Competitive work culture

[gigipom]

Does anyone have advise?

I work for a very small company. Was one of the first employees. There have since been other hires, one who is extremely competitive. Always want to wants to be the best and stay the longest etc.

Shes online replying to messages and emails late at night, communicating with our manager (who is also online) on weekends. I do not work on weekends or late nights as I respect my time off as well as my colleagues.

I am slowly realising this person may trying to be outshine me. She is extremely competent, and frankly be better at her job than I am at mine.

how do I handle this? I’m starting to feel like I’m falling through the cracks and will not get any promotion etc. I’m also concerned she will end up being appointed as my manager.

If she's genuinely better at the job and prepared to work harder then I'm not sure there is much you can do unless you are equally willing to put the work in. Tbh It doesn't sound like a fun culture if thats what's expected.

If that's not what you want then you probably need to either accept your fate if she gets a promotion or think of moving on.

I’m just gutted that it takes working all hours to be even considered for a promotion. I think she’s better at her job because she puts more hours in so things get done faster. But that isn’t for me and whilst I am happy to put in the time when genuinely needed, I do not want to be logging on all weekend :(

I will also add I work in a creative industry. We’re not talking about saving lives here!

Ok - Do you actually want the promotion yourself or just not want her to have it?

What would it improve for you if you got it?

Is she younger than you OP? Although I was never competitive, in my younger years, at one job, I would stay late, come in early, check emails on the weekend etc. It was expected more than me trying to jump ahead though. It got the point when I realised my managers won't remember me missing that birthday party, that wedding, evening out etc etc- BUT, I will!

How old are you OP? Do you want the promotion? Do you enjoy your job? Personally, I'd do my normal hours and let this person carry on. They might burn out, they might get promoted, they might leave if not promoted. Who knows? I'd be keeping an eye out elsewhere though if you are really unhappy though.

Sometimes the people who work the longest hours are having to do it because they aren't that great and wouldn't be able to get their work done in time otherwise. If a job takes 8 hours, you might do 6 one day and 2 the next, and she might be doing it in one day but taking 9 hours. The other thing of course, is that if you work long hours, your bosses start especting it of you and take it for granted.

Don't be fooled into thinking she's better than you. Nobody is going to want their epitaph to be 'I wish I'd spent more time in the office'.

Sometimes you have to accept that someone is better at a particular job than you - that doesn't mean you wouldn't be better in other roles.

Re. the out of hours working, really it's personal choice. The culture won't change if everyone goes along with it. However, depending on type of job and, frankly, on how much you are being paid, it might be reasonable to work early/late on occasion.

I would absolutely love a promotion. I work so hard and really care about the business/people I work for/with. I think I do a great job, but I don’t work on evenings and weekends unless really needed.

As I say, the reason she is good at her job is because she’s always ‘on’. She’s tackled something before I have even had the chance to look at it because she’s working so much overtime.

Promotion comes with a title change which would be fabulous for my CV and a larger salary. I live in an extremely expensive city and any rise would be great. I also just do not want her to be my manager! We get on well and it would be a strange dynamic for me.

Sorry but I think chances are she is going to be promoted and she is going to be your manager and you’ll need to change tack. Getting upset about it won’t change things.

The truth is, everyone has different ways of working and whatever she is doing suits the leadership team more than whatever it is you’re doing. That’s not necessarily working after hours, that’s could be impressing them in other ways - being more efficient, more creative, getting things done that you seem to have barriers in place for, bringing something new and exciting etc.

So yes, to a certain extent she’s shown you up and you’ll need to think strategically about your next steps. Realistically you should have noticed months ago that perceptions of her began to change, and at that point started to do things differently. If back then, you queried the working outside of hours thing, it may have been nipped in the bud before she had the chance to shine. Or maybe you could have wowed them in other ways and not fallen flat.

promotions don’t have to be offered out equally; it doesn’t matter what your cost of living is or how fabulous something is on your CV. She’s put the work in for them to think she may excel with more responsibility

Also time served does not make you more deserving of a promotion

reading between the lines, she might be younger than you? Is that why she being your manager would make you feel it’s a strange dynamic?

I suspect the answer will either be, up your game and outshine her, or side step to another job to avoid her.

Outshining her doesnt have to mean working outside office hours. If you do a brilliant job in working hours and add value in other ways (people management, cultivating positive culture, improving team work rates etc)

For context, I'm the other side of this. The place I work pays better than my last job. I took what I thought was a side step (same job title, similar salary) to a better place. When I got there, quickly realised I'd infact taken a job with less responsibility and in my last job (even though job title and salary were the same). At my last job I was doing the role of my now manager, and doing it very well. It was quickly evident to everyone that I could do my managers job to a much higher standard, more effectively and alround better than she could. It's awkward, I know she feels professionally threatened by me. I suspect she'll leave soonish. I'm not privy to HR, but I think she's been put under capability procedures.

