit in the office actively doing nothing. Ask anyone else in the office if they need some "help" with their work because it's not your busy time and you're at a loose end. Make it really clear you're sat there twiddling your thumbs rather than taking advantage of the flexi-time arrangements you previously had. If you're there for an extra hour every day and seem to be working during that time, everyone will assume this was work you were just not getting done before.

And then ask what arrangements will be for overtime/holiday cover/busy periods. Point out to your manager that you've been helping out with xyz tasks when you were relatively quiet, so will they be tasking other people to support with your work when you're busy. Malicious compliance as a 'team player' who just wants everyone to pull together...

(ETA: And look for another job, because this is not a fun way of working. If your manager doesn't cave after a few months, you'll be stuck.)

Lots of the advice on this thread is very toxic. If people I line managed behaved in such a passive aggressive way I wouldn’t be too happy with their performance. It sounds like you have core hours you are supposed to do and aren’t. It also sounds like there will s a small amount of work to complete outside these hours but required as part of your job. How many teachers do you know who don’t work outside their core teaching hours? Your job is the same.

I really wouldn't be doing this unless you're happy to be managed out the door. The most I'd do is stop working in the holidays and ask for a contact to send this stuff to.

Your DD is a big girl, she can get some studying done if she arrives early to school. It's not like she is in nursery and can't be left alone.

The volunteer thing is disappointing, but I think it's on the back of the other things.

Are you are new manager in an organisation who is trying to change a way of working?

Do the staff under you do timesheets?

@Reugny no and no. I just think if someone was arriving late and leaving early everyday and when pulled up on it started “working to rule” and refusing to do parts of their role I would not be happy with them.

If someone needs to consistently work beyond their hours to complete tasks, either they aren't being productive in their set hours or it is too much work for them. If it's too much work for them then you need another person to do the extra work, simple as that.

And if an employer requires you to be "flexible" = work extra hours then this goes both ways. You get to come in later or take extra leave in lieu of the hours.

If everyone stuck to that then we would not be in such a parlous state of low productivity and high workplace stress and sickness.

The problem is we don't have the OP's employment contract so we don't know what the specific duties of her job are, however her new manager should.

If the contract doesn't mention she is supposed to do things outside her working hours then she shouldn't. However she should also do her working hours as per her contract.

It's not toxic to work the hours you are paid for and directed to do.

It is toxic to jump straight to sacking someone if a change you make results in lower productivity.

That's just nonsense. There are loads of roles in schools that are fixed hours and build up time owed or require overtime at certain points in the year.

Just because you met shitty employers doesn't mean they all are.

I was given core hours. 8.30-3.30. I have now found an email that says this from the old head and line manager.
loads of you still saying I don’t work my hours and also that’s part of working in schools. I work as per my instructions and often stay past and come in earlier.
it’s never been tracked and no one’s hours are tracked. We don’t sign in and out.

as I’ve said I am often in at 8.19-8.15 depending on traffic. And often leave at gone 4. It’s just the option of being able to leave at 3.30 but no give for the extras that I work is being taken in to account.

I have actually got an interview for the job I applied for and will if offered it make sure I am much more specific about the timings of my working day and expectations for extra hours and flexibility before accepting. If I get the job obviously. It also a lot more money with room to move upwards whereas I am stuck in my current role and it’s no real scope to move up the ladder.