Work requires expensive tailored clothes

[PriscillaPartridge]

I work at a very traditional law firm. I earn very little compared to the partners who impose this policy. Work clothes must be of good quality fabrics and preferably fitted by a tailor/adjusted to fit. I asked if M&S was ok, but was directed to more suitable brands such… some places are £300 a skirt. Any ideas on where to shop for expensive looking but not big ££ clothes?

Overheads are not chargeable to clients, by definition.

Fair points, at this moment in time I'm stuck on the methods of how it could be legally including unless it's with the clients permission, but then I'd need to know if that is legally possible. Overall I'll do some research to refine my perspectives and understanding.

At one point early on, a boss told me I had to replace my Ford Focus as it wasn't an appropriate car in which to be seen arriving at a client's office. And he was right, it wasn't.

Oh get over yourself! Why on earth do people put up with this shit? That boss would have seen me walking out the door - unless of course he was going to provide and pay for the new car.

The lawyer could not expense clothing without providing a receipt for the expenditure which is necessary for audit purposes and to ensure that the payment to the lawyer is appropriately taxed. There isn’t a chance in hell that any reputable firm would use “word salad” to pass that expense on to the client under false pretences with that paper trail in place.

Honestly I do think some people on this thread have watched way too many episodes of Suits and The Good Wife because a lot of what’s being described about required dress codes, cars and expensing comes straight out of US drama not the reality of working in even a high end U.K. legal firm. Speaking as someone who has spent their entire career advising high profile and high net worth individuals when in private practice and now instructs magic circle and silver circle firms as a client and been in and out of court regularly

Just to add also that very few of the magic circle firms are situated on prime retail estate and it takes most of us some time to try on and choose a well fitting suit and blouse combo. Added to which clothing shops in London don’t routinely open before 10.00 am

So is the story here that a junior associate is able to disappear from her desk for a minimum of a couple of hours in the middle of the morning and swan back into the office carrying her bags from a designer retailer 😂😂. Because that didn’t happen either.

I'm surprised at all the people saying things like "how will they know where your clothes are from"

I'm not. How many people would really be able to tell the difference?

I'm not sure I would.

Exactly this.

I work for one of the large international City firms and moved around between several firms over the years. I have never ever heard of this. In fact, the women in particular dress very casually.

Your firm sounds ridiculous.

Sounds like an awful place and I would be looking to leave. In the meantime, find a town near you that is very posh and go to the local charity shops. Where I used to live there was a village called Woodstock which was poshest of the posh and their charity shops were amazing. I got a gucci handbag there once for 30.

Similar here, actually. Private practice based in Switzerland, good mix of international and local clients. We are however very specialised.

we are pretty casual. Jeans and T-shirt casual.

I do keep a blazer and shirt in my office just in case / for surprise court appearances. But that has honestly never happened to me or most of colleagues.

it was a little more formal when I worked in a family and inheritance law focused firm.l Still wore jeans most days. But with blouses, button ups, casual blazers etc. instead of T-shirts and jumpers.

I have worked in both traditional and corporate law firms for nearly 20 years and never been told where to buy clothes. It's ridiculous!

M and S is perfectly fine, as is next. I would just buy a couple of neutral suits and tops to co ordinate with them.

I'd also be looking for a new job tbh

I’m in the back of a cab driving through the City on my way to a meeting with a silver circle firm and looking at what all the commuters are wearing. Haven’t spotted any Savile Row suits or mother of pearl buttons yet. Maybe my eye isn’t in though 😂😂

I work in HR and what they are asking is really not acceptable. M&S do great work clothes.

I’d have a look at LK Bennett and Hobbs in Vinted. They both do really nice dresses.

Just come out of my meeting which was attended by 3 male and 3 female partners and a couple of associates.

Only one male (partner) was wearing a suit and definitely not Savile Row. I’d say it was Paul Smith or similar level. The other two men, one was in cords with a dress shirt and the other in chinos with a more casual shirt.