I've been in the exact same situation and in a creative industry too - advertising, if you're interested. One woman with the same job title as me was constantly pitting herslef against me, with eyes in what I was doing so that she could match it. If I worked on a pitch? She'd demand to be on the next one. I started managing a junior and then all of a sudden, she'd requested to co-manage the poor bloke without ever speaking to me!!

It drove me mad, especially because I didn't feel the need to be in a daily competition - but she sort of gave me no choice!!

In the end, we both got promoted at exactly the same time. Except I made wonderful friendships that I still have today, and she drove everyone NUTS and most people avoided her - and still do, as far as I hear.

My suggestion? Forge your own path. Speak to your manager about promotion on your own terms - what do YOU need to do? What targets can they set YOU? Is there an opportunity on the horizon? How can you create a path to get there? When you have your own clear set promotion pathway, you won't have to give a shit about their shenanigans.

Thanks all.

My frustrations are that we seem to work equally as hard during our working hours. It’s just that she seems to get shit done faster as she works during the weekend and evenings.. sometimes there will be a message that is directed at me on a group email over the weekend and she’ll reply straight away rather than waiting for me to on Monday Monday morning. And as I say, none of this is urgent. Just feels like she’s stepping on my toes and not giving me the chance to get my work done.

She’s worked with my bosses before for years at a previous company. I was brought into our current company being sold that I was able to progress and really change things. She joined around 4 months after me, and since then the dynamic has really changed.

That doesn't sound competitive to me. She just has a different working style. I do some work on evenings and weekends and so do some of my team since it fits our lifestyles.

Just focus on your own work.

In my opinion people who work outside their normal working hours are the least organised. They can’t prioritise what needs to be done ahead of all the other “fluff” that’s nice to do in work.

If you can’t get your work done in the time allocated you’re doing something wrong. Does your manager appreciate being contacted outside of working hours? I certainly wouldn’t and I’d be having strong conversations about it too. Let her crack on id say, make sure you keep evidence of everything that could help you get a promotion and do stuff that produces actual tangible results.

Well. She's created a rod for a her back. There was an article about someone working to much in the Guardian Opinion this week.

She has no work life balance. Working all hours and is putting huge expectations on herself that people will come to expect.

Eventually leading to burn out and mental health issues.

After 12 years working for myself. It seems that the modern workplace thrives on giving people the job of at least 2 people in some company cultures.

Heard a saying....

You are replaceable at work. But not at home.

I am focused on my own work - that is why this is upsetting me. I work hard and I really care. The issue is, she doesn’t give me a chance to complete some of my own tasks because she steps in outside of working hours to do them rather than waiting for me to do them on the Monday or the next day. We work in the same realm but on different work streams so she really shouldn’t be answering for me, if that makes sense.

I just don’t think it’s fair. I wouldn’t step on people’s toes like that!

aside from all this she is a nice person and we get on well.

Have you explicitly asked her not to do tasks directed for you?

No, I haven’t. I wouldn’t feel good saying that. I just know she’d get upset

You need to tell her clearly. You can't expect her to know it bothers you otherwise.

She might think she's being helpful.

If I was your college I'd assume you'd be grateful I'd taken a small task off you (by answering the email) so that you cam focus on your other (important) workload.

I'd likely feel shocked to know you were offended by it. Maybe your college has an attitude similar to mine? You can't know if you don't talk to her.

It sounds in general that your coworker is more assertive. Again, that's not really a competitive thing.

You do need to communicate clearly though. It will hold you back in general otherwise. Also being passive.

You need to stop her taking over your work. How is she being able to do this?

But you definitely need to talk to her about that - unless, of course, by taking them over she's meeting deadlines that you would be missing? (It doesn't sound like that, but thought I'd better ask)

How much out of hours work seems to be expected in the company? I think it's brilliant that you're managing your own time so you don't have to do this - BUT if it's a cultural expectation then she will be regarded more favourably than you.

As above. Find a way to ask her not to answer emails or tasks assigned to you.

I think you need some clarity from your boss about expectations and boundaries. If there is no operational need or expectation for you to answer emails outside of working hours then I would ask that this person stops interfering with your work. If anything it will set a precedent where clients will come to expect a service that you do not officially offer. If someone want to work late to complete their own work that is up to them but doing unnecessary hours to hoover up the work of others is just wrong.