Of the female partners, one was wearing a very nice sharply tailored suit - maybe Helmut Lang or similar price point. One was wearing quite a dated dress and jacket - I’d say Debenhams or similar and several seasons ago. The third was wearing a maxi skirt and top - probably Monsoon level.

Juniors were unexceptionally dressed.

No Alicia Florick or Jessica Pearson style working outfits to be seen. All the partners would be taking home 7 figure salaries/drawings easily and this was a high profile meeting attended by very senior people on the client side.

I worked at a couture house and was meeting rich clients. They asked me to wear more expensive, smart clothes. I said I couldn't afford it, they knew I wasn't lying!! Anyway, they gave me some money for clothes and small salary increase.

go round the good as new shops. stupid to expect you to spend that sort of money. as long as you are neat, tidy and profesional looking thats all you need to do

This. If they require you to spend that much on clothes they need to pay you accordingly.

Try Wyse. I’m surprised at this work policy. Even magic circle law firms don’t insist on this any more

There are some lovely pieces on the Wyse website but nothing at all which meets the brief of “traditional law firm” as articulated by the OP.

If she’s been told she is required to buy £300 skirts, she won’t get away with designer trackies or slouch trousers and oversize jackets 😀

This. Since COVID I wear jeans to work! My husband is a solicitor in my office and he wears jeans as well, unless there is a meeting/event he needs to look smart for.

Thrift online.
Charity shops.

Just wear m&s. They really won't know.
If they do ask them how much clothing allowance you will be receiving?

In many cases you're right. Personally I don't usually care either, within reason*, certainly if it's back-office work.

But it'd be nuts to say presentation isn't important. In our line of work we often acted as representatives of our clients to their clients, shareholders, regulators, government agencies, and the general public, with literally billions of pounds (and sometimes the existence of the client company) at stake. It wasn't uncommon to have to drop everything with no notice and go straight from our office to deal with some crisis for them, and when you rock up to smooth out a situation with panicked clients and difficult stakeholders it's genuinely important to give an impression that's absolutely professional, collected, and in control - and like it or not appearance plays a big role in that.

More generally, your appearance at work signals your attitude to work. You can say it shouldn't as much as you like, but it just does. In a profession where diligence, quality and attention to detail are super important, if you don't appear to care about or take pride in your personal organisation, presentation, health, etc., that isn't going to give your colleagues or clients a good feeling about relying on your work.

• I do have some horror stories, and at one point eventually had to fire someone because of their refusal to address appalling presentation / personal hygiene issues that meant we just couldn't put them in any kind of client environment, even back-office.

In a lot of lines of work, your appearance is part of your marketing. Your personal opinion doesn't change that.

Rock up in a Ferrari, your client will think they're paying you too much.
Rock up in a ageing Focus, they will wonder whether you're successful/quality enough to be worth what they're paying you.
Rock up in a bland, professional 3 series, or Passat or A4, they won't think anything at all. This is what you're aiming for.

That's really interesting. Thanks for the comment, and to the others who continued the discussion.

I don't see why it would be fraudulent expenses, so long as it's not presented as something else (in which case it'd certainly be fraud). If my client is content to pay for my work clothes on expenses then I don't see why there would be anything legally wrong with doing so. I've certainly expensed much more controversial things than that (with full client knowledge & approval).

Anyway, the backstory was this: the lady in question was trying to move home, was looking for a flat to buy in Kensington/Chelsea, and had viewed and rejected lots of places. Chatting over lunch, I asked how come she was finding it so difficult to find somewhere and she said because none of the places had a large enough walk-in wardrobe for all her clothes. I laughed and asked how many clothes she had, to which she replied some ridiculous number of suits and gave me the explanation above as to where they all came from. Maybe she was lying, but I can't think why she would do so.

If it was given as an example on your training, that suggests that it's probably something people actually did, at least sometimes. Maybe she was just part of a culture where it was seen as acceptable to do that at the time.

That's kind of my point. He was paying me more than enough to expect me to have a more suitable car for work. He was also providing a company car scheme, which I was taking as an allowance of about £300 a month and using my old Focus for work. I don't think he was out of order expecting me to make more of an effort.